Can we talk about finesse Casting rigs? 2024
Further North reply :
I snagged a good deal on a St. Croix Rage that throws light baits very well (1/8 oz - 5/16 oz.) - between the sale price and points on my card, it was less than $70. While I may replace it at some point, it will do for now...until I find another that works better. 
I bought an Cabela's Arachnid with it (Really a Daiwa Tatula-R with a couple extra bearings and a pretty blue spool)...and while that works, I'm guessing there's other reels that might work better...and I have a custom rod on order that the Arachnid will work great on...
...so I'm looking at reels that'll work well for light lures/baits.
So far, the Abu Garcia LTX has attracted some attention, as have the Daiwa SV reels...am I missing any that are perhaps less expensive? I'm not opposed to spending money if I have to to get great results, but I'm also not going to do it if I don't have to.
0119 reply :
I do a lot of light and ultra light baitcasting for bass, tarpon and snook. How light are you talking about doing? What type line and test are you thinking about? What kind of lures? I throw 1/8th and 3/16th pins minnows at baby tarpon on 2 and 4# mono. Are you talking about that much of an extreme? The LTX has a lot of aftermarket spools and such to finesse it up a bit more if your willing to pay for it. The SV I have no knowledge of.
Further North reply :
I'm in NW WI, so no baby tarpon...I'd probably go to a light braid rather than a low breaking strength mono or fluoro...something like a 10 lb Suffix, or if the Gliss I have spooled on one of spinning reels works out, possibly that.
What I'd like to be able to throw would be light weight lures like floating Rapalas, Ned rigs, weightless plastics, maybe drop shot (if I can get passed being bored). I do all of this on a spinning rod now, and while that's OK, I'd like to do it on a casting rig to free up the spinning rod for other duties.
Poolshark reply :
The rod is important, but for what you are asking for, I really think the lews tourny pro has an exceptional knack for tossing the light stuff. Otherwise I've used 50 sized curados and was happy with them.
Fishin' Fool reply :
Just curious why do you want to finesse fish on casting rigs? I'm from SE Michigan and I've really resisted adding casting rods to my arsenal for the longest time. I finally did but those will be my crankbait, spinnerbait, jerkbait, chatterbait rods. I couldn't imagine wanting to throw senkos or small finesse crankbaits on baitcast gear. For the size fish we have up north I don't think it makes sense.
PitchinJigz reply :
On 4/3/2016 at 3:18 AM, Fishin' Fool said:Just curious why do you want to finesse fish on casting rigs? I'm from SE Michigan and I've really resisted adding casting rods to my arsenal for the longest time. I finally did but those will be my crankbait, spinnerbait, jerkbait, chatterbait rods. I couldn't imagine wanting to throw senkos or small finesse crankbaits on baitcast gear. For the size fish we have up north I don't think it makes sense.
It has nothing to do with the size fish. Some people are just more comfortable using finesse casting setups than spinning combos.
James Pondscum reply :
I have a ltb ml rod and a abu ltx reel for about two years now. I have used other reels on that rod but the ltx makes a major difference. Other reels used are a team lews light and a bps carbon lite on this rod. I throw 1/8 and some lighter just as far on this as my ml spinning rod. Last year I used it trout fishing as my arm was giving out on my spinning set. I was somewhat apprehensive on the purchase of this reel but it made a difference in casting lower weight projectiles On most of my reels the brakes are set quite low but on this start very high and back off. I use eight lbs coply line. The spool is very shallow so small line and small amounts.
0119 reply :
On 4/3/2016 at 3:18 AM, Fishin' Fool said:Just curious why do you want to finesse fish on casting rigs?
I for one don't see spinning gear as long term equipment. My casting reels are heirloom quality that I will hand down to my grandkid. I find spinning gear uncomfortable to use, hate the twist and won't use braids.
new2BC4bass reply :
I don't know much about the newer reels. The Daiwa SS Air casts down to 1/16 oz. Possibly the Curado 70 may be similar to the Daiwa SV105 in its ability to cast a wide range of lures well from about 1/8 oz.
Now if you don't mind used there are several other options. Any Pixy or PX Type R or TD-Z 105H will do 1/8 oz. in the right hands...which so far aren't mine although I can do well with a 1/8 oz. spinnerbait on my PXL and #5 Shad Raps on all of them. Any 50 size Shimano. My older gold colored Carbonlites throw 3/16 oz. Shad Raps quite well. An older Prolite should do 1/8 oz.
I have also thrown 3/16 oz. crankbaits with my Helios Air and did it on a rod rated from 3/8 - 3/4 oz. and lots of thumb. That unmentionable company is said to do quite well with lighter baits. Just not sure how light. Love my Primmus, but haven't tried anything that light with it yet, but feel it probably will do at least down to 3/16 oz. It is such a nice casting reel. I honestly think my old Black Max 1600C will do 3/16 oz.
I think a lot of reels will handle 3/16 oz. It is when you go to 1/8 oz. that the reel becomes more critical.
Fishin' Fool reply :
On 4/3/2016 at 3:48 AM, 119 said:I for one don't see spinning gear as long term equipment. My casting reels are heirloom quality that I will hand down to my grandkid. I find spinning gear uncomfortable to use, hate the twist and won't use braids.
Interesting to hear your perspective. I've been fishing spinning gear my whole life so casting gear is clumsy to me. When I was fishing alot I could be 50 feet off the edges of the lilly pads and put a cast within inches of the pads. I'd almost always know when to expect a bite. I guess up north with the clearer water long casts reign supreme.
Jeff H reply :
I have Daiwa Alphas Type F, Daiwa Presso, Daiwa TD-Z 105H, ABU Garcia LTX and the old original finesse ultra light Daiwa Procaster Mini PM100 that I've used for finesse duty. All these reels have some level of upgrades done to them, I think all have ceramic hybrid spool bearings, either abec 5 or 7.
Which one is best performer? Honestly....in my own opinion, even though I'm a Daiwa guy, that LTX impresses me most so far. That old Procaster is incredible. Very close to being casting champ of the group if I could just control that spool a little better.
I don't like to give this reel any credit (because I don't think it's built to last) but the Pinnacle Producer LTE I have is doing a pretty darn good job of throwing light stuff with 6 lb mono on it. Not true 1/8 oz, but I was throwing 1/16 and 1/8 oz wacky jig w/4" finesse worms a respectable distance with a M/F rod.
While all this is fun, if you can stand to use spinning gear it will ALWAYS be the cheaper and just as effective route. I have more money tied up into this "fun" venture than I like to admit. It's fun and addicting and then it gets quite expensive. If you have the slush funds, I recommend it, if you don't....back away now!
rippin-lips reply :
On 4/3/2016 at 3:18 AM, Fishin' Fool said:Just curious why do you want to finesse fish on casting rigs? I'm from SE Michigan and I've really resisted adding casting rods to my arsenal for the longest time. I finally did but those will be my crankbait, spinnerbait, jerkbait, chatterbait rods. I couldn't imagine wanting to throw senkos or small finesse crankbaits on baitcast gear. For the size fish we have up north I don't think it makes sense.
A 5" senko weighs 3/8oz without a hook. Plenty heavy for a medium casting rod. Now a 3" senko you'd wanna have a light or possibly medium light rod. Finesse tackle on light line and light rods is just more fun. I don't touch a spinning rod unless I'm using a drop shot. I avoid that technique if I can so I don't have to use it.
On 4/3/2016 at 2:25 AM, Further North said:I'm in NW WI, so no baby tarpon...I'd probably go to a light braid rather than a low breaking strength mono or fluoro...something like a 10 lb Suffix, or if the Gliss I have spooled on one of spinning reels works out, possibly that.
What I'd like to be able to throw would be light weight lures like floating Rapalas, Ned rigs, weightless plastics, maybe drop shot (if I can get passed being bored). I do all of this on a spinning rod now, and while that's OK, I'd like to do it on a casting rig to free up the spinning rod for other duties.
The lighter the spool the better it will perform with light baits. You just have to figure out what you want to throw weighs. I have a px68 on my ML rod and a tdz 103 with finesse spool on my L rod.
Not my catch but buzzedbait caught this the other day on a wacky senko using his ML rod and a curado 51e with yumeya finesse spool.
cottny27 reply :
On 4/3/2016 at 3:18 AM, Fishin' Fool said:Just curious why do you want to finesse fish on casting rigs? I'm from SE Michigan and I've really resisted adding casting rods to my arsenal for the longest time. I finally did but those will be my crankbait, spinnerbait, jerkbait, chatterbait rods. I couldn't imagine wanting to throw senkos or small finesse crankbaits on baitcast gear. For the size fish we have up north I don't think it makes sense.
It's the new thing I guess to put 6# line on casting gear. Senkos cast like bullets and are 3/8oz in the 5". No finesse needed for them.
hzzhangc reply :
If you can find a DIY BFS spool for tatula it will turn your current reel to a BFS machine.
Mosster47 reply :
I have two finesse casting rigs. I throw Senkos on a Lamiglas "Senko Special" which is an incredible rod if you can get your hands on one with whatever Browning's higest end baitcast model is with 20lb Spiderwire high-vis.
The second is a Phenix UMBX 707ML that I use for jig rigs and I fish jig rigs all year. It has a Lew's Tourney Lite his it and I run 30lb PP.
These are fairly high end setups but nothing crazy. Use what you have for a season and make a pros & cons list at the end of the year. Then see if there is something out there that you think will improve your success.
Further North reply :
On 4/3/2016 at 3:18 AM, Fishin' Fool said:Just curious why do you want to finesse fish on casting rigs? I'm from SE Michigan and I've really resisted adding casting rods to my arsenal for the longest time. I finally did but those will be my crankbait, spinnerbait, jerkbait, chatterbait rods. I couldn't imagine wanting to throw senkos or small finesse crankbaits on baitcast gear. For the size fish we have up north I don't think it makes sense.
A few reasons:
- I like to push myself, to learn new things to get better...I'm never going to need to make a 100 foot cast with a fly rod where I fish...but I practice it anyway because it makes me better...I'm going to make myself learn to skip with a bait caster this season as well.
- I'm more accurate with a bait-caster than a spinning rod, and I feel like I have more control over the situation with one as well.
- I like to throw small in-line spinners at times and I'd like to be able to do that with more accuracy. Putting one in a hole in some lilly pads just works sometimes...
- ...same with Rapala type lures. I've come up against limits in what a spinning rod can do and I feel like I can do better.
...if I think of more, I'll add 'em.
On 4/3/2016 at 3:34 AM, nickles said:I have a ltb ml rod and a abu ltx reel for about two years now. I have used other reels on that rod but the ltx makes a major difference. Other reels used are a team lews light and a bps carbon lite on this rod. I throw 1/8 and some lighter just as far on this as my ml spinning rod. Last year I used it trout fishing as my arm was giving out on my spinning set. I was somewhat apprehensive on the purchase of this reel but it made a difference in casting lower weight projectiles On most of my reels the brakes are set quite low but on this start very high and back off. I use eight lbs coply line. The spool is very shallow so small line and small amounts.
Thanks. Trout are in my picture too - though it's mostly tossing flies...but there are days I know I could get under, around, inside hard hunks of cover better with a casting rod.
0119 reply :
On 4/3/2016 at 5:07 AM, cottny27 said:It's the new thing I guess to put 6# line on casting gear.
I don't know Ive been doing it for 20 years with 6# and lower. Kokonee fishermen have done it for much longer than that. In Japan they use old Ambassadeurs to catch tiny trout in mountain streams. I wish I had gotten a few Calcutta 50's before shimano deemed them obsolete.
Further North reply :
On 4/3/2016 at 5:08 AM, hzzhangc said:If you can find a DIY BFS spool for tatula it will turn your current reel to a BFS machine.
Any idea on a source? I'd have no idea where to even start looking.
Maico1 reply :
On 4/3/2016 at 5:57 AM, Further North said:Any idea on a source? I'd have no idea where to even start looking.
Not sure I would go there , I saw on another site a dude had 5 of them and 2 are already coming apart at the seams....
rippin-lips reply :
On 4/3/2016 at 5:07 AM, cottny27 said:It's the new thing I guess to put 6# line on casting gear. Senkos cast like bullets and are 3/8oz in the 5". No finesse needed for them.
Not new at all. They've been doing it for years. A 5" senko is not what alot would consider finesse. Now a 3" senko or flick shake is more like it.
Maico1 reply :
Take a look at the 2105 Aldebaran BFS HG Limited and the 2016 Aldebaran BFS HG....
Further North reply :
On 4/3/2016 at 6:06 AM, Maico1 said:Take a look at the 2105 Aldebaran BFS HG Limited and the 2016 Aldebaran BFS HG....here is pic of the Limited....
http://i1116.photobucket.com/albums/k569/Maico346/image_zpsd0qhhgcf.jpeg[/IMG]
Thanks.
HeavyTwenty reply :
Just curious, can people cast a 5" senko the same distance on a MF baitcaster as a MF spinner? I've always assumed with a weightless senko, the baitcaster would be 20% shorter range, but my experience with baitcasters is limited to MH and H.
Further North reply :
On 4/3/2016 at 6:18 AM, HeavyTwenty said:Just curious, can people cast a 5" senko the same distance on a MF baitcaster as a MF spinner? I've always assumed with a weightless senko, the baitcaster would be 20% shorter range, but my experience with baitcasters is limited to MH and H.
Not sure...but often I'd rather sacrifice distance to accuracy.
Mosster47 reply :
On 4/3/2016 at 5:54 AM, 119 said:I don't know Ive been doing it for 20 years with 6# and lower. Kokonee fishermen have done it for much longer than that. In Japan they use old Ambassadeurs to catch tiny trout in mountain streams. I wish I had gotten a few Calcutta 50's before shimano deemed them obsolete.
We use 4lb on tiny vintage Ryobi V-Mag baitcasters for kokanee. They have a "V" spool that holds a tremendous amount of line for their size.
Poolshark reply :
On 4/3/2016 at 6:18 AM, HeavyTwenty said:Just curious, can people cast a 5" senko the same distance on a MF baitcaster as a MF spinner? I've always assumed with a weightless senko, the baitcaster would be 20% shorter range, but my experience with baitcasters is limited to MH and H.
I have no issues casting them on a medium fast casting rod as far my spinning setup would cast them. in all honesty though, I'm usually trying to cast them accurately and quietly rather than bomb them as far as I can.
Fishin' Fool reply :
On 4/3/2016 at 7:40 AM, Poolshark said:I have no issues casting them on a medium fast casting rod as far my spinning setup would cast them. in all honesty though, I'm usually trying to cast them accurately and quietly rather than bomb them as far as I can.
That's why you have to use a spinning setup I guess it's all what we're accustomed to. If I tried to accurately cast a baitcaster I'd end up stuck in the tree or with a bird's nest. Easy for me to just chuck and wind them on St Clair where there are no targets within a 360 radius.
Poolshark reply :
On 4/3/2016 at 8:01 AM, Fishin' Fool said:That's why you have to use a spinning setup
It is all about what you are accustomed to. Bait casting gear is a lot of fun for me. But you have to use what works for you and most importantly, CATCH FISH. For me, it is natural to thumb the spool and pitch baits into pockets nice and gently. You can do the same with spinning gear, but Baitcasting gear is more fluid to me.
0119 reply :
On 4/3/2016 at 6:18 AM, HeavyTwenty said:Just curious, can people cast a 5" senko the same distance on a MF baitcaster as a MF spinner?
Absolutely. A 5" senko with hook is 3/8oz. If you have difficulty doing so I'd say more practice is need or you need to check you reel and see what is holding it up from having a better freespool.
new2BC4bass reply :
On 4/3/2016 at 6:18 AM, HeavyTwenty said:Just curious, can people cast a 5" senko the same distance on a MF baitcaster as a MF spinner? I've always assumed with a weightless senko, the baitcaster would be 20% shorter range, but my experience with baitcasters is limited to MH and H.
A brother-in-law and I fish 10" ribbontail worms on unweighted hooks whenever I visit him in Florida. He uses a 5/0 EWG while I often use a 3/0 EWG. He thinks baitcasters out distance a spinning reel. I think I throw harder than he does. 
EDIT: He only uses spinning gear.
Further North reply :
On 4/3/2016 at 7:40 AM, Poolshark said:I have no issues casting them on a medium fast casting rod as far my spinning setup would cast them. in all honesty though, I'm usually trying to cast them accurately and quietly rather than bomb them as far as I can.
Emphasis mine - that's exactly what I'm trying to accomplish, thanks for doing a better job of communicating it.
EllisJuan reply :
My '13 Metanium with Avail shallow spool casts as light as you would want.
Jeff H reply :
On 4/3/2016 at 6:03 AM, rippin-lips said:Not new at all. They've been doing it for years. A 5" senko is not what alot would consider finesse. Now a 3" senko or flick shake is more like it.
Definitely not new. My PM-100 dates back to 1982 I think. I don't know of an earlier model (factory designated) ultralight casting reel but that one takes us back 34 years in the finesse caster game. There was also a mini Millionaire (round version) from around the same time, could even be older yet??
Raul reply :
I have this ( actually I have 3 ) :
and before them I had this:
paired to a GLoomis CR721 or 722, 6-8 lbs Trilene XT or Yozuri Hybrid 6 lbs test.
ranger7717 reply :
i'm like fishing fool.... i am much more accurate and can cast farther with my spinning gear .... i have 2 bait casters , a lews bb1 and a bb1 pro , which are also my only braids and they only see heavy lures and heavy cover ...i can do anything with spinning gear with any lure and my heaviest line is 10 # on one set up out of 10 that i use for rougher terrain ...
rippin-lips reply :
^^^ that means put the spinning rod down and use your casting gear more. That's how you gain accuracy by practice.
Edited by rippin-lipsEdited for members lacking sense of humor
Delaware Valley Tackle reply :
A Super Tuned 50e Shimano is probably the most cost effective venture into finesse bait casting. Otherwise prepare to open up the wallet .
Fishin' Fool reply :
On 4/3/2016 at 11:25 AM, rippin-lips said:^^^ that means put the sissy stick down and use your casting gear more. That's how you gain accuracy by practice.
That 21.5 pounds of smallies in my profile picture, all on sissy stick. Just sayin....
desmobob reply :
On 4/3/2016 at 2:09 AM, Further North said:...so I'm looking at reels that'll work well for light lures/baits.
So far, the Abu Garcia LTX has attracted some attention, as have the Daiwa SV reels...am I missing any that are perhaps less expensive? I'm not opposed to spending money if I have to to get great results, but I'm also not going to do it if I don't have to.
My initial entry into the finesse baitcasting game was with a Daiwa PXL-R. Even at a great sale price it was expensive, but I forgot all about how much it cost when I got it in my hands. It is a wonderful reel! I recently bought a Daiwa JDM Alphas SV105 and I'm really not all that impressed with it so far. I just installed some new Hawgtech spool bearings in it this morning but didn't get a chance to get out on the water today.
In my very limited experience with BFS reels, I find it seems you either have to be willing to shell out some decent money or mess around with aftermarket spools (which can also be pricey). At any rate, I think it's a whole lot of fun to be able to cast light lures on bait casting gear and my Daiwa PXL-R/Major Craft Volkey combo gets used on every fishing trip.
Tight lines,
Bob
kcdinkerz reply :
had an extra chronarch 51e laying around so i upgraded it with better bearings and threw a honeycomb spool on it,12 pound fluro. the rod i use is a 6'9 ml volkely bfs rod rated for 1/16 to 3/8 oz, it handles a 1/16 ounce mushroom jig head with a trd on it very well, bought an even lighter bfs rod but havent tried it yet. i bet if i went down to smaller line i could get a little more distance but 12 pound was what i had at the time and the distance is good enough for me.
ranger7717 reply :
On 4/3/2016 at 11:25 AM, rippin-lips said:^^^ that means put the sissy stick down and use your casting gear more. That's how you gain accuracy by practice.
really ? what a super studly manly thing to say .....i have no desire to become such a super macho man like you by becoming a masterbaitcaster ....i'll stick to being the little ***** i am just because i catch tons of big bass with a sissy stick ....you must be like the king of your own jungle ....bet you drive a really big truck too
EllisJuan reply :
I am not going to call a spinning rig a "sissy stick", but I will say that every time I whip out my Met/NRX a new hair sprouts on my chest and my junk hangs a little lower.
new2BC4bass reply :
On 4/3/2016 at 12:15 PM, desmobob said:My initial entry into the finesse baitcasting game was with a Daiwa PXL-R. Even at a great sale price it was expensive, but I forgot all about how much it cost when I got it in my hands. It is a wonderful reel! I recently bought a Daiwa JDM Alphas SV105 and I'm really not all that impressed with it so far. I just installed some new Hawgtech spool bearings in it this morning but didn't get a chance to get out on the water today.
In my very limited experience with BFS reels, I find it seems you either have to be willing to shell out some decent money or mess around with aftermarket spools (which can also be pricey). At any rate, I think it's a whole lot of fun to be able to cast light lures on bait casting gear and my Daiwa PXL-R/Major Craft Volkey combo gets used on every fishing trip.
Tight lines,
Bob
Not exactly in the same boat as you. I used TD-Z 105H, Curado 51E, Alphas ito Ai, Sol and older Carbonlite to get down to 3/16 oz. However, I feel exactly like you in regards to my PXL Type R and Alphas SV105. I also got my PX on closeout, and it still is the most I have ever paid for a reel.
On 4/3/2016 at 1:26 PM, ranger7717 said:really ? what a super studly manly thing to say .....i have no desire to become such a super macho man like you by becoming a masterbaitcaster ....i'll stick to being the little ***** i am just because i catch tons of big bass with a sissy stick ....you must be like the king of your own jungle ....bet you drive a really big truck too
It is possible the remark was made with tongue in cheek. Besides....no need to get aggravated. It will only raise your blood pressure. 
I have 6 or 7 spinning outfits that almost never get used simply because I prefer baitcast reels. I used spinning gear exclusively for the first 57 years. Caught a lot more fish back then, too. (Different area of the country.) There are others here that still fish only with a spinning reel and do just fine, thank you very much. Fish what you like, but I poke a little fun once in awhile too. Hopefully others realize it is just in fun.
cottny27 reply :
On 4/3/2016 at 1:26 PM, ranger7717 said:really ? what a super studly manly thing to say .....i have no desire to become such a super macho man like you by becoming a masterbaitcaster ....i'll stick to being the little ***** i am just because i catch tons of big bass with a sissy stick ....you must be like the king of your own jungle ....bet you drive a really big truck too
Ranger, take it with a grain of salt. These dudes spend big money to accent their reels with purples and pinks. Their man card has been taken away ?
Tim Kelly reply :
I've dabbled with a few finesse casting options. My best, easiest and most ridiculously easy to fish down to 1/16 id an old ABU morrum SX3601 with an avail spool. It's really hard to backlash and with 6-8lb mono it works exceptionally well. The right rod is crucial for throwing light baits with casting gear, and a more moderate action rod will do better than a faster actioned one too.
Mainly use spinning gear for the light stuff, but sometimes it's nice to get the casting gear going. More fun somehow, though the fish don't care.
Fishin' Fool reply :
On 4/3/2016 at 1:26 PM, ranger7717 said:really ? what a super studly manly thing to say .....i have no desire to become such a super macho man like you by becoming a masterbaitcaster ....i'll stick to being the little ***** i am just because i catch tons of big bass with a sissy stick ....you must be like the king of your own jungle ....bet you drive a really big truck too
I don't think he meant it to come across so insulting. I think it was in good fun and I took it that way. That's one thing about written words not always easy to understand when people are kidding around.
Maico1 reply :
In all reality having used a spinning reel chasing trout in the ultra light world and using bait casters in the world of chasing bass you end up mastering both. So to me it all comes down to which one you prefer and enjoy using because at the end of the day you will catch fish with either setup....
rippin-lips reply :
On 4/3/2016 at 8:28 PM, cottny27 said:Ranger, take it with a grain of salt. These dudes spend big money to accent their reels with purples and pinks. Their man card has been taken away ?
You mean like this? Don't forget adding aftermarket knobs and a non stock drag star, Yeah, it was enough money one could of bought themselves a Duckett Ghost or two. I'd rather buy more parts though. Meanwhile on another forum you've provided us with entertainment kid.
new2BC4bass reply :
On 4/3/2016 at 8:28 PM, cottny27 said:Ranger, take it with a grain of salt. These dudes spend big money to accent their reels with purples and pinks. Their man card has been taken away ?
Hey, I like the purple accents on my T3 MX. I like the purple on my Purple Alphas. I like the red color of my Limited Edition Tatula Type R. I like the pretty blues sunlight brings out in my Aetos. Besides....my wife took away my man card many years ago.
rippin-lips reply :
On 4/3/2016 at 10:41 PM, new2BC4bass said:Hey, I like the purple accents on my T3 MX. I like the purple on my Purple Alphas. I like the red color of my Limited Edition Tatula Type R. I like the pretty blues sunlight brings out in my Aetos. Besides....my wife took away my man card many years ago.
He was talking directly about me but he just doesn't have any stones and instead goes with making snide comments. He's made reference to the purple parts before. Let the kid have his fun over the Internet though.
cottny27 reply :
On 4/3/2016 at 10:22 PM, rippin-lips said:You mean like this? Don't forget adding aftermarket knobs and a non stock drag star, Yeah, it was enough money one could of bought themselves a Duckett Ghost or two.
Yes, is it fishing or Barbie dress up time. If a spinning setup is sissy then so is taking a manly baitcaster and making it feminine.
On 4/3/2016 at 10:47 PM, rippin-lips said:He was talking directly about me but he just doesn't have any stones and instead goes with making snide comments. He's made reference to the purple parts before. Let the kid have his fun over the Internet though.
Rippin, it's ur snide comments to people I react to. I'm no kid.
rippin-lips reply :
Okay, kid whatever you say.
desmobob reply :
One more comment on casting light baits... After watching Daiwa's video on the SV concept reels, it stood out that they recommended filling the spool only half-full. Guys spend a lot of money on expensive lightweight spools, but your overall spool weight can get lighter a lot cheaper by merely leaving off half the line you would normally spool!
I can't seem to make myself do it (yet). I'm one of those guys who tends to over-fill my spools, if anything, despite never having had a bass run off more than a few feet of drag.
Tight lines,
Bob
cottny27 reply :
On 4/3/2016 at 10:59 PM, rippin-lips said:Okay, kid whatever you say.
Uptight..
Cgrinder reply :
Is anyone else ready for winter to be over?
On topic, the Daiwa Alphas platform or various Shimano 50E reels are good starts that won't break the bank. I greatly prefer casting reels for shad raps and other small hardbaits.
Fishin' Fool reply :
On 4/4/2016 at 12:03 AM, Cgrinder said:Is anyone else ready for winter to be over?
On topic, the Daiwa Alphas platform or various Shimano 50E reels are good starts that won't break the bank. I greatly prefer casting reels for shad raps and other small hardbaits.
You ain't kidding. Looks like are from the same general area. I made a few casts from shore from Stony Creek on Friday evening and was hoping to get out with my buddy on the boat maybe today. And then we get snow. What the heck!
Jaheff reply :
Shimano 70,a good ML rod, and 20# braid.
Just make sure to clean the junk out of shimano's spool bearings!
oldschoolbasser reply :
On 4/3/2016 at 9:22 AM, Jeff H said:Definitely not new. My PM-100 dates back to 1982 I think. I don't know of an earlier model (factory designated) ultralight casting reel but that one takes us back 34 years in the finesse caster game. There was also a mini Millionaire (round version) from around the same time, could even be older yet??
Maybe you've heard of the Ambassadeur 1500-2500C Series reel? Been around since "75",designed for fishing light lures.
Raul reply :
On 4/3/2016 at 8:28 PM, cottny27 said:Ranger, take it with a grain of salt. These dudes spend big money to accent their reels with purples and pinks. Their man card has been taken away ?
REAL MEN WEAR PINK.
new2BC4bass reply :
On 4/3/2016 at 11:07 PM, desmobob said:One more comment on casting light baits... After watching Daiwa's video on the SV concept reels, it stood out that they recommended filling the spool only half-full. Guys spend a lot of money on expensive lightweight spools, but your overall spool weight can get lighter a lot cheaper by merely leaving off half the line you would normally spool!
I can't seem to make myself do it (yet). I'm one of those guys who tends to over-fill my spools, if anything, despite never having had a bass run off more than a few feet of drag.
Tight lines,
Bob
I had an Online friend tell me I needed a full spool for maximum distance. I am no longer so sure of that. When I spooled my Curado 201E with the remains of a filler spool, I wound up with a lot of spool still showing. Casting distance was very good on an Endurance 723. Have since filled the spool. I don't see a difference on the water. Maybe if I had measured casts on land I would have found a difference.
However, I continue to fill my spools.....just in case.
Jaheff reply :
On 4/4/2016 at 1:31 AM, new2BC4bass said:I had an Online friend tell me I needed a full spool for maximum distance. I am no longer so sure of that. When I spooled my Curado 201E with the remains of a filler spool, I wound up with a lot of spool still showing. Casting distance was very good on an Endurance 723. Have since filled the spool. I don't see a difference on the water. Maybe if I had measured casts on land I would have found a difference.
However, I continue to fill my spools.....just in case.
Full spool for IPT, not distance. The older curado's cast better with less line on them. Looks to me like Shimano raised the line guide a bit on the I series, but haven't measured for proof.
Jeff H reply :
LOL....I've caught hell on here for using the "sissy stick" label before too (RW took offense). It's what they were always called in my era among us bassin' guys. We never got our feathers ruffled about it, just a joke among us, but the walleye guys didn't, and still don't, like that term. A top Daiwa sponsored pro has called them "fairy wands" on national tv...lol Whatever, those of you bothered by such a thing need to take a deep breath and relax. It just ain't that big of a deal!
Raul reply :
On 4/4/2016 at 2:17 AM, Jeff H said:LOL....I've caught hell on here for using the "sissy stick" label before too (RW took offense). It's what they were always called in my era among us bassin' guys. We never got our feathers ruffled about it, just a joke among us, but the walleye guys didn't, and still don't, like that term. A top Daiwa sponsored pro has called them "fairy wands" on national tv...lol Whatever, those of you bothered by such a thing need to take a deep breath and relax. It just ain't that big of a deal!
Walleye guys need to grow tuffer hides.
Jrob78 reply :
On 4/4/2016 at 3:08 AM, Raul said:Walleye guys need to grow tuffer hides.
....and, if you're going to call yourself a "bass fisherman" and you don't know how to use a baitcaster, "bless your heart."
Raul reply :
On 4/4/2016 at 3:16 AM, Jrob78 said:....and, if you're going to call yourself a "bass fisherman" and you don't know how to use a baitcaster, "bless your heart."
AMEN !!!
MIbassyaker reply :
Shrug. I suppose those of us who get by just fine with "sissy sticks" probably don't have the same burning need to compensate for something...
It's OK, though -- we're not judging. This is a safe space.
ranger7717 reply :
it's all good.....sure i'd like to be more accurate with a baitcaster ,i do own a couple nice setups , but if i can drop a jig into a bucket from 80 feet away with a spinning setup, why wouldn't i continue to do that ? i think the colors are cool , but i'd rather by more gear...that's just me....i guess those thousands of fish i've caught on sissy sticks and the money i've won don't count...i'm not a real bass fisherman - guess i should just quit now and take up knitting
IAY reply :
On 4/4/2016 at 6:22 AM, ranger7717 said:it's all good.....sure i'd like to be more accurate with a baitcaster ,i do own a couple nice setups , but if i can drop a jig into a bucket from 80 feet away with a spinning setup, why wouldn't i continue to do that ? i think the colors are cool , but i'd rather by more gear...that's just me
BFS isn't about taking the same space as spinning. You can use heavier 10-12 fluorocarbon line and still go down to 1/16 oz total weight easily, letting you fish cover much more effectively than spinning set ups. Baitcasting reel also allows you to lock down the drag and really turn the fish out of cover, and disengage the spool and thumb the line as it makes hard runs on open water, giving you much more fish manageability. BFS is going to struggle on light lures without much center of gravity like unweighted plugs. They are simply different tools meant for different situations.
ranger7717 reply :
that's why i own some .... i fish up north and usually manage just fine - it's not often i'm in heavy cover or fighting anything over 5 or 6 lbs... but also remember that saltwater guys are fighting pretty big fish on spinning gear ...you just gotta know how to use it ....it's actually something to be proud of...i brought in a 15 lb. pike on champlain with 8 lb. test - just sayin'
Jrob78 reply :
On 4/4/2016 at 6:36 AM, ranger7717 said:that's why i own some .... i fish up north and usually manage just fine - it's not often i'm in heavy cover or fighting anything over 5 or 6 lbs... but also remember that saltwater guys are fighting pretty big fish on spinning gear ...you just gotta know how to use it ....it's actually something to be proud of...i brought in a 15 lb. pike on champlain with 8 lb. test - just sayin'
The choice to use spinning or casting has nothing to do with the size of the fish you expect to catch, (in bass fishing,) it's about the weight of the bait you intend to throw. Bass spinning rods are mostly aimed at finesse fishing and aren't suitable for throwing heavier bass baits.
ranger7717 reply :
well then what i'm able to throw or catch must just be all my imagination then
iabass8 reply :
On 4/3/2016 at 8:28 PM, cottny27 said:Ranger, take it with a grain of salt. These dudes spend big money to accent their reels with purples and pinks. Their man card has been taken away ?
Why does putting colored accents on your reels make you not a man?
EllisJuan reply :
If this is gay, I don't want to be straight...
EllisJuan reply :
There sure are some sensitive little ladies on here. I would expect a little more Testosterone on a bass fishing forum.
Jeff H reply :
He's on his way I'm sure. He'll close it up any minute.
Jrob78 reply :
This thread made me laugh. 
cottny27 reply :
On 4/4/2016 at 8:04 AM, EllisJuan said:If this is gay, I don't want to be straight...
Are we still on this? I was backing up Ranger because of the sissy stick comment from Rippin that he then edited. Don't forget where this started.
ranger7717 reply :
On 4/4/2016 at 8:34 AM, cottny27 said:Are we still on this? I was backing up Ranger because of the sissy stick comment from Rippin that he then edited. Don't forget where this started.
right....thanks cottny27 - maybe i am a little too sensitive ....i'm going to go and powder my ****** now and then go put some new line on a couple of my spinning reels - some lightweight 8 # mean green - carry on gentlemen
cottny27 reply :
On 4/4/2016 at 8:39 AM, ranger7717 said:right....thanks cottny27 - maybe i am a little too sensitive ....i'm going to go and powder my ****** now and then go put some new line on a couple of my spinning reels - some lightweight 8 # mean green - carry on gentlemen
I don't think so. Yeah, I gotta go polish my Ghost rods.
Jeff H reply :
On 4/4/2016 at 12:30 AM, oldschoolbasser said:Maybe you've heard of the Ambassadeur 1500-2500C Series reel? Been around since "75",designed for fishing light lures.
Well, I know of the Garcia rounds obviously but I didn't know any of them had been tailored to light lures. I did a quick google, those bring some good money yet! I could not get a good idea of actual size in any of the pictures I saw though, but I assume they must be a bit smaller?? Cool info though, we can take finesse casters back to mid 70's now!
rippin-lips reply :
On 4/4/2016 at 8:34 AM, Jrob78 said:This thread made me laugh.
They got a good laugh out of it on TP also. I posted it this morning on there. Kids these days are so sensitive. It's too bad Walmart doesn't sell a sense of humor or tougher skin.
It was clearly all in fun but only the two of you didn't get that part. I'll be sure to clarify it for y'all next time.
oldschoolbasser reply :
Some of my small Ambassadeurs. My favorite light lure reels.
desmobob reply :
Those sure are pretty. School me a little on the old-school round reels... what kind of brakes do they have?
Tight lines,
Bob
ranger7717 reply :
On 4/4/2016 at 10:22 AM, rippin-lips said:They got a good laugh out of it on TP also. I posted it this morning on there. Kids these days are so sensitive. It's too bad Walmart doesn't sell a sense of humor or tougher skin.
It was clearly all in fun but only the two of you didn't get that part. I'll be sure to clarify it for y'all next time.
it's all good rippin- lips...i've been in construction for 35 years and we bust each other way worse than this- i've heard the term sissy stick more than once-.i was enjoying myself as well....maybe it looked liked my feelings were hurt - but i was just trying to get some digs in myself..fair play , right ?.i really don't care about how someone else fishes , and i would think nobody really cares how i fish either -
rippin-lips reply :
Exactly! It's fishing and we do it because we enjoy it. When we float the river in the kayaks all I take is a spinning rod. It's just easier with trying to keep yourself in an area ect ect
0119 reply :
On 4/4/2016 at 10:51 AM, desmobob said:Those sure are pretty. School me a little on the old-school round reels... what kind of brakes do they have?
Tight lines,
Bob
I have 3 2500's and a 1500 I'm restoring now. I keep just the standard 2 phenolic resin pucks. I see no reason to change them but there is japanese aftermarket 4 puck systems and magnetic add ons at japan tackle and hedgehog. The Avail shallow spool you see on Joel's green 2500c helps a lot in finesse casting. I keep them original for the most part and have no problem throwing 3/16th jerkbaits and 1/8th jigs on 2 and 4# mono. Its a blast getting a 4-8# tarpon on one! The 2500c still hold the world record in long distance casting in the world championships held in Europe.
Shane_ reply :
Love my steez for throwing light baits, I also have an sv spool on it that helps a lot
new2BC4bass reply :
On 4/4/2016 at 10:16 AM, Jeff H said:Well, I know of the Garcia rounds obviously but I didn't know any of them had been tailored to light lures. I did a quick google, those bring some good money yet! I could not get a good idea of actual size in any of the pictures I saw though, but I assume they must be a bit smaller?? Cool info though, we can take finesse casters back to mid 70's now!
Can't show you a comparison size. Can tell you I palm my 1600C. Can't tell you about the braking. Can tell you I've thrown a small unweighted fluke directly into a strong wind and only backlashed once when I tried for the other side of the lake.
cottny27 reply :
On 4/4/2016 at 10:22 AM, rippin-lips said:They got a good laugh out of it on TP also. I posted it this morning on there. Kids these days are so sensitive. It's too bad Walmart doesn't sell a sense of humor or tougher skin.
It was clearly all in fun but only the two of you didn't get that part. I'll be sure to clarify it for y'all next time.
I think all the ink has entered your bloodstream and is frying your brain. Haha all in fun.
oldschoolbasser reply :
On 4/4/2016 at 10:51 AM, desmobob said:Those sure are pretty. School me a little on the old-school round reels... what kind of brakes do they have?
Tight lines,
Bob
Some of my small Ambassadeurs. My favorite light lure reels. I believe the brake shoes are bakelite,or some other fiber
Cgrinder reply :
On 4/4/2016 at 8:04 AM, EllisJuan said:If this is gay, I don't want to be straight...
YEP. I'd prefer a forest green to match my NRX, but purple and green would work well together too.
buzzed bait reply :
On 4/3/2016 at 4:52 AM, rippin-lips said:Not my catch but buzzedbait caught this the other day on a wacky senko using his ML rod and a curado 51e with yumeya finesse spool.
that looks familiar!!!!
i was tossing the 4" wacky weightless on that sweet sweet unit this weekend! the fish liked it as did i!! i caught a rainbow trout, crappie and some nice little 1-2lb bass on it. the 8# yozuri i was using was plenty strong enough for them all.
and i am soooooooo glad i got that spool too, it makes it so easy to cast that lighter weight, almost effortless really.
i think one big advantage for me is the accuracy i was getting because of the fact that i could feather the spool with my finger and plop the worm down right where i wanted it. the fish were all in small pockets between the laurel bushes that were hanging out over the banks on this lake and being able to stop the bait before it hit the bushes was a major win for me. with spinning gear i can do it, but it's a little more of a "jerky" motion with a less subtle entry into the water.
buzzed bait reply :
On 4/3/2016 at 11:38 AM, Delaware Valley Tackle said:A Super Tuned 50e Shimano is probably the most cost effective venture into finesse bait casting. Otherwise prepare to open up the wallet .
forgot to mention this dude (some call him DVT others call him Mike, not sure what the ladies call him) he supertuned my curado 51e's, one of which is in the picture above with the BFS spool, and WOW what a difference it made! i liked the reel before that, loved it after the supertune, thought about sleeping with it for the last week since i put the BFS spool in there! 
IAY reply :
On 4/4/2016 at 1:31 AM, new2BC4bass said:I had an Online friend tell me I needed a full spool for maximum distance. I am no longer so sure of that. When I spooled my Curado 201E with the remains of a filler spool, I wound up with a lot of spool still showing. Casting distance was very good on an Endurance 723. Have since filled the spool. I don't see a difference on the water. Maybe if I had measured casts on land I would have found a difference.
However, I continue to fill my spools.....just in case.
What you are worried about when casting light weight gear is the weight of the spool. Putting extra line adds a lot of weight, and light lures just doesn't create enough momentum to actually turn those spools. Yes, there have been old school baitcasters which are designed to cast light weight stuff, but none of them comes close to the capability of the newer ultralight custom spools people have been making. There are plenty of options available to fit those gears though, just like the shallow spools for Ambassadeurs and Conquests.
oldschoolbasser reply :
On 4/4/2016 at 10:16 AM, Jeff H said:Well, I know of the Garcia rounds obviously but I didn't know any of them had been tailored to light lures. I did a quick google, those bring some good money yet! I could not get a good idea of actual size in any of the pictures I saw though, but I assume they must be a bit smaller?? Cool info though, we can take finesse casters back to mid 70's now!
2500C side by side with a 4500C. You can see the difference in size better.
Incheon Basser reply :
On 4/3/2016 at 2:09 AM, Further North said:I snagged a good deal on a St. Croix Rage that throws light baits very well (1/8 oz - 5/16 oz.) - between the sale price and points on my card, it was less than $70. While I may replace it at some point, it will do for now...until I find another that works better.
I bought an Cabela's Arachnid with it (Really a Daiwa Tatula-R with a couple extra bearings and a pretty blue spool)...and while that works, I'm guessing there's other reels that might work better...and I have a custom rod on order that the Arachnid will work great on...
...so I'm looking at reels that'll work well for light lures/baits.
So far, the Abu Garcia LTX has attracted some attention, as have the Daiwa SV reels...am I missing any that are perhaps less expensive? I'm not opposed to spending money if I have to to get great results, but I'm also not going to do it if I don't have to.
I own a LTX. It's good. Has a shallow spool. Revo premier. Just as good. Bait Finesse as they call it in Japan is a 6'4" to 6'10" Light power fast action rod. Abu Garcia started Bait Finesse in Japan be cause they have crappy spinning reels.
0119 reply :
On 4/5/2016 at 2:52 PM, Incheon Basser said:Abu Garcia started Bait Finesse in Japan be cause they have crappy spinning reels.
I have had nothing but great luck with Revo Spinning. Much better luck than with a Stradic I cannot open without voiding its core protect or a Ballistic which cannot be opened without killing its mag oil seal.
Incheon Basser reply :
On 4/5/2016 at 3:07 PM, 119 said:I have had nothing but great luck with Revo Spinning. Much better luck than with a Stradic I cannot open without voiding its core protect or a Ballistic which cannot be opened without killing its mag oil seal.
Abu has much better spinning reels now. They got a new engineer in Japan a few years back and put a ton of money into it. I meant years ago when they were just selling of the shelfers.
On 4/5/2016 at 3:07 PM, 119 said:I have had nothing but great luck with Revo Spinning. Much better luck than with a Stradic I cannot open without voiding its core protect or a Ballistic which cannot be opened without killing its mag oil seal.
The first gen Revo spinning reels were of the shelfers but any of the ones released in the last 3 years are good.
ibobpeb reply :
On 4/4/2016 at 10:45 AM, oldschoolbasser said:Some of my small Ambassadeurs. My favorite light lure reels.
What model reels are the top two? They look awesome
Goose52 reply :
On 4/7/2016 at 1:02 AM, ibobpeb said:What model reels are the top two? They look awesome
oldschoolbasser could fill in the details but as a starting point one could say that they are both Abu Ambassadeur 2500C "platforms". Neither reel is a stock, factory configuration. oldschoolbasser starts with a 2500C frame and hand-crafts the reels individually, using a combination of original, and aftermarket/custom, parts.
The bottom photo shows one 2500C and it looks like two 1500C "platform" based reels.
Pretty neat...
oldschoolbasser reply :
On 4/7/2016 at 1:02 AM, ibobpeb said:What model reels are the top two? They look awesome
The top 2 are both 2500C's. The bottom 3 are 2 1500C's,and a 2500C. Actually,the grey 1500C has 150+ side plates on it. The 150+ was a lower cost variant of the 1500C. I liked the side plates because of their sandblasted finish as opposed to the normal anodized one.
Edited by oldschoolbasserAdded content
oldschoolbasser reply :
New finesse rod for my "Custom" 150Plus Ambassadeur.2016 Megabass Destroyer F2-60X Criffhanger.
0119 reply :
On 4/8/2016 at 12:19 PM, oldschoolbasser said:New finesse rod for my "Custom" 150Plus Ambassadeur.2016 Megabass Destroyer F2-60X Criffhanger.
Joel, what is a 150Plus? Ive never heard of that version of the 1500
Goose52 reply :
On 4/8/2016 at 7:01 PM, 119 said:Joel, what is a 150Plus? Ive never heard of that version of the 1500
The 150 Plus was a decontented version of the 1500 - produced in 1991. Beadblasted sideplates, plastic cast control cap (which Joel has on some of his custom reels), and plastic cover over the handle locking nut.
If you haven't purchased it yet - you MUST purchase the book "Small Ambassadeurs - The Legendary Light-Line Fishing Reels". I've only been dabbling in the small Ambassadeurs for 3 or 4 years now so my acquired knowledge was meager compared to you guys. However, the book is simply an outstanding work that covers EVERYTHING that you would want to know about these reels. Who would have known there were more than 60 Abu-produced variants of these reels! I wrote a review of this book on Amazon.
oldschoolbasser reply :
On 4/8/2016 at 7:01 PM, 119 said:Joel, what is a 150Plus? Ive never heard of that version of the 1500
It was a lower cost variant of the 1500C that was only produced for a short time. If you haven't read Small Ambassadeurs by Espen Sjaastad & Karl-Eric Svensson do so as it has all the information about the 15-2500C's, and all the variants. I couldn't believe all the different reels that were produced over the years.
0119 reply :
On 4/8/2016 at 8:33 PM, Goose52 said:On 4/8/2016 at 8:35 PM, oldschoolbasser said:If you haven't read Small Ambassadeurs by Espen Sjaastad & Karl-Eric Svensson do so as it has all the information about the 15-2500C's, and all the variants. I couldn't believe all the different reels that were produced over the years.
If you haven't purchased it yet - you MUST purchase the book "Small Ambassadeurs - The Legendary Light-Line Fishing Reels". I've only been dabbling in the small Ambassadeurs for 3 or 4 years now so my acquired knowledge was meager compared to you guys. However, the book is simply an outstanding work that covers EVERYTHING that you would want to know about these reels. Who would have known there were more than 60 Abu-produced variants of these reels! I wrote a review of this book on Amazon.
Ironically It just came in the mail this week and I haven't opened it up yet. I'm heading out on a 8 day cruise tomorrow and told myself I wouldn't look at it until I was ready to read it sitting on a lounge chair with a drink in my hand!
I've been playing with all Ambassadeurs for a couple decades but never heard of the plus name being used. I suspected it was like the other plus models or the BASS models and had graphite frame or something. Of all things in my life I regret none I regret as much as selling a matched pair of 1600CIAR and 2600CIAR 's. What a dumb move..... The small Abu's remind me of the first baitcaster I yearned to own, the Penn Levelmatic 920. If Pure Fishing had even the slightest eye and ear open to the real, non bass tournament angler, market that keeps them afloat, they would bring back the 2500/1500/1600/2600 models, they would make a killing even if only off the small but spendy Ambassadeur fan niche. Next up I start collecting some 3500c's.....
Goose52 reply :
On 4/8/2016 at 9:34 PM, 119 said:Of all things in my life I regret none I regret as much as selling a matched pair of 1600CIAR and 2600CIAR 's. What a dumb move.....
Maybe I got them...if so, they're in good hands...
On 4/8/2016 at 9:34 PM, 119 said:Next up I start collecting some 3500c's.....
There are just TOO many Ambassadeur models. I told myself that I was going to STRICTLY limit myself to the 1500/1600/2500/2600C lines. That's it. NO expansion of the collecting theme...
...Then I got into these - cute as all get out and an opportunity to fish knucklebusters while still staying in the "Ambassadeur" family and not having to go all the way back to the original Records. My goal is to fish every one of these and catch at least one bass with each. I've already started with one of the 2650's. And for the non-Ambassadeur folks reading this, the 2650, as well as the 2600 and 1750/1750A are interesting hybrids. They have no drag system or anti-reverse like a traditional knucklebuster...but they have a button that disengages the handle during the cast - improving casting distance. All of these reels also have centrifugal braking systems. Neat little reels...
Yeah, I know, it's not very big...but it's a bass. That's all that hit that squarebill that day. At least I got the reel on the water for probably the first time in 40-50 years...
On 4/8/2016 at 9:34 PM, 119 said:Ironically It just came in the mail this week and I haven't opened it up yet. I'm heading out on a 8 day cruise tomorrow and told myself I wouldn't look at it until I was ready to read it sitting on a lounge chair with a drink in my hand!
I read the book cover-to-cover, over a period of two days. Had a hard time putting it down. I read every word except for the patent drawings. Don't forget to read the end notes as they're referenced in each chapter - LOTS of detail in the end notes.
0119 reply :
Those are knuckle busters aren't they? They are a beautiful reel, I see so few in good or better condition.
Goose52 reply :
On 4/8/2016 at 11:05 PM, 119 said:Those are knuckle busters aren't they? They are a beautiful reel, I see so few in good or better condition.
Some are knucklebusters, some are hybrids:
The 2000, 2050, and 2500 are knucklebusters - the handle spins on the cast.
The 1750/1750A, 2600, and 2650 have a button on the center of the handle that you can press to disengage the handle during the cast for additional casting distance (although everything else is moving - spool, line guide, main & pinion gears). The reel with Simon's red-knob handle, and the reel mounted on the rod, are 2650s - you can see the button in the middle of the handle. Since the handle disengages on the cast, you can add a custom, heavier handle to the "button" reels. If you added a heavier handle to one of the knucklebusters, you'd rob yourself of about 1/2 of your casting distance. There's a reason why the early Abu handles were so tiny - they needed the lowest mass possible since the handle was part of the rotating mass during the cast !
oldschoolbasser reply :
I've been finesse fishing since the early 80's. Japanese fisherman didn't invent this type of fishing,they refined it. Doodlin, splitshotting, tubes are all finesse baits. I throw 1/16oz & 1/8oz jig heads with 4" worms on my 15-2500C's all the time. Sure the new rods and reels for BFS are a great leap forward, but I don't give them credit for something they didn't invent. Don Iovino, Bobby Garland,and Dick Trask deserve a lot of credit for their part in making finesse fishing a big part of bass fishing. Iovino was going to Japan back in the day to teach Doodlin to Japanese fisherman. Phenix was building rods for the Japanese market specifically for light line and lure fishing. Japan is one of the largest markets for small Ambassadeur reels. Daiwa,and Shimano started making smaller reels for use with lighter lines,and lures because Ambassadeur reels were pretty much the only reels around capable of handling this type of fishing.
Knightiac reply :
On 4/3/2016 at 4:02 AM, Fishin' Fool said:Interesting to hear your perspective. I've been fishing spinning gear my whole life so casting gear is clumsy to me. When I was fishing alot I could be 50 feet off the edges of the lilly pads and put a cast within inches of the pads. I'd almost always know when to expect a bite. I guess up north with the clearer water long casts reign supreme.
I went through phases myself. When I first started fishing I learned on spinning of course and thought casting was ridiculous. Once I finally taught myself how to use casting reels I only used them for a period of time and thought spinning reels were a waste of time... LOL. It took me a couple years to truly appreciate the differences and stop trying to cast light lures on casting setups. There are times where I want to flip/pitch and want an incredibly slow fall so I go to spinning, and can get a heck of a cast out of it. Just about preference I guess.
Master Bait'r reply :
Hahaha wow, OP definitely got more finesse casting reel talk than he bargained for! This rabbit hole is pretty deep for 5 pages 
Goose52 reply :
On 4/9/2016 at 8:06 PM, Master Bait'r said:Hahaha wow, OP definitely got more finesse casting reel talk than he bargained for! This rabbit hole is pretty deep for 5 pages
Yeah - and us Ambassadeur guys sorta tunneled off to the side...
K_Mac reply :
Goose I have learned much on this thread, especially about old round reels. Like me and you, they show that a little millage doesn't mean they can't still get it done!
Goose52 reply :
On 4/9/2016 at 9:08 PM, K_Mac said:Goose I have learned much on this thread, especially about old round reels. Like me and you, they show that a little millage doesn't mean they can't still get it done!
Hey Kirby - I know about that mileage...!
It's fun playing with this old stuff. Many on the board wouldn't agree, but fishing is about much more than catching. It doesn't have to be about speed, maximizing yield, only using equipment optimized to the 'nth degree, "tourneys", etc. It should be about doing what is fun for you. Few would "get it" when I say that catching that 10" bass in the photo earlier in this thread was pretty rewarding (although, of course, a 4 pound fish would have been even more rewarding ). It started with buying a reel that probably hadn't been fished in 40 years or more, taking it apart, cleaning and lubing it, adding line, putting it on a rod, and fishing it. Having to unlearn all your muscle-memory for working a BC reel and learning how to deal with a reel that has no drag system and no anti-reverse. Then catching a fish with it. Hopefully, the next time I fish that reel I'll get some bigger fish, and perhaps get my "knuckles busted"! But for now, the effort that lead up to getting that 10" whopper was just as enjoyable, or perhaps more so, than just buying and using the "latest & greatest."
Jeff H reply :
On 4/9/2016 at 12:15 PM, oldschoolbasser said:I've been finesse fishing since the early 80's. Japanese fisherman didn't invent this type of fishing,they refined it. Doodlin, splitshotting, tubes are all finesse baits.
And, don't forget my favorite...Charlie Brewers Slider. Snagless Slider and 4" worm is deadly when they tuck back into the edges of the weeds.
I didn't get started in the early 80's but I was into it before the end of that decade. Not only was it fun but it added another method of productive performance most were ignoring back then. I was told I fished "weird" because I'd break out the sissy gear in club tournaments and even though I did well with it, it still was ignored by the rest of the guys. I still enjoy it all these years later but never got into the finesse caster game seriously until just a couple years ago.
Jaderose reply :
Man..this thread has it ALL! Beautiful older stuff. Some testy banter. Fish what you like and are comfortable with. I use spinning reels for the light stuff and BC's for everything else. Works for me.
ps...I haven't been very good with a spinning reel before this spring so I decided to take ONLY spinning reels with me for the first month or so. Now I can cast one pretty accurately. Gotta work at whatever you want to be better at.
avidone1 reply :
I guess deifinitions can vary.
To me, a finesse technique is all stealthy and quiet.
Based on this definition flipping a 1/2 oz. jig silently with no splash using an 8' rod and 30lb test line is finesse fishing.
On the other hand "ultra light" is a whole different ball game. I don't know many baitcasters that can easily cast a 1/16 oz jig under an overhanging limb for bream or crappie.
I am truly a baitcaster kind of guy, but this talk of 'sissy stick' is just stupid. KVD uses spinning rods when he deems it the best choice and no one would ever call him a sissy.
Jeff H reply :
KVD is a sissy!
By true definition you are correct. But years and years of the light line/small lure approach being tagged as "finesse" in bass fishing circles has resulted in todays definition. You accept it for what it is now for reference sake in conversation with others just to prevent confusion and useless arguments and keep the true definition to yourself. That's what I do anyway.
Heck, anytime I'm dragging texas rig worms through weeds I'm finessing that worm et al.
Further North reply :
On 4/9/2016 at 8:06 PM, Master Bait'r said:Hahaha wow, OP definitely got more finesse casting reel talk than he bargained for! This rabbit hole is pretty deep for 5 pages
Not at all - I've enjoyed every post. Learned a lot.
Further North reply :
On 4/9/2016 at 11:57 PM, Jaderose said:Gotta work at whatever you want to be better at.
Yup. I used fly rods only for a couple of months a few years ago..It made a difference.
So...after a lot of reading, learning, poking round here and there, looking at reels...I decided to bite the bullet and cough up the cash for the Abu Garcia LTX.
Reasons:
- I like Abu Garcia's stuff and am confident with it.
- It "felt right".
- I had to start somewhere and I decided to go with an "in the box" solution and work my way from there.
- A bunch of Cabela's Points, and rebate made the decision less painful.
Reel's on the way, we'll see how it gets the job done.
oldschoolbasser reply :
I've enjoyed this thread,and I appreciate being able to give my perspective on small Ambassadeurs. They have a world wide cult following,not just because they're great reels,but being able to tune,and customize them is a big part of it too. 41 years after they came out,you can still get parts for them,and many more aftermarket parts are being produced. No other reel company has the following like ABU Garcia. We're world wide,and dedicated to our old,slow,and heavy round reels. Unfortunately,Pure Fishing continues to neglect us,but we'll find a way to keep our reels going.
Goose52 reply :
On 4/12/2016 at 4:36 AM, oldschoolbasser said:I've enjoyed this thread,and I appreciate being able to give my perspective on small Ambassadeurs. They have a world wide cult following,not just because they're great reels,but being able to tune,and customize them is a big part of it too. 41 years after they came out,you can still get parts for them,and many more aftermarket parts are being produced. No other reel company has the following like ABU Garcia. We're world wide,and dedicated to our old,slow,and heavy round reels. Unfortunately,Pure Fishing continues to neglect us,but we'll find a way to keep our reels going.
Well said indeed...
The Pure Fishing corporate honchos may not be too hot on keeping the small Ambassadeurs going...but the Abu folks in Svangsta tried to give it a good go...culminating in what might be the ultimate factory-released model - the 2600C Elite released in 2009. Also, that 5.26 oz 2500C prototype discussed on pages 141 and 142 of the Small Ambassadeurs book would have been pretty nifty as well...
oldschoolbasser reply :
Great reel,wish that I had one. The closest I've come to getting one is getting its dual bearing worm gear lol!
Jaderose reply :
On 4/12/2016 at 4:16 AM, Further North said:Yup. I used fly rods only for a couple of months a few years ago..It made a difference.
So...after a lot of reading, learning, poking round here and there, looking at reels...I decided to bite the bullet and cough up the cash for the Abu Garcia LTX.
Reasons:
- I like Abu Garcia's stuff and am confident with it.
- It "felt right".
- I had to start somewhere and I decided to go with an "in the box" solution and work my way from there.
- A bunch of Cabela's Points, and rebate made the decision less painful.
Reel's on the way, we'll see how it gets the job done.
I hope it's exactly what you wanted....Good luck!
Further North reply :
LTX got here today...it'll work. I can easily throw a Ned rig as far as I need to...maybe not quite as far as with a light action spinning reel, but close...and I'm more accurate already.
oldschoolbasser reply :
Welcome to the Dark Side Luke Skywalker
Jeff H reply :
In 2-3 yrs time report back on your finesse caster addiction/collection. It's a fun ride!
Further North reply :
You guys are a big help....
0119 reply :
On 4/12/2016 at 4:36 AM, oldschoolbasser said:I've enjoyed this thread,and I appreciate being able to give my perspective on small Ambassadeurs. They have a world wide cult following,not just because they're great reels,but being able to tune,and customize them is a big part of it too. 41 years after they came out,you can still get parts for them,and many more aftermarket parts are being produced. No other reel company has the following like ABU Garcia. We're world wide,and dedicated to our old,slow,and heavy round reels. Unfortunately,Pure Fishing continues to neglect us,but we'll find a way to keep our reels going.
I've been Jones'ing for this thread for days and had to check it even if I was in the middle of the Caribbean Sea! It is sad Joel, that Pure Fishing ignores the old Ambassadeur crowd in lieu for their Revo "future". I often wonder if they would be foolish enough to sell the old Abu Museum to some Swedish land developer.
oldschoolbasser reply :
I don't think that would ever happen as it is a National Treasure. Pure Fishing is losing out on some big money not taking care of us "Old Reel Crowd" Maybe Simon can expanded hos operation to include parts for our small Ambassadeurs
Further North reply :
So...just for giggles, I weighed the whole rig...reel, rod and line...10.3 oz.
...that's pretty cool. Messed around with a floating Rapala tonight. 60 ft. was easy.
oldschoolbasser reply :
That's probably what my 2500C weighs by itself. Good thing I'm a manly man who can handle the extra weight
Further North reply :
On 4/16/2016 at 10:11 AM, oldschoolbasser said:That's probably what my 2500C weighs by itself. Good thing I'm a manly man who can handle the extra weight
I've got a musky reel that weighs about that much too...
Heck...I've got lures that weigh more than this rig...
...I Just looked up the 2500...7 ounces...
Jeff H reply :
That LTX is a winner! I really like mine.
oldschoolbasser reply :
On 4/16/2016 at 10:54 AM, Jeff H said:That LTX is a winner! I really like mine.
I hear the AE74 is supposed to be "The" finesse reel in the Revo line-up. I almost jumped on it,but I can't stand the yellow stripes. Something about yellow on fishing rods and reels makes it look cheap
Raul reply :
On 4/16/2016 at 10:11 AM, oldschoolbasser said:That's probably what my 2500C weighs by itself. Good thing I'm a manly man who can handle the extra weight
Manliness has nothing to do, these young fellers never grew up eating:
That´s why I can fish with my 9 -10 oz older Curados and Ambassadeurs.
Further North reply :
On 4/16/2016 at 12:42 PM, oldschoolbasser said:I hear the AE74 is supposed to be "The" finesse reel in the Revo line-up. I almost jumped on it,but I can't stand the yellow stripes. Something about yellow on fishing rods and reels makes it look cheap
10 seconds with a black marker...no more yellow stripes.
Goose52 reply :
On 4/16/2016 at 10:15 AM, Further North said:...I Just looked up the 2500...7 ounces...
The one-year only (1962) Ambassadeur 2500 was about 7 ounces. BUT, the Ambassadeur 2500C that we have been discussing in this thread would weigh between 8.5 and 9.5 ounces depending on the installed handle, the frame material, and the finish on the sideplates (with the limited-edition models having chrome-plated sideplates being the heaviest). Here's a typical 2500C with the single-knob counterweighted handle:
Here's another photo of what oldschoolbasser mentioned earlier in the thread - "finesse" fishing, 1970s style - Garcia Conolon "light-power" rod, Ambassadeur 1500C reel, and 1/6 oz. Roostertail. I fished it this morning and caught a little bass. Total weight - rod, reel, line, bait - 17.8 ounces. Not a problem, since I'm only 63 and not old enough yet where tackle weight is a big deal.
After I worked down the bank with the above rig, I switched to another BC combo that weighs about 8.8 ounces all up (rod, reel, line) - almost exactly half of the 1970s rig. Did I have a problem adjusting to the weight difference? Nope...but I did have a problem adjusting from a push-button BC reel back to a clutch-bar BC reel...
Further North reply :
That is really great "vintage" equipment - thanks for the info and the story with it. I really appreciate the detail on the equipment. I love learning things. I've got an old Ambassador reel in the garage from the late 70s - early 80s...it was either mine or my Dad's (we each had one) and it was in the garage at their house.
I should go dig it out, take a better look at it.
I'm not sure I'm willing to call stuff from the 70s vintage...I'm a 1962 model myself....
oldschoolbasser reply :
I'm a "56"
On 4/16/2016 at 11:27 PM, Further North said:10 seconds with a black marker...no more yellow stripes.
A reel like that deserves better lol!
Further North reply :
OK...use a magenta marker. Magenta + yellow = red.
Further North reply :
So...I put the new rig through its paces on the water today.
- Did fine with the floating Rapala.
- Did fine with #3 Mepps
- Did fine with Ned Rig
- Threw a Texas rigged Senko about a mile
I'm going to call the experiment a success...
oldschoolbasser reply :
Congrats,you're officially hooked!
oldschoolbasser reply :
Finally got my Elite!
Goose52 reply :
On 1/11/2017 at 9:41 AM, oldschoolbasser said:Finally got my Elite!
Congrats ! That's a great score ! !
I still haven't fished mine but I will eventually
oldschoolbasser reply :
Thanks Goose52,but I think I'll put this reel in my case with the Black Nostalgia 2500C.
KP Duty reply :
Most entertaining thread I've read in a while. Im planning on purchasing a light caster for my 852; but let's face it....no big league guys use bfs. They either use casting or spinning. It's really a moot point. BFS is against the grain. If bfs was winning tourneys...kmart would be on board with it.
fishwizzard reply :
Eh, I see it more an enjoyable way to tinker and fuss with gear to get it to do stuff it otherwise wasn't really intended to do. Sure, if money or my next meal was on the line, I would grab a spinning combo every time.
In BFS news, I just picked up a Kuyin Teton 6" UL casting rod. I got it from AliExpress for $55 shipped. So far I have been working every daylight hour so I haven't had a chance to mess with it. I have a PX68 with a DIY spool in it and I hope it will work for 3" senkos, weightless 4' finesse worms, and small inline spinners.
FryDog62 reply :
Due to a torn ligament in my right wrist (surgery couldn't fix) I really can't finesse fish with a spinning rod in my right hand anymore. I'd switch to my left but honestly its my weaker hand and I think I have better grip with a casting set up than spinning. So left handed I am now ...
However a "right handed" Baitcaster is something I predominantly hold with my left hand and crank with my right, so I've been shopping. I have baitcasters but nothing small/finesse style. For Xmas I got a BPS Carbonlite 6'-6" Medium Light Fast casting rod, and have been researching to find the best reel to pair with it. Found this thread of interest.
Am am leaning towards an SV Daiwa reel, but at $300-500 they're more than I want to spend. Have been thinking about the Zillion SV TWS at $300 until I heard that a new Tatula is coming out with SV TWS. If they can get that down to $200, I might buy two... waiting for release date --
fishwizzard reply :
On 1/14/2017 at 11:43 PM, FryDog62 said:
Am am leaning towards an SV Daiwa reel, but at $300-500 they're more than I want to spend. Have been thinking about the Zillion SV TWS at $300 until I heard that a new Tatula is coming out with SV TWS. If they can get that down to $200, I might buy two... waiting for release date --
Take a look at this;
http://japantackle.com/casting-reels/daiwa/low-profile-casting-reels/daiwa-alphassv2015.html
Daiwa Alphas SV for $204 before shipping. I believe it is the JDM version of the SV105.
Delaware Valley Tackle reply :
On 4/3/2016 at 6:18 AM, HeavyTwenty said:Just curious, can people cast a 5" senko the same distance on a MF baitcaster as a MF spinner? I've always assumed with a weightless senko, the baitcaster would be 20% shorter range, but my experience with baitcasters is limited to MH and H.
For raw distance spinning is the way to go. Accuracy can be achieved with either with practice. Each type of tackle had its time and place with a fair amount of overlap for those with a preference.
The Bassman reply :
On 1/15/2017 at 5:52 AM, Delaware Valley Tackle said:For raw distance spinning is the way to go. Accuracy can be achieved with either with practice. Each type of tackle had its time and place with a fair amount of overlap for those with a preference.
For a long time I tried to convince myself to focus on baitcasting because that was what the "cool" people used. As a shore bound angler that focuses on lighter presentations I have to admit that spinning makes me a better fisherman. That said, I love to tinker with and tune my baitcasters. When circumstances allow I enjoy using them.
new2BC4bass reply :
On 4/17/2016 at 12:46 AM, Further North said:That is really great "vintage" equipment - thanks for the info and the story with it. I really appreciate the detail on the equipment. I love learning things. I've got an old Ambassador reel in the garage from the late 70s - early 80s...it was either mine or my Dad's (we each had one) and it was in the garage at their house.
I should go dig it out, take a better look at it.
I'm not sure I'm willing to call stuff from the 70s vintage...I'm a 1962 model myself....
You really should. I have a 5001C from the mid 70s or a bit earlier. Never had used a baitcast reel nor knew anyone that did. With no Internet, it wound up sitting as I couldn't cast it. Came with a plastic sleeve that fits over the arbor so you can cut down on the amount of line required to fill the spool. Dug it out 2-3 years ago, left the plastic sleeve on and spooled it with 17# mono. Casts like a champ now that the operator knows how to use a baitcast reel. Will require a different handle as I can't stand the small thing on it now.
On 4/14/2016 at 10:34 AM, Jeff H said:In 2-3 yrs time report back on your finesse caster addiction/collection. It's a fun ride!
And somewhat expensive.
new2BC4bass reply :
On 4/16/2016 at 9:52 AM, Further North said:So...just for giggles, I weighed the whole rig...reel, rod and line...10.3 oz.
...that's pretty cool. Messed around with a floating Rapala tonight. 60 ft. was easy.
How much does about 130 yards of 12# AN40 weigh? My 7' MF and reel weigh an even 9 oz. without line. I will be 69 in about 3 weeks so I don't need to worry about fishing with 9 oz. reels and 5.5 oz. rods yet, but these light wands do bring a smile to my face.
I am interested in your thoughts on the reel now that you have had a few months to play with it.
Further North reply :
On 1/14/2017 at 11:28 AM, KP Duty said:...let's face it....no big league guys use bfs.
Who...really...gives a fig what the "big league" guys do?
The "big league" guys don't throw flies either...
Further North reply :
On 1/15/2017 at 7:40 AM, new2BC4bass said:I am interested in your thoughts on the reel now that you have had a few months to play with it.
I love it.
I used it in early season here in WI with great results, I used it to finesse smallies on Lake of the Woods, and then I used it back here in WI for the rest of the season. No problem throwing Ned rigs, small Rapalas, weightless Senkos, #3 Mepps...
Had a mishap in late season though...snapped the tip off the St. Croix Rage RC610MXF I was using and have not been able to replace it. Went with an Avid AVC69MLXF...but it's just not quite the same...It's OK...and I'll get back to where I want to be...but it's just not exactly what I wanted.
oldschoolbasser reply :
Aldebaran BFS and new Bantam rod. Trying something a little different.
.ghoti. reply :
old school, I'm shocked I tell you. Shocked.
LuckyHandsINC. reply :
On 2/8/2017 at 2:16 PM, oldschoolbasser said:Aldebaran BFS and new Bantam rod. Trying something a little different.
That is an awesome combo. Where did you find the bantam rod? I haven't been able to.
Goose52 reply :
On 2/8/2017 at 2:16 PM, oldschoolbasser said:Aldebaran BFS and new Bantam rod. Trying something a little different.
WHO ARE YOU...and what did you do with the REAL oldschoolbasser ?
OkobojiEagle reply :
OP... I fish with a Pixy, Premier, Morrum sx1601 and Chronarch 51e; all have a pretty good track record with lighter weight lures. My opinion for what you're asking is you need a med. light spinning rod.
oe
oldschoolbasser reply :
On 2/8/2017 at 7:02 PM, LuckyHandsINC. said:That is an awesome combo. Where did you find the bantam rod? I haven't been able to.
I think it was Japan Angler,or Japan Lure Shop. Actually it was Plat that had them.
On 2/8/2017 at 8:34 PM, Goose52 said:
WHO ARE YOU...and what did you do with the REAL oldschoolbasser ?
Just an Old Dog learning new tricks,but I still have my Oldschool arsenal
Added content
Further North reply :
Can you tell us a little more about the Bantam?
oldschoolbasser reply :
On 2/9/2017 at 1:45 AM, Further North said:Can you tell us a little more about the Bantam?
It's a 6'5" one piece rod. Rated for 6-12# line 1/8-3/8 oz lures. CI4 handle with cork foregrip,and split handle. Super lightweight. Paired with the Alderbaran BFS it's sick!
Further North reply :
On 2/9/2017 at 1:30 PM, oldschoolbasser said:It's a 6'5" one piece rod. Rated for 6-12# line 1/8-3/8 oz lures. CI4 handle with cork foregrip,and split handle. Super lightweight. Paired with the Alderbaran BFS it's sick!
Sounds sweet.
Where did you find it?
oldschoolbasser reply :
Online at Plat. I tried Digitaka,but there's a problem with their website.
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