Bye Bye Fluoro 2024
papajoe222 reply :
I gave fluorocarbon main line three seasons to win me over. It didn't, but I still had half a spool of Sunline Sniper left over from last season. I spooled up my deep cranking reel with it and didn't have the occasion to use it until last month. I don't do much deep cranking anymore. After a couple of trips, I started rethinking about my dislike for the line. Then the witch showed her true self last week. I was targeting an under hump that topped out at 10ft. and dropped quickly to 18ft. By casting shallow and cranking into the deeper water, I was able to keep the bait on the bottom. I check my line frequently for nicks and knot strength regularly, but what happend next was the reason I'm saying goodbye to fluoro as a main line. 
I made a long cast and my Poe's just kept going and going. The line had broken about 30yrds. up. Luckily I watched where it landed and recovered it and the piece of you know what line.
I'll stick to braid when I want sensitivity and good ole Original Stren when I want abrasion resistance.
Efishin reply :
Sunline, Seaguar, and Gamma all make phenomenal fluorocarbon lines. Never had this happen. My guess is that you frayed the line up and never noticed. Sunline Sniper has good abrasion resistance and has great characteristics but fraying off can happen with every line.
Stren makes great monofilament line but the sensitivity of mono is not good. If you want to move away from fluorocarbon as a main line, I recommend considering tying in fluorocarbon as leader material to your braid when needed for bottom contact. Good luck though
Angry John reply :
Flourocarbon has a huge marketing campaign pushing programs. Tons of money to be made on a product that has its drawbacks. It's no miracle line and I believe not the best choice for most. If you have several setups and understand its limitations and accept them then it's just another tool.
Glenn reply :
On 9/16/2019 at 11:07 AM, Angry John said:It's no miracle line and I believe not the best choice for most. If you have several setups and understand its limitations and accept them then it's just another tool.
That can also be said of all lines. IMHO, braid has limited uses, but is very well suited for them (e.g. flipping, pitching, frogging). But that's the same with all lines. Some are better suited than others for specific tasks.
There really is no one-size-fits-all line. But the closest all-purpose line would be co-polymer or perhaps mono. But again, there are limitations in those as well.
It's really about matching the right tool (line) to the right situation, rather than using a "favorite" line, or forcing one type of line to do everything.
Personally, I don't use leaders. Trying to make two completely different types of lines work together is simply a series of compromises where the outcome isn't as good as using the proper line for the task in the first place.
Again, that's just me.
scbassin reply :
I too think Co-Polymer is about the best all purpose line. Right now I am trying the Sufix Advance to see what it has.
GreenPig reply :
I only use fluorocarbon for leaders at this point and it's working fine. I retie prior to every trip.
Catt reply :
@papajoe222 Came to the same conclusion my friend ????
If I gotta walk around with a gallon spray bottle of line conditioner in the hopes it'll make the line half way preform... I'm done!
Then we aint even factored in cost which is ridiculous.
Mike L reply :
On 9/16/2019 at 12:02 PM, Glenn said:That can also be said of all lines. IMHO, braid has limited uses, but is very well suited for them (e.g. flipping, pitching, frogging). But that's the same with all lines. Some are better suited than others for specific tasks.
There really is no one-size-fits-all line. But the closest all-purpose line would be co-polymer or perhaps mono. But again, there are limitations in those as well.
It's really about matching the right tool (line) to the right situation, rather than using a "favorite" line, or forcing one type of line to do everything.
Personally, I don't use leaders. Trying to make two completely different types of lines work together is simply a series of compromises where the outcome isn't as good as using the proper line for the task in the first place.
Again, that's just me.
No, it's not!
Mike
crypt reply :
tried the same.....went back to Big Game.......it's just not for me.
Mobasser reply :
I'm one who has stayed with mono line for all my fishing. I like the way it cast and handles, and don't have any other problems with it. I don't care for using a leader also. I can tie good knots with no problem, but to me a leader is adding another link in the chain, which I don't need.
Todd2 reply :
Mono users unite..reject the fluoro propaganda!
Efishin reply :
On 9/16/2019 at 9:02 PM, Todd2 said:Mono users unite..reject the fluoro propaganda!
Sell me all your fluorocarbon for $1 please lol ????
Todd2 reply :
On 9/16/2019 at 9:03 PM, Efishin said:Sell me all your fluorocarbon for $1 please lol ????
I don't have any to sell. ????
Efishin reply :
On 9/16/2019 at 9:07 PM, Todd2 said:I don't have any to send. ????
???? I was drooling and couldn't help but ask lol
Krux5506 reply :
Only thing I like it for is leaders, as in braid to fluoro leaders. I rigged up a couple different reels with straight fluoro and had awful results, granted I was using "cheap" stuff but I'm really just not willing to drop ridiculous money on the "good" stuff. Cheap fluoro works fine for me as leaders.
scaleface reply :
Coincidentally , I just watched a video by David fritz on using Fluoro and crankbaiting . He stated that floro gets weaker when it gets stretched and after some use it will just start breaking .
Efishin reply :
On 9/16/2019 at 9:24 PM, scaleface said:Coincidentally , I just watched a video by David fritz on using Fluoro and crankbaiting . He stated that floro gets weaker when it gets stretched and after some use it will just start breaking .
Wouldn't mono follow the same? Mono can be overstretching and compromised as well
Catt reply :
On 9/16/2019 at 9:43 PM, Efishin said:Wouldn't mono follow the same? Mono can be overstretching and compromised as well
Not anywhere close to the degree fluorocarbon does
MN Fisher reply :
On 9/16/2019 at 9:43 PM, Efishin said:Wouldn't mono follow the same? Mono can be overstretching and compromised as well
On 9/16/2019 at 9:55 PM, Catt said:
Not anywhere close to the degree fluorocarbon does
Both stretch, FC later than Mono for the same stress. But Mono does 'rebound' to an extent, whereas FC doesn't. I had FC on my Trion, but after a couple breakoffs, switched to Hybrid...best of both worlds.
I also don't use leaders...ever.
MIbassyaker reply :
On 9/16/2019 at 9:43 PM, Efishin said:Wouldn't mono follow the same? Mono can be overstretching and compromised as well
No, not the same. Mono is more elastic when stretched and, up to a point, will return to its original shape, fluoro will deform and weaken.
Fluoro seems incredibly overrated to me. I get the benefits of greater density for increased sensitivity, to not absorb water, and for the tendency to sink rather than float, creating less belly in the line and a more direct connection to the bait...but in practice, when I have tried flouro, I have not found these advantages anywhere near dramatic enough to outweigh problems I had with breakoffs and general manageability, not to mention the cost. If it were less expensive, that would be one thing. But at several times the cost per length than a mono like big game, a Flouro would need to be proportionally superior to be worth it to me.
FishingGeekTX reply :
I had similar experiences when trying flouro. Random break-offs on fresh line, coily, harder to cast (than braid), costly..not for me.
I have 10 combos with PP braid 20#-65#, I don't generally have line issues and it casts like a dream compared to all polymer lines I've ever tried.
I understand for deep, rocky applications, that braid would be less appealing. Or bank fishing jigs where you break-off all the time. I don't fish those ways, so it's not an issue.
king fisher reply :
I have a friend who hunts with one rifle, and fishes with mono only. I try and tell him mono is not sensitive, he just smiles and shows me pictures of his fish. I tell him floro is invisible, again more pictures. I bring up the fact floro sinks making your crank baits dive deeper, he tells me his crank baits dive deep enough, more pictures. Braid is stronger, again more pictures. When I ask him about his rifle, he says it goes bang when he pulls the trigger, and again more pictures. I use every type of line made, and sometimes combinations of two, but don't have the pictures.
islandbass reply :
On 9/16/2019 at 9:43 PM, Efishin said:Wouldn't mono follow the same? Mono can be overstretching and compromised as well
Not necessarily. While both stretch, generally speaking, mono is more resilient compared to fc. In other words, mono is more prone to rebound back to its original length before stretching while fc generally does not bounce back but tends to remain deformed (ie, still stretched out) afterward.
Now, I imagine that there might be some fc lines out there that might have better resiliency than other fcs, but that’s not the topic.
FC for me is extremely limited to 6# sea guar invisx, if and only if I feel like splurging on it for drop shotting. It used to be $12 but now it’s $22.99 now.
6# mono is also pretty darn good too for finesse and as a result, I use this over fc most of the time.
Team9nine reply :
No right or wrong answer here. For me, outside of frog fishing or another specialty app, it’s all fluoro all the time on BC gear - and yes, I have the pictures...lots of them ????
Lasher reply :
I've switched back to almost all copolymer, P-Line Cxx 8lb moss green to be exact. Floro is useful in some areas, but it's quirky and inconsistent.
WRB reply :
I have a love hate affair with FC line. I use it but don't trust it for some presentations where it excels. I don't believe the low light refraction quality is important for bass fishing. FC has very low coeffient of drag going through water and is heavier then both mono/copolymer and braided lines. The low drag and weight help to keep in contact using bottom bumping lures gives FC the advantage over other lines.
The rattle snake knot strength issue is FC's Achilles heal. I know members will say they don't have a knot strength issue then go on to reveal how many different knots they use.
Before FC line came on the market bass anglers used 2 knots; clinch knot and if joining main line to leader a blood knot, both easy to tie and reliable. A few years prior to FC popularity the Palomar knot became popular for hooks and replacing the clinch knot for bass anglers in the 90's.
Then along came FC line and the knot wars started with dozens of new knots or knots never used by bass anglers. Why so many new knots? The answer is simple, FC has poor knot strength compared to mono/copolymer lines and failing at random times.
FC has higher memory then most other monofilament lines creating line management issues and the popularity of line conditioners to help solve casting issues.
I am in Glenn's camp; use the line that offers you the advantage presenting the lure to the bass.
Tom
roadwarrior reply :
On 9/16/2019 at 12:02 PM, Glenn said:That can also be said of all lines. IMHO, braid has limited uses, but is very well suited for them (e.g. flipping, pitching, frogging). But that's the same with all lines. Some are better suited than others for specific tasks.
There really is no one-size-fits-all line. But the closest all-purpose line would be co-polymer or perhaps mono. But again, there are limitations in those as well.
It's really about matching the right tool (line) to the right situation, rather than using a "favorite" line, or forcing one type of line to do everything.
Personally, I don't use leaders. Trying to make two completely different types of lines work together is simply a series of compromises where the outcome isn't as good as using the proper line for the task in the first place.
Again, that's just me.
I have been a Yo-Zuri Hybrid fanboy for more than a decade and still use #4 for live bait,
but otherwise I am sold on fluorocarbon for single hook presentations, specifically Tatsu.
For treble hooks I like Sunline Shooter Deifer Armilo (monofilament).
king fisher reply :
I do believe there are certain techniques where floro or braid have a huge advantage over mono. For those techniques I'm glad I live in a time with those options. I also feel that many times floro will have a small advantage, that at one time I would argue for it's use. Now my opinion has changed to, if the advantage is minor, why bother. Mono is cheap and works. That said, I ordered some floro yesterday. Bait Monkey loves fishing line as much as lures.
billmac reply :
I got around the leader knot problem by tying on 30 yards or so, so that the knot generally stays on the reel. I probably wouldn't mess with fluoro at all, but I want to fish the St. Lawrence (haven't made it yet) and I've read that mono parts like spider silk when it encounters zebra mussels. Not sure if that's true.
One of the problems I've found with fluoro is that it isn't only invisible to the fish. I have a wicked time seeing it when dropshotting or wacky rigging.
Mike L reply :
On 9/17/2019 at 12:09 AM, Team9nine said:No right or wrong answer here. For me, outside of frog fishing or another specialty app, it’s all fluoro all the time on BC gear - and yes, I have the pictures...lots of them ????
Ditto!
Ditto!!
As Ive said before many times on this board, I just don't get how so many people could be having so many problems with it.
I really don't.
Other than for 2 techniques I use it for everything and have no reason to change.
Mike
billmac reply :
Are there some brands of mono that are more invisible than others?
Team9nine reply :
On 9/17/2019 at 2:32 AM, billmac said:Are there some brands of mono that are more invisible than others?
Harder to see - yes. More invisible - no.
scaleface reply :
On 9/17/2019 at 2:41 AM, Team9nine said:Harder to see - yes. More invisible - no.
Cut it out . ☺️
fishindad reply :
I have also been using FC lines, primarily Sniper, for about 10 years. On both spinning and baitcast gear. Here are my thoughts and experiences.
1. Regarding "invisibility", no way bass are more line-shy than for example, bonefish or trout. I feel there are zero advantages as far as FC's refractive index compared to quality, clear mono or copolymer lines.
2. Knot strength. As already mentioned, it sucks, plain and simple. Try as anyone might you'll never convince me FC lines have greater knot strength than mono/copoly, no matter how many "lab" tests I read. On the water - FC lines . break more easily and more frequently. And I make sure my knots are tied very well.
3. Handling. FC is way too high maintenance. I have 2 bottles of KVD and yet no FC I've used has ever come close to McCoy's Mean Green or Damyl Tectan (for example) , especially on spinning gear, for ease in handling = no coiling. Note: I live in MI so I fish a lot of cold weather/waters.
4. Cost. No-brainer.
5. Density. The one characteristic that FC has shown a distinct advantage in that it does noticeably sink faster, and is more sensitive than mono/copoly on slack lines.
6. Abrasion resistance. Again, fishing in zebra mussel-infested waters in Michigan, I do see greater abrasion resistance with FC vs mono. However, I'll bet there are copoly lines like P-Line CXX that equal or top FC in this regard. So for bottom contact I use straight FC for dragging tubes.
I do like and use braid, specifically 832 and original PP. I'll use it for the same techniques as most - frog, punch, spinning. I used to use braid to leader but with my 61 y.o. vision, no way I'm taking the minutes to tie leaders on the water, in wind and rough waters. I am going to go back to straight mono on my dropshot rod and I'll bet I see no difference in bites or fish landed. Since the weight is what's dragging bottom I'll risk losing an additional weight or two.
Trouble is, like a lot of you, I have plenty of filler spools of Sniper laying around. ????
Bird reply :
Interesting responses and all very much respected.
I fish quite often for hours apon hours and like to dabble with lines and techniques.
There is one particular 68acre mountain lake that I fish several times a year that I exclusively used floro, lake is ridiculously clear.
I'm going back in 2 weeks for 4 days and already have several reels rigged with 10lb floro and several rigged with 15lb PowerPro braid.
I'm going rotate there usage with methods I've had success in the past to see for myself if there is any increase or decrease in strikes.
4 1/2" rainbow trout flukes nose hooked.
4 1/2" Roboworm drop shot nose hooked.
I'll be throwing leaders and straight braid.
I strayed from floro years back so looking for valid reasons to reunite or forever dismissed.
papajoe222 reply :
I was like WRB with the love hate relationship. Loved the sensitivity vs. mono when cranking, up brake offs on the hookset reduced its use to cranking only. Once I started paying attention to how I tied my palomar, I returned to using it for my swim jigs and Keitechs. Midway into the season, the break offs returned. I store my reels in a case and the ones that stay on my everyday combos come inside upon my return home.
I’m glad to hear that many of you are pleased with it and my rant wasn’t intended to convince anyone to abandon its use.
Catt reply :
On 9/17/2019 at 3:53 AM, papajoe222 said:
I’m glad to hear that many of you are pleased with it and my rant wasn’t intended to convince anyone to abandon its use.
The only way I've found fluorocarbon to even come close to me wanting use it is when you first spooled it...all down hill after that for me.
I used Maxima Chameleon & Maxima Ultragreen for about tens yrs. The only reason I went back to Big Game was I couldn't get Maxima easily, that was before the internet.
Shimano_1 reply :
I've used fc line for years and have never had it fail. Yes I've broken line from time to time just like I did with mono. Everyone has their opinions but I feel fc is much more sensitive and I use it on everything except one rod with mono for topwaters and one with braid for frogs and buzz baits. If you were using good quality line I don't see this incident being the lines fault. I certainly don't agree that it has more memory than mono either. In my experience it's been just the opposite. I say use whatever line u have confidence in and don't try to convince everyone else to do what u do. If FC hasn't served u well by all means use what has. It has been excellent for me and everyone I fish with so we keep trucking with it
Bassattackr reply :
I really like FC for the low stretch and better sensitivity, this is where it excels for me over mono. I don't really use mono much anymore, except as leader material on some of my topwater (braid) setups.
johnD. reply :
On 9/16/2019 at 9:24 PM, scaleface said:Coincidentally , I just watched a video by David fritz on using Fluoro and crankbaiting . He stated that floro gets weaker when it gets stretched and after some use it will just start breaking .
Round about the time he says he went to braid is when the new berkley x5 and x9 came out. He was pushing it pretty hard and still is.
Russ E reply :
I only use flourocarbon for 2 techniques.
Weightless fluke and Texas rigged worm.
In my opinion the enhanced sensitivity of flouro on a semi slack line works perfectly for these 2 baits.
All other applications get braid or copoly.
One thing I have learned about flourocarbon line is do not use cheap line.
It is sunline sniper or tatsu for me.
Fishin Dad reply :
On 9/17/2019 at 6:45 AM, Russ E said:I only use flourocarbon for 2 techniques.
Weightless fluke and Texas rigged worm.
In my opinion the enhanced sensitivity of flouro on a semi slack line works perfectly for these 2 baits.
All other applications get braid or copoly.
One thing I have learned about flourocarbon line is do not use cheap line.
It is sunline sniper or tastu for me.
Just curious what line you use for jigs? It seems like a similar technique to Texas rigs. For no reason at all, I have been trying fluorocarbon for jigs and braid for Texas rigs. Still haven’t figured out what I like the best for all techniques.
long island basser reply :
On 9/17/2019 at 2:16 AM, Mike L said:Ditto!
Ditto!!
As Ive said before many times on this board, I just don't get how so many people could be having so many problems with it.
I really don't.
Other than for 2 techniques I use it for everything and have no reason to change.
Mike
Same here, I don’t even have a memory of the last time I had an issue with flouro.
I don’t use any leaders, and do use flouro,(sniper), braid(pp),and mono(this year sufix advance) straight up on all my setups.
Maybe I’m lucky but I don’t have problems with any of them.
FishTank reply :
I have tried several different FC's over the years and so far Tatsu has been the best. The high cost has made it hard to purchase on a consistent basis. I have been using Invizx instead with zero issues. I also like Sunline Sniper and Shooter but have had a spool or two give me issues. Another I like for spinning gear is Trilene XL 100% FC.
WRB reply :
Your line is the most important item that is critical to catching fish, it's the only thing between you and fish, if the line breaks fighting the fish it gets away.
I never lost a bass from line failure until using FC. Operator failure to keep a bass from wrapping the line around something or dragging the line over something abrasive or too tight of reel drag I have broke off bass with mono/copolymer line. I have had several DD size bass break off using FC in open water while fighting them from line failure. When the bass weigh as much or more then the line pound test it takes skill and perfect performing tackle to put big bass in boat. FC helps to detect strikes but random line/knot failures that reduce your chance at catching the bass lowers your confidence in using the line.
I will not use FC line during pre spawn for big bass or at night or for finesse spinning tackle. I have lost confidence using FC line of any brand.
Maxima Ultra Green is far more abrasion resistant then FC. Sunline Diefer Armilo Nylon cast better then FC and stronger dia per dia then FC with reliable knot strength. As soon as my stock in FC is gone it's gone.
This isn't a knee jerk reaction it's taken 25 years of random break off's to reach this decision.
Tom
Fishaholic7lbs reply :
Berkley Trilene Big Game best line out there and cheap as dirt.. boat flip the big girls all day long with 20lb
billmac reply :
I don't know much about copolymer line. Rather than rehash if it's been discussed before, is there a thread on it?
Hammer 4 reply :
On 9/17/2019 at 8:49 AM, billmac said:I don't know much about copolymer line. Rather than rehash if it's been discussed before, is there a thread on it?
Take your pick, there are a few here.. https://www.bassresource.com/bass-fishing-forums/search/?q=copolymer line
Todd2 reply :
On 9/17/2019 at 8:49 AM, billmac said:I don't know much about copolymer line. Rather than rehash if it's been discussed before, is there a thread on it?
Copolymer and mono are basically the same or at least I can't tell a difference. Now you have many different types of each, ranging from soft and more manageable (Trilene XL) to harder more durable lines (Trilene XT). Stren and Big Game seem to be in the middle somewhere. Of course there are countless others.
Jason Penn reply :
i'm pro fc. i'm pretty much a slack liner, braid just feels dead to me other than tight line techniques.
i use a eugene knot and have had no problems with break offs. i havent had an issue since i started inserting weights.
5by3 reply :
Fluoro + Palomar knot = trouble.
lo n slo reply :
i’m an old school texas rigger and i’ve been using fc for about the last seven years. i love it over mono for what i do. but it has nearly driven me crazy dealing with random break offs, at the knot, on the hook set. i’ve experimented with different brands, weight strengths, knots and rods. but i think i’ve finally found the right set up...for me. 15 lb InvizX and the Shaw Grigsby knot.
never say never i guess, so stay tuned
Russ E reply :
On 9/17/2019 at 6:56 AM, Fishin Dad said:Just curious what line you use for jigs? It seems like a similar technique to Texas rigs. For no reason at all, I have been trying fluorocarbon for jigs and braid for Texas rigs. Still haven’t figured out what I like the best for all techniques.
i use fluorocarbon for flipping/ pitching jigs also. Forgot to add that.
Swimjigs I use copoly. Don't see any advantage with fluorocarbon for them.
WRB reply :
The fishing line world uses it's own definations for mono, polymer, co polymer and fluorocarbon lines.
Mono means monofilament not monomer.
Mono is used for the polymer polyimde or Nylon.
Nylon is often blended with additives to improve performance and reduce degradation from UV and Ozone to improve strength.
When Nylon is blended with another polymer like polyester or polyuerathane is called a co-polymer.
Simple until fluorocarbon, another polymer, in blended with other polymers including Nylon it's a hybrid or co-extrusion or another co-polymer depending on marketing.
If we use Tackle Warehouse line types Co-Plolymers are listed.
Tom
TnRiver46 reply :
On 9/17/2019 at 2:03 AM, billmac said:I got around the leader knot problem by tying on 30 yards or so, so that the knot generally stays on the reel. I probably wouldn't mess with fluoro at all, but I want to fish the St. Lawrence (haven't made it yet) and I've read that mono parts like spider silk when it encounters zebra mussels. Not sure if that's true.
One of the problems I've found with fluoro is that it isn't only invisible to the fish. I have a wicked time seeing it when dropshotting or wacky rigging.
Zebras will cut about anything
NorcalBassin reply :
On 9/17/2019 at 9:06 AM, 5by3 said:Fluoro + Palomar knot = trouble.
It's crazy how many of our experiences are different. I use fluoro with a palomar knot for all of my fishing except for frogs, swimbaits, and topwaters and cannot recall losing any fish due to a line or knot failure. I probably keep my drag a little looser than most since I tend to fish light lines, so maybe that's why I've been seemingly lucky in my experience.
Bluebasser86 reply :
On 9/17/2019 at 11:10 AM, NorcalBassin said:It's crazy how many of our experiences are different. I use fluoro with a palomar knot for all of my fishing except for frogs, swimbaits, and topwaters and cannot recall losing any fish due to a line or knot failure. I probably keep my drag a little looser than most since I tend to fish light lines, so maybe that's why I've been seemingly lucky in my experience.
Tie a good knot a palomar works just fine with fluoro. I use it along with a SDJ as the only 2 knots I tie with fluoro.
Fluoro has it's drawbacks, but what it does well, it does really well and I can't go away from it for that reason. I use a lot of mono and braid too. All of them have their benefits and drawbacks.
chubaka reply :
Flouro is too expensive for me, so I use Copoly line "Yo-Zuri Hybrid"
Columbia Craw reply :
Joe, you've been fishing long enough to know what you like, what works for you and what gives you confidence. That's all that counts.
5by3 reply :
On 9/17/2019 at 11:10 AM, NorcalBassin said:It's crazy how many of our experiences are different. I use fluoro with a palomar knot for all of my fishing except for frogs, swimbaits, and topwaters and cannot recall losing any fish due to a line or knot failure. I probably keep my drag a little looser than most since I tend to fish light lines, so maybe that's why I've been seemingly lucky in my experience.
Absolutely! What works for me may not work for others and vice versa. It’s all about confidence.
J Francho reply :
The only issues I've ever had with fluoro is using cheap line, or line that wasn't really 100% fluoro. Knots I've tied that all work well for me: Triple Surgeon, Alberto, Albright, Uni, Palomar, and Improved Cinch.
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