Curado Gone!! 2024
*Hootie reply :
Anyone with the new BPS catalog notice that the Curado is missing? New one is coming. Don't know for sure when, but I think in time for the BPS classic, late Feb.
Hootie
MarkH024 reply :
Hope a 50 comes out and they don't jack the prices.
aavery2 reply :
January 3, 2014
Dear Valued Customer,
Welcome to 2014 and the New Year. We look forward to working with you during the next several months on new, innovative, and exciting items we have prepared for the upcoming tackle season.
Please note, there is a change in one of our key product categories that we want you to be aware of. Effective January 1, 2014, all Curado G series reels will be available for promotional pricing and our MSRP policy will no longer be in effect. Again, this will take effect January 1, 2014.
This pricing will apply to all product you have in stock. There is no additional Curado G inventory available at this time for reorders.
Our sales team will be attending the majority of the upcoming dealer shows and making dealer calls the entire month of January. We look forward to seeing you personally and working with you on growing and understanding your business needs over the next 30 days.
As always, please contact Shimano directly or your regional sales representative at any time if we can provide any additional services or answers to your questions.
Sincerely,
Shimano Sales Team
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Copyright © 2014 Shimano American Corporation, All rights reserved.
Our mailing address is:
One Holland
Irvine, CA 92618
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A-Jay reply :
On 1/5/2014 at 12:12 AM, aavery2 said:January 3, 2014
Dear Valued Customer,
Welcome to 2014 and the New Year. We look forward to working with you during the next several months on new, innovative, and exciting items we have prepared for the upcoming tackle season.
Please note, there is a change in one of our key product categories that we want you to be aware of. Effective January 1, 2014, all Curado G series reels will be available for promotional pricing and our MSRP policy will no longer be in effect. Again, this will take effect January 1, 2014.
This pricing will apply to all product you have in stock. There is no additional Curado G inventory available at this time for reorders.
Our sales team will be attending the majority of the upcoming dealer shows and making dealer calls the entire month of January. We look forward to seeing you personally and working with you on growing and understanding your business needs over the next 30 days.
As always, please contact Shimano directly or your regional sales representative at any time if we can provide any additional services or answers to your questions.
Sincerely,
Shimano Sales Team
Follow on Twitter Friend on Facebook Follow on Instagram Forward to Friend
Copyright © 2014 Shimano American Corporation, All rights reserved.
Our mailing address is:
One Holland
Irvine, CA 92618
unsubscribe from this list update subscription preferences
And there you go ~
Very Good.
A-Jay
Grantman83 reply :
To me it would make sense to dc the chronarch e series and introduce a curado in it's place.
aavery2 reply :
On 1/5/2014 at 1:03 AM, Grantman83 said:To me it would make sense to dc the chronarch e series and introduce a curado in it's place.
If I am not mistaken there is a DC version of the Curado E, of course it is a Scorpion. So it would be something easy for Shimano to do.
http://://www.tackletour.com/images12/buttonscorpiondc7021.jpg
Crankinstein reply :
On 1/5/2014 at 12:09 AM, MarkH024 said:Hope a 50 comes out and they don't jack the prices.
+1
aavery2 reply :
On 1/5/2014 at 12:09 AM, MarkH024 said:Hope a 50 comes out and they don't jack the prices.
What would you like to see in a new 50 sized reel? They have the Curado/Chronarch 50E and the Core 50, what would the new 50 series look like.
Goose52 reply :
The Shimano email hit TT yesterday and there has been quite a bit of discussion over there about the future of the Curado. Might be some news forthcoming at ICAST or other shows...
Meanwhile, there might be some attractive clearance prices on the Curado Gs in the near future... 
MarkH024 reply :
The Curado 50 stopped at the E series. They sell used for what they retailed for or more unless youre lucky. I have Chronarch 50e's. I was just stating a curado base priced 50 would be great and would sell nicely being they're a popular size.On 1/5/2014 at 1:11 AM, aavery2 said:What would you like to see in a new 50 sized reel? They have the Curado/Chronarch 50E and the Core 50, what would the new 50 series look like.
I'd like a different color than green. Maybe a graphite color like the Cores. I just don't have cash to by multiple Cores in 50 size and I think a ~$160 50 size would fly off the shelves.
Smallmouth Hunter reply :
I have heard recently that there will be a Curado Rev-B built like the curado b, but revised. It will use a brand new frame, and new parts. Nothing will be re-used. It is supposed to be priced between 170-190 so that shimano can put quality parts into and whatnot. It will most likely have x-ship, and ci4+ sideplates are a possibility. Micro gearing is not very likely since that is a feature exclusive to the higher end reels. You may be able to swap the gears for the micro gears of the metanium or antares though. Expect to see a 50 size and 200 size. It will have an aluminum frame, graphite or ci4+ sideplates. Shimano knows the screwed up by repainting the curado e and by downgrading the curado in the g series, so they are attempting to redeem the famous curado.
I think it will be a great reel since the tatula has basically taken over the ~$150 market recently, and Shimano realizes they better make a good reel to compete with daiwa. The curado b had a huge following since it was produced for so many years and was priced fairly. Hopefully this new curado rev-b will live up to the name.
I don't know if this is 100% true, but I heard this from another person who heard this from a rep.
BenB54 reply :
On 1/5/2014 at 1:11 AM, aavery2 said:What would you like to see in a new 50 sized reel? They have the Curado/Chronarch 50E and the Core 50, what would the new 50 series look like.
an 8.5:1 gear ratio or something around there.
Crankinstein reply :
I agree, its the price more than anything that I'm looking for. Having a size 50 on a reel design like the Curado would allow me to buy several of them. It'd be cool if they could bring in a new color but as long as the performance and the price is there I'll be just fine.
Jaheff reply :
On 1/5/2014 at 2:11 AM, Crankinstein said:I agree, its the price more than anything that I'm looking for. Having a size 50 on a reel design like the Curado would allow me to buy several of them. It'd be cool if they could bring in a new color but as long as the performance and the price is there I'll be just fine.
There is a 50 sized reel on the market today that has great features already. It's not made by the big three, so it doesn't get talked about. Scott Martin uses these reels.
Smallmouth Hunter reply :
On 1/5/2014 at 2:07 AM, BenB54 said:an 8.5:1 gear ratio or something around there.
Along with that would come the huge gear box like the gen 3 revo's.. No thanks.
BenB54 reply :
On 1/5/2014 at 3:16 AM, aprw1 said:Along with that would come the huge gear box like the gen 3 revo's.. No thanks.
You're so right, Shimano shouldn't even consider the possibility of a high speed 50 series reel.
tomustang reply :
The letter sealed the deal for any doubt that they were going to get rid of it.
QUAKEnSHAKE reply :
You can get a shimano 50 in 8.0 no huge gearbox.
aavery2 reply :
On 1/5/2014 at 1:44 AM, MarkH024 said:The Curado 50 stopped at the E series. They sell used for what they retailed for or more unless youre lucky. I have Chronarch 50e's. I was just stating a curado base priced 50 would be great and would sell nicely being they're a popular size.
I'd like a different color than green. Maybe a graphite color like the Cores. I just don't have cash to by multiple Cores in 50 size and I think a ~$160 50 size would fly off the shelves.
Well kind of, the Chronarch 50e is the Curado 50e. I guess what I am asking is what would they take away from the Chronarch 50e to produce a lesser priced Curado 50g and would that reel still be attractive enough to interest anyone.
MarkH024 reply :
Great point. Certainly don't want a downgrade of quality in components.On 1/5/2014 at 5:27 AM, aavery2 said:Well kind of, the Chronarch 50e is the Curado 50e. I guess what I am asking is what would they take away from the Chronarch 50e to produce a lesser priced Curado 50g and would that reel still be attractive enough to interest anyone.
bootytrain reply :
On 1/5/2014 at 5:13 AM, QUAKEnSHAKE said:You can get a shimano 50 in 8.0 no huge gearbox.
Yep you sure can.. 
Shimano has had oversized gears(HEG) for awhile now. I might pick up a Curado G5 for cranking. It looks like a great platform for supertuning. And I cant wait to see what is replacing it!
Jaheff reply :
What about putting Chronarchs back to curado's (same price), and add a different size C14?
aavery2 reply :
On 1/5/2014 at 6:19 AM, Jaheff said:What about putting Chronarchs back to curado's (same price), and add a different size C14?
That is certainly a good option, but it kinda makes Shimano look bad because the justification for all of the current changes was the economy and they could no longer produce a reel with the quality of the Curado at its then current price.
The Rooster reply :
Not only that but we already see how reintroducing old reels as new again works for them. I think that's why they're changing it now, too many people cried foul. If they changed it back to the Curado again, some people would love it, but some of those same people, and also a whole lot of others would really be scratching their heads trying to figure out if they're getting what they want by buying it or just getting jerked around. What I'm trying to say is there would be too much questionable intent with it by then and would be a turn off to people. Doesn't matter how great a reel it is, there's a certain way you sell to the masses for profit and that's not it. Fishermen "in the know" would buy it and be glad to have it, but the average joe might not be impressed with a reel that once was, then was no more, then was again, when there's fresher technology available from other sources without all the questions.
If they did nothing else but just change it back to being the old Curado E, I guarantee you there'd be rumors everywhere about how they cheapened it and the old ones are better. Especially after saying the economy was the reason to kill it, which was bull because we know the Chronarch E is that same reel now.
Loop_Dad reply :
On 1/5/2014 at 1:13 AM, Goose52 said:
Meanwhile, there might be some attractive clearance prices on the Curado Gs in the near future...
Yeah, I'm not picky and I'll take some clearance priced Curado G. 
If someone sees one, make sure to post up.
curtis9 reply :
I think curado 50e was always $199. They didn't change the price when they changed the color and the name. The 200e increased from $179 to $199.
curtis9 reply :
I'd like to see a 5:1 and 7:1 gear ratio in a new 50 sized curado.
I'd also like to see them offer tuning options, like spools and handles.
tomustang reply :
Probably be better off burying the curado name and coming out with a new name.
VolFan reply :
I agree with Tomustang. Too many opinions and emotions in "Curado." Put it to bed and have a truly new product.
Crankinstein reply :
On 1/5/2014 at 9:54 AM, VolFan said:I agree with Tomustang. Too many opinions and emotions in "Curado." Put it to bed and have a truly new product.
I could go for that as long as they made the new design with some unique features to allow it to not just be another Curado with a new name. I like how Daiwa brought the TWS into the Tatula for that price range so maybe Shimano will take a feature from one its higher end reels and offer it in this price range too, within reason ofcourse. Maybe a new break adjustment like the Metanium and Antares have where the break has its standard internal break adjustment with the side plate off but also has a small dial on the bottom for small adjustments. I could see them also offering some wide ranges in gear ratio and size as well which would bring up the size 50 option we've been discussing. I think what I'm getting at is if they make a completely new reel I would like to see it have a "signature feature" otherwise its just going to be a revamped Curado.
bootytrain reply :
If I'm not mistaken you can put the core 50 gears into a curado/chronarch 50 and get 7:1, and the Aldebaran 5.8 gears should fit tooOn 1/5/2014 at 7:03 AM, curtis9 said:I'd like to see a 5:1 and 7:1 gear ratio in a new 50 sized curado.
I'd also like to see them offer tuning options, like spools and handles.
curtis9 reply :
On 1/5/2014 at 12:11 PM, bootytrain said:If I'm not mistaken you can put the core 50 gears into a curado/chronarch 50 and get 7:1, and the Aldebaran 5.8 gears should fit too
I think that's correct, but that's an extra $30-40 to by the gears, plus cost or time to change them out.
I'd like to see the other gear options available stock.
rockchalk06 reply :
On 1/5/2014 at 11:20 AM, Crankinstein said:I could go for that as long as they made the new design with some unique features to allow it to not just be another Curado with a new name. I like how Daiwa brought the TWS into the Tatula for that price range so maybe Shimano will take a feature from one its higher end reels and offer it in this price range too, within reason ofcourse. Maybe a new break adjustment like the Metanium and Antares have where the break has its standard internal break adjustment with the side plate off but also has a small dial on the bottom for small adjustments. I could see them also offering some wide ranges in gear ratio and size as well which would bring up the size 50 option we've been discussing. I think what I'm getting at is if they make a completely new reel I would like to see it have a "signature feature" otherwise its just going to be a revamped Curado.
I could do without all of that over the Micro Gearing. I wish they would bring that to every reel they make.
QUAKEnSHAKE reply :
On 1/5/2014 at 8:33 PM, rockchalk06 said:I could do without all of that over the Micro Gearing. I wish they would bring that to every reel they make.
Im not certain but would think micro gearing requires x-ship as well. The x-ship gives the extra support need to hold the smaller teeth in place to keep from stripping.
rockchalk06 reply :
On 1/6/2014 at 12:45 AM, QUAKEnSHAKE said:Im not certain but would think micro gearing requires x-ship as well. The x-ship gives the extra support need to hold the smaller teeth in place to keep from stripping.
Could be, I'm not sure on how it works. I've had a couple people tell me its super quiet in the high speed reels.
bootytrain reply :
On 1/6/2014 at 12:45 AM, QUAKEnSHAKE said:Im not certain but would think micro gearing requires x-ship as well. The x-ship gives the extra support need to hold the smaller teeth in place to keep from stripping.
Xship does not require micro gears. Micro gears is just the size of the gear teeth. "X-Ship provides improved gear durability. By supporting the pinion gear on both ends with bearings, the pinion gear maintains precise alignment with the drive gear. This means the gears will stay in the same position under the heaviest loads. The added benefit is that friction between the spool shaft and gear are eliminated. This will enhance the casting performance of the reel with lighter lures, and allow for longer casts." That's from shimanos website which about sums it up. You wont feel the x ship until the reel is cranking under load. I can tell you this much, X Ship, micro gears with Shimanos HEG is the real deal. I was fighting a 3lb largemouth with the Metanium and while I was cranking it in on one of its runs the sensation was so smooth that I thought I had my drag off, so I looked down and saw that line was indeed coming in my drag was tightened down. I think the reason it works so well is the long shaft spool design Shimano uses. Daiwa imitated this design on the Tatula and call theirs "Air Rotation".
I don't think the new curado will have micro gears but I wouldn't be surprised if it has X Ship which would be awesome.
Smallmouth Hunter reply :
On 1/6/2014 at 5:23 AM, bootytrain said:Xship does not require micro gears. Micro gears is just the size of the gear teeth. "X-Ship provides improved gear durability. By supporting the pinion gear on both ends with bearings, the pinion gear maintains precise alignment with the drive gear. This means the gears will stay in the same position under the heaviest loads. The added benefit is that friction between the spool shaft and gear are eliminated. This will enhance the casting performance of the reel with lighter lures, and allow for longer casts." That's from shimanos website which about sums it up. You wont feel the x ship until the reel is cranking under load. I can tell you this much, X Ship, micro gears with Shimanos HEG is the real deal. I was fighting a 3lb largemouth with the Metanium and while I was cranking it in on one of its runs the sensation was so smooth that I thought I had my drag off, so I looked down and saw that line was indeed coming in my drag was tightened down. I think the reason it works so well is the long shaft spool design Shimano uses. Daiwa imitated this design on the Tatula and call theirs "Air Rotation".
I don't think the new curado will have micro gears but I wouldn't be surprised if it has X Ship which would be awesome.
Air rotation is NOT the same thing as x-ship. It is not the same thing at all. Air rotation is the single bearing supported pinion gear. X-ship is a double bearing supported pinion gear. Daiwa has never made a reel with a double supported pinion gear. Air rotation is simply what Shimano has been doing for years where there is one bearing on the inner side end of the pinion gear.
X-ship is shown in the right side gear set.
Couldn't find a great picture, but on the left there is a set of gears that are standard HEG gears. Not sure what reel they are from, but I would guess a curado, chronarch, or citica. Notice how the end of the pinion gear (end with the notches for spool pin) is flat so it will fit in the bearing.
X-ship is shown in the right along with micro gearing. The end of the bearing with the notches for holding the spool pin is flat like the left side gearset because it fits into a bearing. Notice how the other end is slightly elongated. This also fits into a bearing. The pinion gear is thus supported by two bearings; one on each end to insure precision.
Now here is a picture of the tatula's air rotation single bearing supported pinion gear:
There is no way that this pinion gear could possibly be supported by another bearing because there is just no room for it. The end of the pinion gear that is not shown in the above pic is the bearing supported end. This is a copy of what Shimano does in their curado/chronarch e, citica e, g series reels, etc.
To conclude: X-ship = 2 bearings; Air rotation = 1 bearing, what shimano has been doing for years.
bootytrain reply :
On 1/6/2014 at 5:59 AM, aprw1 said:Air rotation is NOT the same thing as x-ship. It is not the same thing at all. Air rotation is the single bearing supported pinion gear. X-ship is a double bearing supported pinion gear. Daiwa has never made a reel with a double supported pinion gear. Air rotation is simply what Shimano has been doing for years where there is one bearing on the inner side end of the pinion gear.
X-ship is shown in the right side gear set.
Couldn't find a great picture, but on the left there is a set of gears that are standard HEG gears. Not sure what reel they are from, but I would guess a curado, chronarch, or citica. Notice how the end of the pinion gear (end with the notches for spool pin) is flat so it will fit in the bearing.
X-ship is shown in the right along with micro gearing. The end of the bearing with the notches for holding the spool pin is flat like the left side gearset because it fits into a bearing. Notice how the other end is slightly elongated. This also fits into a bearing. The pinion gear is thus supported by two bearings; one on each end to insure precision.
Now here is a picture of the tatula's air rotation single bearing supported pinion gear:
There is no way that this pinion gear could possibly be supported by another bearing because there is just no room for it. The end of the pinion gear that is not shown in the above pic is the bearing supported end. This is a copy of what Shimano does in their curado/chronarch e, citica e, g series reels, etc.
To conclude: X-ship = 2 bearings; Air rotation = 1 bearing, what shimano has been doing for years.
The first pic shows a standard gear set vs a micro module gear set, not x ship. X ship is basically an extra bearing to support the pinion to keep it aligned under load. Shimano put X ship in the Calcutta D which does NOT have Micro gears. Micro gears came out with the new Antares. The Exsence DC has X ship but NOT micro gearing. You may want to watch this video to educate yourself.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=IvvBcfwEuic Because of the long spool shaft Shimano only really needs 2 bearings at the ends of the spools shafts like they normally have and still have a smooth and powerful retrieve. But the 3rd "x ship" bearing helps a lot under load.
Daiwas normally have a short "free floating" spool shaft so that's 2 different spool shaft designs, but in the Lexa and Tatula they went with a long spool shaft like Shimano. And since we are quoting Tackle Tour..
"In one of Daiwa's early "Project T" videos, they introduce the concept of "Air Rotation" by spinning the handle of a prototype Tatula and showing how freely that handle spins without additional assistance. Their marketing material claims this is enabled through more precise, digitally designed and cut gearing. When I viewed this feature, my immediate thought was they probably added another bearing to the pinion gear similar to the recent implementation by one of their competitors. There's little we can do to verify claims of precision gearing, but I did take the reel apart to see if I could find another bearing under the pinion gear. Lo and behold, there indeed are two bearings supporting the pinion which in and of itself could explain that new, smoother, Air Rotation sensation."
BTW those "Air Rotation" gears don't look any more precision cut than any other gears, Im gonna assume its just marketing hype by Daiwa.
iabass8 reply :
On 1/6/2014 at 5:59 AM, aprw1 said:Air rotation is NOT the same thing as x-ship. It is not the same thing at all. Air rotation is the single bearing supported pinion gear. X-ship is a double bearing supported pinion gear. Daiwa has never made a reel with a double supported pinion gear. Air rotation is simply what Shimano has been doing for years where there is one bearing on the inner side end of the pinion gear.
X-ship is shown in the right side gear set.
Couldn't find a great picture, but on the left there is a set of gears that are standard HEG gears. Not sure what reel they are from, but I would guess a curado, chronarch, or citica. Notice how the end of the pinion gear (end with the notches for spool pin) is flat so it will fit in the bearing.
X-ship is shown in the right along with micro gearing. The end of the bearing with the notches for holding the spool pin is flat like the left side gearset because it fits into a bearing. Notice how the other end is slightly elongated. This also fits into a bearing. The pinion gear is thus supported by two bearings; one on each end to insure precision.
Now here is a picture of the tatula's air rotation single bearing supported pinion gear:
There is no way that this pinion gear could possibly be supported by another bearing because there is just no room for it. The end of the pinion gear that is not shown in the above pic is the bearing supported end. This is a copy of what Shimano does in their curado/chronarch e, citica e, g series reels, etc.
To conclude: X-ship = 2 bearings; Air rotation = 1 bearing, what shimano has been doing for years.
First off this is Xship-The DUAL BEARING support
Secondly, Xship is not something Shimano has been doing for years. It's relativity new to shimano within the past few years. Daiwa has been using this dual bearing supported gear (xship) around a decade (that's 10 years incase you can't research that either) before shimano coined it as Xship.
The Rooster reply :
Well X-ship apparently isn't very expensive to do because even my cheap $40 Pflueger Trion spinning reel from years ago has a double bearing supported pinion gear inside. Hopefully Shimano isn't building this up and charging a bunch extra for it.
bootytrain reply :
On 1/6/2014 at 6:58 AM, iabass8 said:First off this is Xship-The DUAL BEARING support
Secondly, Xship is not something Shimano has been doing for years. It's relativity new to shimano within the past few years. Daiwa has been using this dual bearing supported gear (xship) around a decade (that's 10 years incase you can't research that either) before shimano coined it as Xship.
I think the "short" free floating spool shaft design Daiwa uses necessitated a 3rd bearing by design, while Shimano could have stayed with a 2 bearing design and been perfectly fine since the spool shaft basically goes from one side of the reel to the other so you could get away with using only 2 bearings. I mean has any Shimano been lacking in smoothness and power before x ship? X ship just took it up a notch under load. My point is that Daiwa used the long shimano style spool shaft for the Tatula and added a bearing as the picture showed and Tackletour pointed it out in their review as to what they think the Air Rotation sensation really came from. I tend to believe them because Im pretty sure all reels(gears included) have been designed with CAD for the past 20 years or longer. So saying you "digitally designed" your gears makes me think marketing terminology. That being said, I hope the new Curado has X ship! lol
QUAKEnSHAKE reply :
On 1/6/2014 at 5:23 AM, bootytrain said:Xship does not require micro gears. Micro gears is just the size of the gear teeth. "X-Ship provides improved gear durability. By supporting the pinion gear on both ends with bearings, the pinion gear maintains precise alignment with the drive gear. This means the gears will stay in the same position under the heaviest loads..
Yes that I know and not what I was getting at.
Its that I think micro gears require the use of x-ship to do as you & I stated.
If micro gears didnt have the extra support given by x-ship the gears small teeth might misalign under load.
Smallmouth Hunter reply :
On 1/6/2014 at 6:58 AM, iabass8 said:First off this is Xship-The DUAL BEARING support
Secondly, Xship is not something Shimano has been doing for years. It's relativity new to shimano within the past few years. Daiwa has been using this dual bearing supported gear (xship) around a decade (that's 10 years incase you can't research that either)
before shimano coined it as Xship.Did you even read the post?? You're telling me I can't research something, and you can't even read a dang paragraph before you start bashing me over something that isn't even true. 
You are just repeating what I said.
I clearly stated SEVERAL times that x-ship is a double bearing supported pinion gear. Also, NEVER said x-ship has been used for years, I said they used the single bearing supported pinion gear (which daiwa calls air rotation) for a while now. I think ever since the D series..? Or maybe the SF reels were the first.. Not sure
Never knew that Daiwa used a dual bearing supported pinion gear though. I am guessing they use that on reels with a free-floating spool?
On 1/6/2014 at 6:53 AM, bootytrain said:The first pic shows a standard gear set vs a micro module gear set, not x ship. X ship is basically an extra bearing to support the pinion to keep it aligned under load. Shimano put X ship in the Calcutta D which does NOT have Micro gears. Micro gears came out with the new Antares. The Exsence DC has X ship but NOT micro gearing. You may want to watch this video to educate yourself.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=IvvBcfwEuic Because of the long spool shaft Shimano only really needs 2 bearings at the ends of the spools shafts like they normally have and still have a smooth and powerful retrieve. But the 3rd "x ship" bearing helps a lot under load.
Daiwas normally have a short "free floating" spool shaft so that's 2 different spool shaft designs, but in the Lexa and Tatula they went with a long spool shaft like Shimano. And since we are quoting Tackle Tour..
"In one of Daiwa's early "Project T" videos, they introduce the concept of "Air Rotation" by spinning the handle of a prototype Tatula and showing how freely that handle spins without additional assistance. Their marketing material claims this is enabled through more precise, digitally designed and cut gearing. When I viewed this feature, my immediate thought was they probably added another bearing to the pinion gear similar to the recent implementation by one of their competitors. There's little we can do to verify claims of precision gearing, but I did take the reel apart to see if I could find another bearing under the pinion gear. Lo and behold, there indeed are two bearings supporting the pinion which in and of itself could explain that new, smoother, Air Rotation sensation."
BTW those "Air Rotation" gears don't look any more precision cut than any other gears, Im gonna assume its just marketing hype by Daiwa.
Very interesting vid. Thanks for the link.
Pause it at 3:48. You will see the exact same pinion gear in that photo I posted above. It has a elongated flat section extending from the outer end (end facing away from inside). That is what the bearing rides on. The picture I posted does show x-ship in the right side gear set, and to prove it in case anyone is doubtful, the picture is from a review of the metanium (mm gearing and x-ship).
Air rotation can not be a dual bearing supported pinion gear. There is no room for another bearing on the pinion gear anyways:
The shown end of the pinion gear has no flat section for a bearing to ride on. There is another bearing in the sideplate next to this bearing, but it is not exactly supporting the pinion gear, per se.
I didn't mean to start up some huge argument, and I think we are all agreeing on the same thing here anyways. 
basshole8190 reply :
You darn reel guys have got me all kinds of confused over internal stuff inside the reels. give me a reel with high speed ratio that can cast a lure btween 3/8-1&1/2 oz smooth drag and easy to palm and call it a night
Grantman83 reply :
On 1/6/2014 at 10:00 AM, basshole8190 said:You darn reel guys have got me all kinds of confused over internal stuff inside the reels. give me a reel with high speed ratio that can cast a lure btween 3/8-1&1/2 oz smooth drag and easy to palm and call it a night
Ha but the bearing placement makes the reel smooth! It confuses me as well lol
Loop_Dad reply :
On 1/6/2014 at 10:00 AM, basshole8190 said:You darn reel guys have got me all kinds of confused over internal stuff inside the reels. give me a reel with high speed ratio that can cast a lure btween 3/8-1&1/2 oz smooth drag and easy to palm and call it a night
Yeah you guys are geeks 
bootytrain reply :
On 1/6/2014 at 8:49 AM, aprw1 said:Did you even read the post?? You're telling me I can't research something, and you can't even read a dang paragraph before you start bashing me over something that isn't even true.
You are just repeating what I said.
I clearly stated SEVERAL times that x-ship is a double bearing supported pinion gear. Also, NEVER said x-ship has been used for years, I said they used the single bearing supported pinion gear (which daiwa calls air rotation) for a while now. I think ever since the D series..? Or maybe the SF reels were the first.. Not sure
Never knew that Daiwa used a dual bearing supported pinion gear though. I am guessing they use that on reels with a free-floating spool?
Very interesting vid. Thanks for the link.
Pause it at 3:48. You will see the exact same pinion gear in that photo I posted above. It has a elongated flat section extending from the outer end (end facing away from inside). That is what the bearing rides on. The picture I posted does show x-ship in the right side gear set, and to prove it in case anyone is doubtful, the picture is from a review of the metanium (mm gearing and x-ship).
Air rotation can not be a dual bearing supported pinion gear. There is no room for another bearing on the pinion gear anyways:
The shown end of the pinion gear has no flat section for a bearing to ride on. There is another bearing in the sideplate next to this bearing, but it is not exactly supporting the pinion gear, per se.
I didn't mean to start up some huge argument, and I think we are all agreeing on the same thing here anyways.
This is the picture that is directly under the picture you posted from the Tackle Tour review of the Tatula where they find the extra bearing lol.. how did you miss that?
Micro Module is just smaller teeth for more contact points and does not require x ship.
I wasn't trying to argue either I just spend a lot of time on the TT forums and Bantam 1 gets a ton of these questions in the shimano support forum and does a lot of explanation on Shimano tech
Smallmouth Hunter reply :
On 1/6/2014 at 10:41 AM, bootytrain said:This is the picture that is directly under the picture you posted from the Tackle Tour review of the Tatula where they find the extra bearing lol.. how did you miss that?
Micro Module is just smaller teeth for more contact points and does not require x ship.
I wasn't trying to argue either
I didn't miss that. Heck, I have taken the tatula apart 4-5 times now and even cleaned that bearing myself. I knew quite well there was a bearing there. Hasn't this is design been used by Shimano for a few years now (since I believe the SF reels)?
There is a bearing on the end of the pinion gear that points towards the spool (which the pinion gear obviously rides inside during retrieve), but there is not a second bearing (on the opposite end) which the pinion gear would ride in and therefore, air rotation is not the same thing as x-ship because x-ship is when the pinion gear rides on two bearings.
QUAKEnSHAKE reply :
What shimano reel has Micro Modular Gearing but not X-ship???
bootytrain reply :
On 1/6/2014 at 10:59 AM, aprw1 said:I didn't miss that. Heck, I have taken the tatula apart 4-5 times now and even cleaned that bearing myself. I knew quite well there was a bearing there. Hasn't this is design been used by Shimano for a few years now (since I believe the SF reels)?
There is a bearing on the end of the pinion gear that points towards the spool (which the pinion gear obviously rides inside during retrieve), but there is not a second bearing (on the opposite end) which the pinion gear would ride in and therefore, air rotation is not the same thing as x-ship because x-ship is when the pinion gear rides on two bearings.
Just curious, what does that bearing support then? Theres no bearing under the cast control cap? Im not sure of the older model shimanos because Ive only started using baitcasters recently. But other than the Met, Exsence and Aldebaran BFS, my shimanos only have 2 bearings supporting the spool. One under the cast control and one on the other side in the palming side plate. Im looking forward to getting a Tatula
bootytrain reply :
On 1/6/2014 at 11:11 AM, QUAKEnSHAKE said:What shimano reel has Micro Modular Gearing but not X-ship???
None
QUAKEnSHAKE reply :
On 1/6/2014 at 11:11 AM, QUAKEnSHAKE said:What shimano reel has Micro Modular Gearing but not X-ship???
On 1/6/2014 at 11:16 AM, bootytrain said:None
And thus my reasoning that Micro Modular Gearing requires the use of x-ship which utilizes bearing supported pinion.
They have to use extra bracing for those smaller teeth and its the x-ship that is the extra bracing.
No x-ship = no MMG
*Hootie reply :
I started this topic, now I am bored to tears with it.....lol. Totally lost interest in it......BYE.
Hootie
Smallmouth Hunter reply :
On 1/6/2014 at 11:14 AM, bootytrain said:Just curious, what does that bearing support then? Theres no bearing under the cast control cap? Im not sure of the older model shimanos because Ive only started using baitcasters recently. But other than the Met, Exsence and Aldebaran BFS, my shimanos only have 2 bearings supporting the spool. One under the cast control and one on the other side in the palming side plate. Im looking forward to getting a Tatula
There is a bearing under the cast control but you have to go to the other side of the sideplate to get to it. The diameter of the inner race is very small (fits the spool shaft obviously) so it doesn't exactly support the bearing. If you look at a shimano reel with x-ship, it has 2 bearings under the spool tension knob (may be on other side of the sideplate) where the one closest to the pinion gear has a large diameter to fit on the pinion gear, and the outer bearing (they are next to eachother if I remember correctly) is a spool bearing to fit the spool shaft.
The tatula with air rotation does not have the extra bearing under the spool tension, just the one spool bearing. The only bearing that is supporting the pinion gear is obviously the bearing that was in that pic you posted.
The older model shimanos (b series) have no bearing on the pinion gear. They started using a single bearing on it in I believe the SF reels.
bootytrain reply :
I should have said spool tension instead of cast control because to me they are the same thing lol. I have 2 xship reels and there's only 1 bearing directly under the cc knob. The xship bearing is closer to the spool. In any event I think its 2 different ways to get to one goal :-) its just more plausible to me that that extra bearing in the tatula would contribute to the air rotation feeling instead of claiming its caused by digitally designed gears. Good debate though!On 1/6/2014 at 7:46 PM, aprw1 said:There is a bearing under the cast control but you have to go to the other side of the sideplate to get to it. The diameter of the inner race is very small (fits the spool shaft obviously) so it doesn't exactly support the bearing. If you look at a shimano reel with x-ship, it has 2 bearings under the spool tension knob (may be on other side of the sideplate) where the one closest to the pinion gear has a large diameter to fit on the pinion gear, and the outer bearing (they are next to eachother if I remember correctly) is a spool bearing to fit the spool shaft.
The tatula with air rotation does not have the extra bearing under the spool tension, just the one spool bearing. The only bearing that is supporting the pinion gear is obviously the bearing that was in that pic you posted.
The older model shimanos (b series) have no bearing on the pinion gear. They started using a single bearing on it in I believe the SF reels.
QUAKEnSHAKE reply :
On 1/6/2014 at 5:11 PM, hootiebenji said:I started this topic, now I am bored to tears with it.....lol. Totally lost interest in it......BYE.
Hootie
LOL would it be better to banter about a new color for the curado you know something important not like its features.
I say drop the green go medium blue with maybe some yellow accented caps, spool, handle and just rename it the Shimano CHARGER,
Smallmouth Hunter reply :
On 1/6/2014 at 11:53 PM, bootytrain said:I should have said spool tension instead of cast control because to me they are the same thing lol. I have 2 xship reels and there's only 1 bearing directly under the cc knob. The xship bearing is closer to the spool. In any event I think its 2 different ways to get to one goal :-) its just more plausible to me that that extra bearing in the tatula would contribute to the air rotation feeling instead of claiming its caused by digitally designed gears. Good debate though!
Does the inner race of that bearing fit the pinion gear or the spool shaft? I saw a parts diagram of the ci4+ and it looked like there was 2 bearings under the cast control knob (between the CC knob and the pinion gear, not just right under it). Maybe it was a spacer or something and I just saw it wrong..
When you say the extra bearing, are you comparing it to a lexa (or other low end daiwa that uses a full spool shaft, not FF spool) with no bearing here:
The lexa does not have this bearing here and the pinion sits loosely in the yoke (like it did in the B series curados/citica, etc).
When I opened up the tatula for the first time, and saw this bearing here, I immediately though that this is what air rotation is. There is no second bearing on the other end of the pinion in the tatula though, other than the spool bearing which is found under the CC knob (not accessible from outside of sideplate). The inner race diameter of this spool bearing is small, and fits right on to the spool shaft, not the pinion. It does not even make contact with the pinion at any point I believe. That is why I say it is not supporting the pinion directly.
When you say there is only one bearing under the tension knob on the Shimano reels with x-ship, do you mean directly under the knob? What about on the other side of the handle sideplate? Is there another bearing that fits onto the pinion gear?
tomustang reply :
On 1/7/2014 at 12:28 AM, QUAKEnSHAKE said:rename it the Shimano CHARGER,
If they call it that they better have 4 side plates on it
bootytrain reply :
You should pull that bearing out and see if it makes a difference in the retrieve vs with it in? I don't want to go off topic in this thread anymore but I'll break down my curado tonite and send you a PM. :-)On 1/7/2014 at 3:31 AM, aprw1 said:Does the inner race of that bearing fit the pinion gear or the spool shaft? I saw a parts diagram of the ci4+ and it looked like there was 2 bearings under the cast control knob (between the CC knob and the pinion gear, not just right under it). Maybe it was a spacer or something and I just saw it wrong..
When you say the extra bearing, are you comparing it to a lexa (or other low end daiwa that uses a full spool shaft, not FF spool) with no bearing here:
The lexa does not have this bearing here and the pinion sits loosely in the yoke (like it did in the B series curados/citica, etc).
When I opened up the tatula for the first time, and saw this bearing here, I immediately though that this is what air rotation is. There is no second bearing on the other end of the pinion in the tatula though, other than the spool bearing which is found under the CC knob (not accessible from outside of sideplate). The inner race diameter of this spool bearing is small, and fits right on to the spool shaft, not the pinion. It does not even make contact with the pinion at any point I believe. That is why I say it is not supporting the pinion directly.
When you say there is only one bearing under the tension knob on the Shimano reels with x-ship, do you mean directly under the knob? What about on the other side of the handle sideplate? Is there another bearing that fits onto the pinion gear?
aavery2 reply :
On 1/7/2014 at 3:46 AM, bootytrain said:You should pull that bearing out and see if it makes a difference in the retrieve vs with it in? I don't want to go off topic in this thread anymore but I'll break down my curado tonite and send you a PM. :-)[/quoteThis bearing supports the pinion and not the spool. Think about it how could the pinion pass through this bearing and engage the spool shaft pin if the hole in this bearing was the size of the spool shaft. The spool shaft passes through the i.d. of the pinion. This is the same as the Shimano SF design.
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