If you had to go no fluoro or braid... 2024

Finnz922 reply :

I'm considering eliminating all fluoro and braid from all my setups other than i will be keeping braid on my punching and frogging setups. I'm thinking about using all Sunline monos but would be open to suggestions. SuperNatural for everything other than flipping which would be Defier Armilo. Oh, and crankbaits will be Defier.

Anyone done this before? Did you notice any difference? Or were happy you changed?

burrows reply :

I use copoly on most of my reels?

Swamp Rat reply :

copoly...more versatile than mono

JustinJ reply :

Trilene xl on my spinning reels and Berkley big game on my casting reels. Tried all different lines and always go back to the Berkley products. I only use braid for frogging and punching

CroakHunter reply :

P-line cxx.

Raul reply :

I never really went fluoro or braid, right now I only have one reel with braided line.

burrows reply :

On 10/29/2017 at 11:08 AM, CroakHunter said:

P-line cxx.

P-line cx premium

moguy1973 reply :

On 10/29/2017 at 11:51 AM, Burro said:

P-line cx premium

^this

By far my favorite line.

Scarborough817 reply :

If i had braid for my frogging and flipping i would be fine with yo-zuri hybrid and big game on the rest of my reels

Bluebasser86 reply :

I use a lot of mono and copolymer, even for things it "won't work" for. Trilene Big Game, Pline C21 and CXX, Gamma copoly, and recently started messing with Hi-Seas flourocarbon coated copolymer and really liking it so far.

A-Jay reply :

A while back @WRB mentioned that he liked Sunline Shooter Defier Armilo Nylon Line, so I tried it.

I Really like it - as a non-Fluorocarbon option it's solid.

(Thanks Tom )

Sort of fishes like fluorocarbon, especially sensitivity wise, I think this one does float however.

Either way, been throwing it for two months, been very successful.

Enough in fact that I plan on using the 22 & 25lb south of the border next week.

A-Jay

thinkingredneck reply :

Maxima chamelean is one I like. I also used Mustad line that I bought out west. Simply fantastic. Both are tough as nails.

BassWhole! reply :

I use mono on everything except frogs and some cases in heavy cover, or when vertical jigging in sticky bottom. Mostly its Big Game on baitcasters, and XL on spinning. There are several quality monos out there, These are just what work for me, and what I'm used to. While flouro does have greater sensitivity, I find its just not that big a deal for me to put up with all its shortcomings. I only use it for leaders in some situations in salt water where clear water and truely line shy fish make it advantegeous.

Fishin' Fool reply :

If I had to go no fluoro or braid I'd go..........home. Just kidding, add me to the P-Line co-polymer group.

Dtrombly reply :

P-line Fluroclear copolymer. Love it, I use it in 15lb on my jig rod and my spinnerbait rod.

kschultz76 reply :

On 10/29/2017 at 6:15 PM, A-Jay said:

A while back @WRB mentioned that he liked Sunline Shooter Defier Armilo Nylon Line, so I tried it.

I Really like it - as a non-Fluorocarbon option it's solid.

(Thanks Tom )

Sort of fishing like fluorocarbon, especially sensitivity wise, I think this one does float however.

Either was, been throwing it for two months, been very successful.

Enough in fact that I plan on using the 22 & 25lb south of the border next week.

A-Jay

^ This!

WRB reply :

On 10/29/2017 at 6:15 PM, A-Jay said:

A while back @WRB mentioned that he liked Sunline Shooter Defier Armilo Nylon Line, so I tried it.

I Really like it - as a non-Fluorocarbon option it's solid.

(Thanks Tom )

Sort of fishing like fluorocarbon, especially sensitivity wise, I think this one does float however.

Either was, been throwing it for two months, been very successful.

Enough in fact that I plan on using the 22 & 25lb south of the border next week.

A-Jay

For bottom contact lures Sunline Shooter Diefer coploy mono (green) has good feedback and abrasion resistance. Maxima Ultra Green 5 lb has been a good finesse line, the 8 lb is closer to 10 lb FC diameter pushing a 2000 size spinning reel do to line memory.

Still use the Diefer 25 lb Nylon for my swimbaits.

Tom

Hulkster reply :

I really like using Sufix Siege mono in smoke green colour.

FrankN209 reply :

YoZuri hybrid for me..

Catt reply :

Berkley Big Game Mean Green ????

The abrasion resistance & shock absorption of Big Game is unmatched by any!

Angry John reply :

YHB 6-15lb for normal applications 20lb for swim baits and 50 lb braid for frogs and punching. I love to hate fluorocarbon...... 14lb Berkeley xl for top waters.

NorthernBasser reply :

On 10/30/2017 at 11:18 AM, Catt said:

Berkley Big Game Mean Green ????

The abrasion resistance & shock absorption of Big Game is unmatched by any!

What's the main difference between Big Game and Trilene XL? Thanks.

Catt reply :

On 10/30/2017 at 1:12 PM, NorthernBasser said:

What's the main difference between Big Game and Trilene XL? Thanks.

Trilene XL: Extra Limp

Supposed to limit coiling

Trilene XT: Extra Tough

Supposed to be more abrasive resistant

craww reply :

Yozuri Hybrid in appropriate diameters. Some will argue this- but KVD L+L helps tremendously the night before.

NorthernBasser reply :

On 10/30/2017 at 5:41 PM, Catt said:

Trilene XL: Extra Limp

Supposed to limit coiling

Trilene XT: Extra Tough

Supposed to be more abrasive resistant

Thanks. But these I know.

My question is the difference between Big Game and Trilene XT. I use both XL and XT, but have never used Big Game. I see a lot of people like it. I'm wondering what the advantages is over XT.

J Francho reply :

The best mono I've used is Seaguar Rippin'.

Darren. reply :

If I had to go no fluoro or braid and to only a mono line,

I'd probably go back to Trilene XL... Was easiest to deal

with on my spinning gear, never used on casting, though.

However, since copoly is a choice, that's where I'd go.

Specifically Yo-Zuri Hybrid and P-Line Floroclear.

Finnz922 reply :

On 10/30/2017 at 10:25 PM, J Francho said:

The best mono I've used is Seaguar Rippin'.

I was looking at this. How is the abrasion resistance?

J Francho reply :

Haven't encountered any issues, so it's hard to say anything other than typical. It is a smaller diameter line, so if you're looking for extra protection, you can step up a size. Been using 6, 12, and 20.

FrankN209 reply :

On 10/30/2017 at 9:04 PM, craww said:

Yozuri Hybrid in appropriate diameters. Some will argue this- but KVD L+L helps tremendously the night before.

Yepp. Right now I'm using 8lb on my Steez. I never go above 12lb.

DINK WHISPERER reply :

P-line CXX or Izorline XXX

Choporoz reply :

On 10/29/2017 at 10:06 AM, Finnz922 said:

I'm considering eliminating all fluoro and braid from all my setups other than...punching and frogging setups.

How come?

Djohn reply :

If i can't use braid or floro I would use Copolymer. I have no use for mono. These other lines can do everything better.

Finnz922 reply :

On 10/31/2017 at 12:02 AM, Choporoz said:

How come?

I have always doubted that fluorocarbon is really that much better than mono; outside of water absorption and it's effects. I have read the articles and once surface tension is broken, I just don't see how in the course it takes to real a lure back in that line sinking will actually make a difference. Jerkbaits is about the only technique I could see this being worth it or maybe "spybaiting". Both techniques that I don't use hardly ever. Line shy fish and refraction scores are another area I just can't wrap my head around. I have used braid enough and so have many others in clear water and have seen little to no effect. So outside of it being denser thus maybe causing it to be "more sensitive" which may be true but mostly subjective and then you have to throw in what technique, what rod, and my own ability to feel. I just don't know if it really makes that big of a difference. I'm spending a ton of money to buy 200yds or so and was looking to save a little. I was going to do it anyway, I just thought it would be interesting to see what others think and if anyone else has gone this route. Especially after using fluoro for awhile.

All that being said, I do have a couple of duplicate combos that I am planning on fishing one with mono and one with fluoro just to see if I can feel the difference. I'm actually hoping since I doubt fluoro that it won't blind me from the real world evidence. I think some folks just drink the Kool-aid so to speak and hope that I haven't been one of them. And in the end if fluoro does seem better then I guess I will just spend the extra money.

Choporoz reply :

Interesting.

I went from nearly 100% Yo Zuri Hybrid a few years ago, to mostly braid now.

I'm still adjusting and weighing cost/benefits of various lines/presentations.

Today, I use YZH with (KVD spray) on my 'cranking' rods. I use Gliss 12#, with or without leader, on my lighter spinning outfts. I use braid (generally braid/leader) on everything else; primarily 20#-50#.

I have never even tried higher end (expensive) flouro. I've put Tatsu in online shopping carts on many occasions and just couldn't pull the trigger. I don't have zebra mussels, and braid and Gliss have been plenty abrasion resistant for my applications. I don't always love using leaders, but the positives have outweighed the negatives thus far.

Turtle135 reply :

On 10/30/2017 at 10:08 PM, NorthernBasser said:

My question is the difference between Big Game and Trilene XT. I use both XL and XT, but have never used Big Game. I see a lot of people like it. I'm wondering what the advantages is over XT.

Take a look at the diameter by pound test.

Trilene XT 12 pound test: .38 mm

Big Game 12 pound test: .36 mm

Trilene XT 10 pound test: .35 mm

Big Game 10 pound test: .31 mm

Trilene XT is touted as one of the stronger lines on the market. I believe that is largely due to the fact that XT's actual break strength is much higher than what they list on the package. Comparing XT to other mono lines of equal "listed" break strength you will almost always find that XT is a much thicker line. That thickness likely increases XT's abrasion resistance.

I fish with Trilene XT all the time but if you spooled up a reel with Big Game that had the same diameter I doubt I could tell the difference between the two. I am just very familiar with XT and I adjust the pound test up and down for the conditions (cover type, air and water temperature, how deep a particular crankbait will dive, etc.).

Finnz922 reply :

On 10/31/2017 at 12:54 AM, Turtle135 said:

Take a look at the diameter by pound test.

Trilene XT 12 pound test: .38 mm

Big Game 12 pound test: .36 mm

Trilene XT 10 pound test: .35 mm

Big Game 10 pound test: .31 mm

Trilene XT is touted as one of the stronger lines on the market. I believe that is largely due to the fact that XT's actual break strength is much higher than what they list on the package. Comparing XT to other mono lines of equal "listed" break strength you will almost always find that XT is a much thicker line. That thickness likely increases XT's abrasion resistance.

I fish with Trilene XT all the time but if you spooled up a reel with Big Game that had the same diameter I doubt I could tell the difference between the two. I am just very familiar with XT and I adjust the pound test up and down for the conditions (cover type, air and water temperature, how deep a particular crankbait will dive, etc.).

Just wondering... Is Big Game's actual 10lb break strength around .31mm? Some argue that Sunline is one of the most trusted because their break strength actually is very near the diameter. They don't underrate lines to claim higher break strength.

Turtle135 reply :

On 10/31/2017 at 1:36 AM, Finnz922 said:

Is Big Game's actual 10lb break strength around .31mm?

.31mm (millimeters) is the "diameter" of the line that they list for Big Game 10 pound test.

Most of the tests I have read show Big Game breaking several pounds heavier than rated when looking at the 10, 12 and 15 pound test versions of that line. This is generally a good thing for most bass fishing situations and a bad thing for someone chasing a line class world record.

WRB reply :

You all realize that Yo-Zuri Hybrid is a hybrid co extruded line not a copolymer line, same with Fluoro Clear and High Seas mentioned. So what is the difference between a copolymer line on or a hybrid line on this site?

Berkley Big Game is a copolymer line, Treline XT is a single polymer Nylon line with UV inhibitors added and 1 size larger diameter per lb test than XL.

Note; Ande gave away spools of monofilament line to off shore tournament anglers during the 80's and 90's, smart marketing. To claim a line class IGFA record the main line, not the leader, must break at or below the labeled strength, all tackle records there isn't a line break strength requirement.

Tom

Turtle135 reply :

On 10/31/2017 at 1:58 AM, WRB said:

Berkley Big Game is a copolymer line, Trilene XT is a single polymer Nylon line with UV inhibitors added and 1 size larger diameter per lb test than XL.

Hmmm, according to Tackle Warehouse Trilene Big game is monofilament, Trilene XL is a copolymer and Trilene XT is monofilament. On Berkley's site they all come up under the monofilament sub category (they do not have a copolymer sub category). I always thought all three were just plain mono.

Mike L reply :

No braid or Flouro....I'd use YZ Hybrid.

I'll use mono only to hang pictures on a wall.

Mike

WRB reply :

Technically all single filament lines are "mono" meaning single filament or 1 strand,i.e.; "monofilament" line. Braid is multiple filaments, each strand made up of several filaments then each strand is spooled onto a spindle or a single spindle can have more then 1 strand, the spindle attached to a carrier that can also multiple spindles, usually 4 carriers to 8 carriers. Braid is made up of hundreds of tiny filaments twisted and braided into a line.

To distinguish between monofilament lines the line companies started marking Nylon line as monofilament and Nylon line with another polymer like polyester or another type of Nylon blended as copolymer line. Easy to keep seperate until fluorocarbon line hits the market. FC is more expensive to make so it needs it's own identity although it is a monofilament line made from a polymer.

In the 80's every line maker offered copolymer line, Stren, Trilene, Ande, Maxima, P-Line with names like Silver a Thread, Ultra Green, CXX, etc. The copolymer blends offered softer, harder, stronger monofilament line as advertisements stated. Softer line with less memory being promoted for spinning reels, harder more abrasion resistant for baitcasting reels, etc, etc.

What to do with FC blended line or blended copolymer line with FC co extruded jackets?

FC was brittle with poor knot strength and expensive to make so the line folks started to blend FC with polyuerathane or polyester like they did with Nylon and gave the blends new names or called it 100% FC, all marketed as FC line. Yo-Zuri comes out with the 1st co-extruded Line with copolymer core and FC jacket marketing this new line type as "Hybrid" because it is a hybrid monofilament line. Yo-Zuri coextrusion process ends up with a larger diameter line and they realize the marketing advantage of under rating the line label strength to eliminate the problem plaguing the FC line market, poor knot strength and it works. Bass anglers adopt the hybrid as thick line vs thin line.

Sorry for the long winded rant.

Tom

J Francho reply :

^Similar to comparing IPT, not gear ratios, I look at diameter rather than "test." I don't see it as a rant, rather than the frustration of why so many don't read between the lines, and pay attention to the specs.

The ranges in size are nuts.

"10#"

YZ Hybrid: .012

Seaguar Rippin': .010

CXX: .014

XL: .011

OG Stren: .012

Sufix Elite: .012

Defier (11#) .011

Out of those, Defier and Rippin' are very close to their stated "test" and breaking strength. CXX is thick, but you can tell, and I drop a size. So, 10 fishes like 12# and breaks around 15.

Steveo-1969 reply :

I just started my own experiment a month ago replacing fluorocarbon mainline with mono. I was inspired by a post from @WRB. I fish a shallow rocky river by wading or from shore 99% of the time and really only use 2 rods. A ML spinning rod and a M baitcasting rod.

The spinning rod has 10# braid and a leader of leftover mainline from the baitcaster (10# fluorocarbon). I'm happy with this and am not switching from braid, though the leader material may change.

I have always used 10# fluorocarbon on the baitcasting rod and just experimented with various brands. While all the lines I've tried handled pretty well (especially with KVD Line & Lure conditioner) I go through a spool fairly quickly because if I feel a nick in the line I retie. And if I backlash and then feel a kink in the line I get paranoid and strip line until the kink is gone and retie. My small reel only holds 100 yards of 10# line and it goes quick. So I thought what if I could find a line that handled/casted better than fluoro, was more abrasion resistant than fluoro, and was as sensitive as fluoro for bottom contact? Is fluoro really more sensitive or am I just buying into marketing hype? Thus my experiment. Lots of rocks and snags in my river so abrasion resistance is easy to test. For sensitivity I'm throwing a 3/16 ounce finesse jig, the same jig I've been using for the past couple years. I'm very familiar with how it "feels" on the bottom.

First line I tried was 10# Spiderwire Ultimate Mono because of some threads on BR. Casting/handling was great, sensitivity was not good compared to fluoro, abrasion resistance was TERRIBLE!

Second line I tried was 8# Berkley Trilene XL Armor Coated. I picked 8# because it was about the same diameter as the 10# fluoro and the 10# Spiderwire. It handled well and was more abrasion resistant than the Spiderwire, though still not great. And sensitivity compared to fluoro was still very disappointing. Sigh, maybe mono just isn't the answer for me!

Latest line I tried is 10# Berkley Trilene XL Armor Coated. It's thicker than I usually use, but still handled/casted well. Noticeably more abrasion resistant than the other two monos or fluoro I've tried. And slightly more sensitive than the other two monos, but still night/day difference compared to the sensitivity of fluorocarbon. So (at least for me) it seems the hype of fluorocarbon being more sensitive than mono is true. I also started experimenting with holding the rod differently so I could run the line over my index finger which I normally don't do. Jury is still out on whether I can get used to this or not.

I'm going to keep using the 10# Armor Coated until it's gone, don't know what I'm going to do after that. I need good handling, abrasion resistance, sensitivity, cost effectiveness. Keep using it? Try Berkley Iron Silk? Try some kind of hybrid line? Just go back to fluoro? Bite the bullet and buy Tatsu? No idea, but it's all part of the fun.

HookRz reply :

Gamma Polyflex!

.ghoti. reply :

On 10/30/2017 at 10:25 PM, J Francho said:

The best mono I've used is Seaguar Rippin'.

I like this line a lot. Been using 10 and 12.

clh121787 reply :

Why? What if your Aunt had a set of nuts?

WRB reply :

Between 1958 to 1988 we didn't have to make the decision of Fluorocarbon line or super braids because they were not available to the general fishing public. We had Dacron braid that few bass anglers used beyond the 70's except in lakes with toothy fish. We only had monofilament line, DuPont Stren, Berkley Trilene and Maxima were the dominate choices. Big Game was 1st introduced as a salt water line starting at 12 lb test to 80 lbs test on 1/4 lb & 1 lb spools to complete with Ande mono in the 80's.

After nearly 30 years using mono and catching 90% of my giant bass I tried FC line for nearly 30 years. Today I am reversing and going back to monofilament Nylon and copolymer lines.

Tom

BassWhole! reply :

On 10/31/2017 at 1:36 AM, Finnz922 said:

Just wondering... Is Big Game's actual 10lb break strength around .31mm? Some argue that Sunline is one of the most trusted because their break strength actually is very near the diameter. They don't underrate lines to claim higher break strength.

Big Game 10 lb test is .012" (.305mm), but that's just what the label says. I have some really good micrometers from work I used to do in a previous life (not related to fishing), and it measures a tad more.

Further North reply :

If someone told me I had to not use braid or fluoro...I'd lie to them.

All types of line have their place. I can't see any reason to avoid any of the line types.

Catt reply :

On 10/30/2017 at 10:08 PM, NorthernBasser said:

Thanks. But these I know.

My question is the difference between Big Game and Trilene XT. I use both XL and XT, but have never used Big Game. I see a lot of people like it. I'm wondering what the advantages is over XT.

As far as the process to make each I don't know but for me the abrasion resistance & shock absorption of Big Game is why I prefer it.

WRB reply :

You need to measure line about every inch over a foot and divide by the number of measurements to get an average. Line diameter varies because line isn't round as you think it should be or consistant diameter.

Tom

Jason Penn reply :

I don't really buy into fc being more sensitive by itself, but because of the sink rate I feel more connected with bottom baits. I've tried using braid, either straight or with a leader, and just haven't been able to get on with it. If there was a mono/copolymer that was denser, I really don't think you'd be able to tell much difference.

The whole invisible thing, really doesn't matter to me. I've seen a ton of crappie caught using gold stren

Bucky205 reply :

I like Stren clear blue fluorescent on most things, shows up really well under a UV light at night. Fluorocarbon is good other than the expense and the memory. It's just not worth the difference to me.

Team9nine reply :

To the OP, if all nylon/copoly makes your fishing life happy, more power to you. As someone mentioned, there was a time when we all fished that way since modern braids and fluoro weren't available, yet we still caught fish.

To those doubting the sensitivity advantage of fluoro over nylons...your loss

Todd2 reply :

On 10/31/2017 at 9:18 PM, Bucky205 said:

I like Stren clear blue fluorescent on most things, shows up really well under a UV light at night. Fluorocarbon is good other than the expense and the memory. It's just not worth the difference to me.

I really like Stren CBF, I just recently switched a couple rods over to Spiderwire EZ Mono in CBF and I think I like it a little more..seems a little more sensitive and has a little less stretch. Both are great lines.

Braid is not for me, I like the sensitivity of fluoro and there is no doubt it's a little more sensitive than mono. But knot strength (especially lighter line), manageability, and price are why I stay with mono. Not to mention I like that blue. To each their own.

DSTN reply :

I only use a handful of combos and am too...ummm...frugal to have one using fluoro main line. It's all up to an individuals perception but the times I have used fluoro main line I did notice more feedback than my usual Sufix Siege line. To me whether fluoro is worth the cost comes down to whether or not you are able to utilize it's characteristics to your advantage.

Steveo-1969 reply :

On 10/31/2017 at 3:54 AM, HookRz said:

Gamma Polyflex!

Do I need to add this monofilament to my testing list? After my very limited testing with three different monos it looks like handling and cost are no brainers. Abrasion resistance was better with the 10# Berkley Trilene XL Armor Coated than any 10# fluoro line I've used. I think sensitivity compared to fluorocarbon is going to be the most difficulty criteria to obtain.

Mike L reply :

On 10/31/2017 at 9:51 PM, Team9nine said:

To the OP, if all nylon/copoly makes your fishing life happy, more power to you. As someone mentioned, there was a time when we all fished that way since modern braids and fluoro weren't available, yet we still caught fish.

To those doubting the sensitivity advantage of fluoro over nylons...your loss

Ditto

Mike

HookRz reply :

On 11/1/2017 at 4:02 AM, Steveo-1969 said:

Do I need to add this monofilament to my testing list? After my very limited testing with three different monos it looks like handling and cost are no brainers. Abrasion resistance was better with the 10# Berkley Trilene XL Armor Coated than any 10# fluoro line I've used. I think sensitivity compared to fluorocarbon is going to be the most difficulty criteria to obtain.

Less memory than any copoly Ive used, strong as CXX.

DTack reply :

If I had to, Maxima Ultragreen.

HookRz reply :

On 11/2/2017 at 6:19 AM, DTack said:

If I had to, Maxima Ultragreen.

I used to love Maxima 3# for panfish finesse before braid replaced everything on all my spinning reels. Handled well, thin as many 2# lines, and broke closer to 6. Great stuff.

Great ice fishing line for those that suffer the affliction.

2287

If you had to go no fluoro or braid... 2024

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