Trolling for bass, good or evil? 2024
Hawkeye21 reply :
I've noticed in another forum that trolling seems to be the devil when it comes to bass fishing. It's like some irrational sense that's it's not what bass fishing is all about or that it's cheating. What are your thoughts on it?
I meant to post this in the General Fishing Forum.
IndianaFinesse reply :
My thoughts on it is that trolling is not cheating, in fact it is actually harder to master than casting is. Trolling is not randomly dragging a lure behind the boat. You don't hear of many people trolling for bass simply because it is not allowed in tournaments, and like it or not professional tournaments have a huge impact on most people and the fishing industry. I think bass tournaments (and bass fishing in general) would look more like walleye tournaments if trolling had been allowed. It is a great tool for learning new waters and locating fish, and if possible should be used along with casting.
BrianinMD reply :
boring.......zzzzzz...
OCdockskipper reply :
Like many others, I don't troll because I get bored with it. I enjoy making pinpoint casts, using different lures and other activities associated with OCD.
However, I think on many waters, trolling for bass may not be the most effective. Since LMB are more cover oriented than pelagic, other presentations are often more productive.
BTW, the first bass I ever caught was trolling a weightless red Mister Twister plastic worm (hook exposed) through the middle of a weed bed. At the time, I thought it was a good idea...
JustinCT reply :
I've caught bass trolling but that was really by mistake as I was targeting trout, and it was years ago. I haven't trolled in a long time. As noted above, it's not real exciting to me and my boat is not setup to support trolling. I don't think there's really anything wrong with it, to each their own.
Hawkeye21 reply :
Reason I brought this up is because in some kayak bass fishing tournaments it is allowed and some people seem to be upset about it. I found it interesting because every single person that didn't like it didn't have an actual legitimate reason as to why it should be allowed. Their only reasons were because the boat tourneys don't allow it and they personally felt it was wrong.
J Francho reply :
Typical human behavior: fear what you do not understand. It's actually HARD to go slow enough in a kayak to effectively get into that sweet 3/4 - 1 mph zone, and stay there. Never mind the mechanics of well executed trolling.
BrianinMD reply :
Honestly don't care if it was allowed or not, just find it very boring same as sitting and dunking live bait. Just not for me.
Hawkeye21 reply :
On 4/5/2017 at 3:06 AM, BrianinMD said:Honestly don't care if it was allowed or not, just find it very boring same as sitting and dunking live bait. Just not for me.
I agree. I honestly don't really think of it as being as effective as most other techniques. The one big advantage of it for kayak fishermen is that it allows us to continue fishing while moving to another spot to fish. Very different from trolling on a boat since kayaks are pretty much at trolling speed all the time.
J Francho reply :
On 4/5/2017 at 3:09 AM, Hawkeye21 said:The one big advantage of it for kayak fishermen is that it allows us to continue fishing while moving to another spot to fish.
There's the rub.... I can paddle my C140 3.5-4 mph using VERY little effort. Optimal speed for most bass baits is one quarter that speed.
When I fished Lake Ontario, it was like being confronted with a huge barren desert. Trolling (in a traditional deep-v lake boat) was a good way to locate large groups of smallmouth. Catch three in a short amount of time, and we'd anchor up in the area, and drown tubes.
IndianaFinesse reply :
On 4/5/2017 at 3:09 AM, Hawkeye21 said:
I agree. I honestly don't really think of it as being as effective as most other techniques.
Tell that to all of the giant bass Buck Perry and other spoonpluggers caught while or because of trolling.
Hawkeye21 reply :
On 4/5/2017 at 4:00 AM, IndianaFinesse said:Tell that to all of the giant bass Buck Perry and other spoonpluggers caught while or because of trolling.
I'm not saying it doesn't work, it's just not my primary technique for catching bass. I have no issue with allowing trolling to catch bass. Pros basically already do it with long lining strategies right now.
RoLo reply :
Trolling for any game fish can be a very productive method.
By no means cheating, trolling is NOT a mindless approach, which better describes chucking & winding.
When properly executed, trolling involves a great deal of knowledge and specialized gear.
I've had excellent success trolling in fresh and saltwater, which makes me ask myself:
why don't I troll more often? I admit that I lack the necessary patience to troll properly,
but more than that I don't like putting out my fishing partner, who also lacks the patience to troll
Roger
IndianaFinesse reply :
On 4/5/2017 at 4:02 AM, Hawkeye21 said:
I'm not saying it doesn't work, it's just not my primary technique for catching bass. I have no issue with allowing trolling to catch bass. Pros basically already do it with long lining strategies right now.
It's not mine either, as I prefer to cast once they are located, are in shallow areas hard to troll in, or if I already understand the structure I'm fishing and have shoreline sitings for the breaks used and the contact point. But it is a handy tool for figuring out new lakes quickly.
Subaqua Adinterim reply :
On 4/5/2017 at 3:09 AM, Hawkeye21 said:
I agree. I honestly don't really think of it as being as effective as most other techniques. The one big advantage of it for kayak fishermen is that it allows us to continue fishing while moving to another spot to fish. Very different from trolling on a boat since kayaks are pretty much at trolling speed all the time.
I have found that the benefit of trolling from a kayak is that your speed is not at all constant. If you are like me, your paddling is sometimes erratic, i.e., from time to time you will pause for a second or two or three. This erratic motion of your lure may be the secret to triggering a strike. I have caught bass trolling tubes, rapalas, spinners; whatever I have tied on at the time. Definitely a good idea to maximize your time on the water by trolling from one spot to another while in your kayak.
Angry John reply :
Trolling from a yak opens up a lot of opertunity for me. When it's real windy I get to dragging a plug instead of just getting blown all over the place. I also yak for exercise so it double purposes well.
gimruis reply :
On 4/5/2017 at 3:06 AM, BrianinMD said:Honestly don't care if it was allowed or not, just find it very boring same as sitting and dunking live bait. Just not for me.
Agreed. Think about tournaments for walleyes, great lakes trout/salmon, and open water pelagic saltwater fish like marlin. These are all situations in which trolling is very practical (and effective). Like someone else already mentioned too, I don't think that its the greatest way to effectively target LMB in weedy or thick cover. Plus, its incredibly boring. I used to pull crank baits a lot at night for walleyes and it we caught fish but it wastes fuel and gets old quick. Another issue for me personally is that my boat is simply not set up for it properly. Trolling works better in a tiller boat with rod holders. I have a bass boat with a steering wheel and no rod holders.
punch reply :
I don't see what the difference is between casting a crankbait or dragging it behind the boat. Bait still goes under the water and wiggles around.
Angry John reply :
On 4/5/2017 at 10:17 AM, punch said:I don't see what the difference is between casting a crankbait or dragging it behind the boat. Bait still goes under the water and wiggles around.
More time in the contact zone if you can follow a weed-line or contour.
Bluebasser86 reply :
On 4/5/2017 at 10:17 AM, punch said:I don't see what the difference is between casting a crankbait or dragging it behind the boat. Bait still goes under the water and wiggles around.
On 4/5/2017 at 10:42 AM, Angry John said:More time in the contact zone if you can follow a weed-line or contour.
^This, plus you can get a bait much deeper on a troll than you can a cast.
I caught my first 5lb largemouth trolling to my next spot in my 2 man pulling a crankbait that I had been casting. It's very boring to me, but growing up with a dad that loved walleye fishing, I've done a lot of it and probably better at it than a lot of bass guys are.
BrianSnat reply :
There is nothing evil or even slightly cheesy about trolling for bass. It is simply a different method. Personally I rarely have luck trolling for bass outside early spring, before they move into the shallows to spawn and the dog days of August when they move a bit deeper.
Al Wolbach reply :
A few years ago the Elite series fished here on Douglas Lake. Many of the fishermen were long lining or as some locals called it, "strolling". They would drop their lure in the water, open the bail, engage the trolling motor, run the boat 100 yards or so, stop the boat, engage the bail and retrieve the lure with the reel. This is legal by B.A.S.S. rules but seems very close to trolling to me.
I recently spent a week in Florida fishing nothing but live bait and had a ball doing it. Personally I don't care how you catch fish as long as no explosives are involved, lol. Just get out and go enjoy yourself. I also don't care if you take a limit home to eat.
Firefish Alumacraft reply :
I do both, l find coves and points and natural structure for casting but Ive caught more bass trolling. Its really an art and I'm still just a minnow. I don't have a 60k bass boat but I do have a newer 18ft AlumaCraft deep V with a 25" transom. I actually enjoy more trolling and jigging for walleye and going out on Lake Michigan for salmon with down riggers, planner boards, and dipseys than I do bass fishing. Maybe thats why I bought a multi-species Walleye boat???
I also enjoy cat fishing, I just enjoy fishing and species doesn't matter.
scotty918 reply :
We'll buy thousands of dollars worth of sonar technology and multi-thousand dollar boats and then worry about the purity of trolling? 
Angry John reply :
I don't even have a high dollar yak, so I guess I am pure as bill Cosby pudding pops
Way2slow reply :
Not my cup of tea, too hard to do it right and it's hard on a big motor. On rare occasions I troll for stripers but I put my 4hp on beside the big motor and have it so it steers with the big motor. When I was a kid that was the only way I knew because that was the way everybody that took me fished. I didn't like it and when I got where I go on my own, I cast.
fishwizzard reply :
Living by the Chesapeake bay, most of the local kayak fishing scene is all about trolling for striped bass. I enjoy casting and working a lure enough that trolling holds little appeal to me, but then again I don't catch nearly as many fish as the trolling guys.
I do usually flip a weedless lure over the side when moving form spot to spot when bass fishing. I rarely catch anything, but get the occasional bass out of it. Some of the larger resivors I fish have some large catfish in them so this year I might try trolling a jighead with a Slimjim rigged like a shakyhead to see if I can catch one.
Hawkeye21 reply :
It's nice to see more people who don't see it as a big deal. This topic opened up a lengthy debate with Kayak Bass Fishing. Currently trolling motors and trolling lures is allowed in their kayak tournaments. Some feel that it's cheating, not ethical or just wrong for the sport of kayak fishing. There just seems to be some kayak bass fishing purists that feel a kayak has to only be self propelled only and that trolling for bass in general is not what bass fishing is about.
I told them that I had no issue with it not being allowed since it's not one of my main techniques but I feel no reason to ban it if their isn't a valid reason too. Most of their reasons were because the bass boat tourneys don't allow it or that they just personally didn't like it. To me those are not valid reasons.
J Francho reply :
For the most part, propulsion is an advantage because of covering distance quickly without physical exertion. That's where much of the debate lies. Trolling lures is slow, and not really an advantage in a kayak. It's more of a secondary debate.
Hawkeye21 reply :
On 4/6/2017 at 9:58 PM, J Francho said:For the most part, propulsion is an advantage because of covering distance quickly without physical exertion. That's where much of the debate lies. Trolling lures is slow, and not really an advantage in a kayak. It's more of a secondary debate.
Advantage over who though? Every angler is allowed to do it. Just the same as every angler has the ability to use a pedal kayak instead of paddles or use a fish finder with side imaging or a power pole anchor system.
J Francho reply :
It's a case of the haves and the have nots. I would prefer to lump paddles and pedals in one group, and powered in another. Just because every angler has the right to use the equipment doesn't mean they can afford or want to use the equipment. Some got into kayak fishing for the purity and simplicity of a non mechanical fishing platform. It's only natural to take it to the next phase: competition. In competition, any advantage, within the rules, will be concocted. Pedal is an advantage of paddle, but not as much as a motor. Once you put a motor on a kayak, it ceases to be a kayak, and becomes a personal motor boat. It's only a matter of time when something marketed as a kayak (which, BTW, is the rule for what is allowed as a kayak in competition), has a hull engineered for speeds and power, much higher than we've seen offered. Not a trolling motor, but a light, powerful, outboard style motor. I don't begrudge this at all - just the opposite. It's really cool, and I dig the new technology. But sorry, it ain't kayak fishing. I think what will happen down the road, either no one will paddle a kayak in competition, there will be separate divisions, or someone will branch out and start their own "powerless" series. Whatever direction this goes, it's not going away, and can only evolve. After having been in this movement for well over a decade, it's progression has been amazing. I may even be totally wrong on what I think will happen. I remember thinking this competition thing would never grow to what happened last weekend - $40k+ purse for the winner of a national competition.
WRB reply :
The only place trolling isn't allowed is during bass tournaments with rules agianst it. Prior to 1968 when BASS Ray Scott's tournament rules disallowed trolling and the use of live bait, trolling and live bait fishing was a common practice for bass fishing. Today with a few generations of anglers growing up watching bass tournaments and local club events adopting BASS rules, trolling and live bait fishing has become thought as cheating or unsportsmanlike behavior.
like any other presentation of lures trolling requires skill to keep a lure in the strike zone at the right pace to catch bass consistently. I know several tournament bass anglers that trolling lures like deep diving crank baits to locate bass and figure out what lure and color is working better than others prior to a tournament because it can save time. The practice of strolling crosses the tournament rules, letting out over a hundred yards of line using the trolling motor then retreiving a lure or dragging a bottom contact lure like jigs and worms using the trolling is a common practice with tournament bass anglers, it's OK to bend the rules.
Recreational or weekend bass anglers can troll for any fish specie if the use legal techniques within thier states fishing regulations.
Tom
PS, the world record Smallmouth bass was caught trolling.
Team9nine reply :
Trolling for bass = good ? If it was allowed on Tour, you'd see at least 1 or 2 events won with the technique. As it is, they already push the limits to that end of the spectrum in certain events. Also good to see politics and BS making its way into yakkin' tourneys - it will only get worse 
J Francho reply :
On 4/6/2017 at 10:48 PM, Team9nine said:Also good to see politics and BS making its way into yakkin' tourneys - it will only get worse
I remember thinking "Kayak bass fishing tournaments? Catch and release? Oh boy, this will be interesting."
I gotta hand to the guys at TourneyX. They came up with a good solution for this.
J Francho reply :
BTW, I think it's safe to say, this is big league stuff now:
Hawkeye21 reply :
On 4/6/2017 at 10:43 PM, J Francho said:It's a case of the haves and the have nots. I would prefer to lump paddles and pedals in one group, and powered in another. Just because every angler has the right to use the equipment doesn't mean they can afford or want to use the equipment. Some got into kayak fishing for the purity and simplicity of a non mechanical fishing platform. It's only natural to take it to the next phase: competition. In competition, any advantage, within the rules, will be concocted. Pedal is an advantage of paddle, but not as much as a motor. Once you put a motor on a kayak, it ceases to be a kayak, and becomes a personal motor boat. It's only a matter of time when something marketed as a kayak (which, BTW, is the rule for what is allowed as a kayak in competition), has a hull engineered for speeds and power, much higher than we've seen offered. Not a trolling motor, but a light, powerful, outboard style motor. I don't begrudge this at all - just the opposite. It's really cool, and I dig the new technology. But sorry, it ain't kayak fishing. I think what will happen down the road, either no one will paddle a kayak in competition, there will be separate divisions, or someone will branch out and start their own "powerless" series. Whatever direction this goes, it's not going away, and can only evolve. After having been in this movement for well over a decade, it's progression has been amazing. I may even be totally wrong on what I think will happen. I remember thinking this competition thing would never grow to what happened last weekend - $40k+ purse for the winner of a national competition.
I agree that once the sport is large enough there will most likely be separate divisions. Right now it's still in it's infant stage as for competitions. I can't afford a $3,000 kayak that pedals or a micro power pole. I have a trolling motor I could rig up but I don't really want to. Right now I just have a $500 fishing kayak with the usual mods and a nice fish finder. I don't have any issue going up against the guys with the better rigs because in the end it all comes down to fishing ability.
J Francho reply :
$100K in payouts, over 350 qualifying anglers for the national championship. Hardly "infancy" phase. These leagues have matured quickly.
Hawkeye21 reply :
On 4/6/2017 at 11:16 PM, J Francho said:BTW, I think it's safe to say, this is big league stuff now:
Very big league stuff now. It will be even larger next year. I followed the whole tourney last week and they still have plenty of kinks that need to be worked out but it's pretty awesome. I just started kayak fishing last year and started fishing online tourneys this year. I'm currently in a month long state tourney and I'm really enjoying it. It just adds that extra level of excitement but not to the extreme a one day, boat tourney does.
On 4/6/2017 at 11:22 PM, J Francho said:$100K in payouts, over 350 qualifying anglers for the national championship. Hardly "infancy" phase. These leagues have matured quickly.
Just because it's large right now doesn't mean it's not in it's early stages. They are still learning a lot and tweaking the rules. It has a ways to go yet to be a well oiled machine but they are doing well. It got really big really fast.
J Francho reply :
Yeah, the last five years has been pretty wild. I remember being on the phone with Chad Hoover years ago, and he was discussing what he saw for the future. He's an ambitious guy.
Are you in a state series linked to the national championship? I made it through two years ago, but didn't go. Another member here competed, @clayton86. He didn't finish very high, but learned a lot.
Hawkeye21 reply :
On 4/6/2017 at 11:27 PM, J Francho said:Yeah, the last five years has been pretty wild. I remember being on the phone with Chad Hoover years ago, and he was discussing what he saw for the future. He's an ambitious guy.
Are you in a state series linked to the national championship? I made it through two years ago, but didn't go. Another member here competed, @clayton86. He didn't finish very high, but learned a lot.
Yep. I'm signed up in one of the KBF State tourneys. I don't expect to do much but like the feeling of competition. If I did earn a spot in next year's championship I'm not sure if I'd go or not. That's a bit over my head.
J Francho reply :
If you're using TourneyX, it's pretty exciting. Good luck!
Hawkeye21 reply :
On 4/6/2017 at 11:31 PM, J Francho said:If you're using TourneyX, it's pretty exciting. Good luck!
Thanks! I knew I'd be really busy this month but I was excited and signed up for it anyway. I was able to fish last Saturday and get my 5 fish to put myself in 2nd place early. I'm not sure the next time I'll be able to get out again. Probably not until next weekend.
A5BLASTER reply :
I don't see a reason to think it a bad move for bass fishing, we use to troll for white perch when I was a kid on Toledo Bend in front Red's point but that was years ago.
For me I don't think it would be worth while money wise to try and troll for bass on the Bend to many stumps and would lose too many baits, but I'm sure there are guys that have figured out how to do it and catch some nice bass doing it.
clayton86 reply :
On 4/6/2017 at 11:27 PM, J Francho said:Yeah, the last five years has been pretty wild. I remember being on the phone with Chad Hoover years ago, and he was discussing what he saw for the future. He's an ambitious guy.
Are you in a state series linked to the national championship? I made it through two years ago, but didn't go. Another member here competed, @clayton86. He didn't finish very high, but learned a lot.
That's putting it mildly lol. I got my butt kicked. Struggled to say the least. Coming from fishing small tributaries chasing smallies to a giant lake in high winds I was completely out of my element. I did learn a lot and will be back next year hopefully I'll earn a spot threw challenges and the month longs. I've given up our state events other than the cayuga trail stop.
I finished 296/359 and 130th in the hbbb with a 18.5" large mouth I got in the last hour of the last day.
jimf reply :
If it's legal, it's fine by me.
Further North reply :
I look at trolling as neither good nor evil...just duller than a cheap knife dragged blade down across a six lane highway.
roadwarrior reply :
Hmm...
The fact that trolling and The Rig cannot be used in tournament fishing might be your first clues.
Both are VERY productive, especially in combination. If you are struggling, give it a try and as
J Francho suggested, when you get bit stop and fish the area with other techniques.
Find 'em, catch 'em!
flechero reply :
Although I rarely troll- I learned and invested time in it years ago... done right, it's incredibly effective! THose who bag on it, either don't understand it or don't know how to do it. It's a lot more interactive than blindly chucking a stinking rattle trap. You need to know your terrain, targets and depths but also have to manage turning radius and line angles as you navigate to keep bait in and on target areas.
I used to troll one particular lake that had a series of planted plies in the 30' range- they were so pressured that it was near impossible to catch on jig or plastic but they never saw much else... caught over a dozen fish exceeding 8 lbs (as well as smaller fish) by trolling... when still fishing the same, I have only caught smaller fish on those piles.
one example of many. It's not best or right for all occasions but even as a change of pace on a slow day, it can be tremendously effective. I don't get bored catching large bass- heck I don't think anyone here would pass up a big fish caught trolling if offered the chance.
Now, given the choice, I'd much rather pitch shallow brush or punch grass mats! But trolling beats the pants off not catching.
scaleface reply :
I troll occasionally . Its a quick way to cover flats . I troll crankbaits at the depth most fish are showing up on the sonar . Often you see the fish first . I catch lots of channel cats dragging a crankbait around .
david in va reply :
Trolling fishing is like deer hunting from a pickup and shooting a buck 300 yards standing still. It just does not appeal to me.
I fish for fun trolling is no fun for me.
Neil McCauley reply :
It does seem like the tournament rule thing is where it gets a bad name, if it has one. But I don't think it's banned because it's "easy" or "cheating." It just doesn't sell lures/equipment/boats. It's a $16 billion/year industry and tournament rules are a big factor. Keeping more people casting means more types of baits, lines, rod setups, etc. Even bass boats are a product of it...no other species has its own special boat. No other species is best fished for from a boat that essentially is as much raised platform space with 360 degrees of casting that can be attached to a 300hp motor and zipped around from spot to spot.
scaleface reply :
Can you imagine KVD trying to troll with fifty spectator boats following him .
gimruis reply :
I think part of the reason trolling is banned is also because every state has different rules about how many lines an angler can have out. In the south, crappie anglers can deploy a spider rig. The maximum amount of lines one can use here in Minnesota is one at a time. Casting with artificial lures is something that you really can only do one a time and you need both hands so that levels the playing field some.
Team9nine reply :
The real reason trolling is banned from bass tournaments is because when Ray Scott first started and devised the rules for his national B.A.S.S. events, he envisioned a competition where guys who didn't know each other were paired together in boats and competed "mano y mano," cast for cast, one lure each. Each angler was competing against all the other guys, and everyone's weight was an individual score - let the best man win. As such, there was no good way to implement trolling into the game and keep with the spirit of competition and fairness he sought. Since Ray and B.A.S.S. set the rules, most every other bass tourney organization that followed did the same.
If you take note of the professional tours for other species you'll see the difference. For example, the walleye guys (PWT, AIM, etc.) are always either paired as a pro and a co-angler in the same boat, and have a shared weight system (work as a team, and the weight for the boat is the weight recorded for both the pro angler and the co-angler), or as a team (with your partner) in the AAA level events. Makes trolling and scoring fair for both partners. Similarly, nearly all professional crappie events are "team" events, where the team get the weight for the day, and you are usually fishing with your buddy. As such, trolling is a perfectly good tactic again, fair for all. Ray set the rules for bass national competition, so that's how we still play the game.
-T9
Mosster47 reply :
My dad and grandpa taught me the art of trolling Shad Raps. It's a fish magnet in the summer trolling the middle of creek channels.
I do it occasionally, but it's so boring to me. Long lining on the other hand is a staple of my summer time fishing, also super tournament illegal.
BassWhole! reply :
If ANY kind of fishing is wrong, then I don't want to be right. If it has gills and fins, I'm catching it like it wants to be caught, I own a 3 wt fly rod, 130 Internationals, and everything in between. No holds barred.
HeavyDluxe reply :
On 4/5/2017 at 2:21 AM, Hawkeye21 said:Reason I brought this up is because in some kayak bass fishing tournaments it is allowed and some people seem to be upset about it. I found it interesting because every single person that didn't like it didn't have an actual legitimate reason as to why it should be allowed. Their only reasons were because the boat tourneys don't allow it and they personally felt it was wrong.
I'm guessing, but don't know, this is in part due to the changing dynamics of what a kayak actually is these days. With pedal boats and Torqeedo motors, there's a bit of a perceived arms race around boat type.
I'd bet that, at the root, people are scared that some trolling technique is going to be found to be beneficial but only open to those who have suitably outfitted boats. For a purist, is that even still kayak fishing?
WRB reply :
The argument that Ray Scott didn't like trolling based on it reduced competition may have merit with 2 anglers fishing from the same boat. Scott was focused on fair competition without opertunity to cheat and stated he thought trolling wasn't a sporting method to catch bass. You need to factor in the time period was 1967 and trolling was more common then as was cheating.
Kayak fishing is one person per boat and difficult to prevent cheating other than a honor system. Can't see how trolling could have a negative impact in a kayak tournament.
Tom
Paul Roberts reply :
Good.
everythingthatswims reply :
I trolled two Alabama rigs from a kayak and hooked a fish on both rigs at the same time, and landed them both
BassWhole! reply :
On 4/12/2017 at 1:32 PM, everythingthatswims said:I trolled two Alabama rigs from a kayak and hooked a fish on both rigs at the same time, and landed them both
You can troll Alabama rigs? Who knew! 
joeblowwwww reply :
Evil !
Hawkeye21 reply :
On 4/13/2017 at 2:18 AM, joeblowwwww said:Evil !
Oh, come on. You can't get away with saying that without giving your reason. Nothing wrong with not liking it but I'm curious why.
Esoxfreak reply :
Trolling isn't cheating, and neither are water wolfs,mar-cums, nor side scanning sonars, things like that. With all those tools you can still get skunked,lol! You can't make a fish eat or attack if they don't want to. Cheating is snagging...on purpose. I will sometimes troll a few yards moving to the next spot with the trolling motor down and a bait out (I'll bet a lot of people do that), sometimes I tag one and sometimes I dont but ya can't catch fish if you ain't got a lure in the water
gimruis reply :
On 4/12/2017 at 1:32 PM, everythingthatswims said:I trolled two Alabama rigs from a kayak and hooked a fish on both rigs at the same time, and landed them both
That is so illegal here. Alabama rigs are illegal as is having two lines out. That is interesting how almost every state the game and fish laws are different.
Hawkeye21 reply :
On 4/13/2017 at 6:00 AM, gimruis said:
That is so illegal here. Alabama rigs are illegal as is having two lines out. That is interesting how almost every state the game and fish laws are different.
There are lures you can fish that work like the Alabama rig but are legal. In Iowa there are laws on the amount of hooks on a line so the Alabama rig is not allowed but I found one that works. Instead of having multiple little swim baits with hooks it only has one in the center and the rest are spinners. This gives the look of schooling fish still and it works.
WRB reply :
Are you saying you can't use lures 3 hooks in Iowa? If that is true there are several lures with 3 treble hooks that would be outlawed. California has a 3 hook rule/ 3 lures on 1 line rule for fresh water. Arizona has a 3 hook rule with 2 individual lures on 1 line rule. Each state is different regarding regulations.
Drifting away from the topic of trolling, however umbrella rigs originated as a trolling device along with spreader bars decades ago.
Tom
Raul reply :
I don't fish tournaments so any tournament rule doesn't apply to me, it's not illegal in my neck of the woods and, well, if I'm in spot A and I'm going to move to spot B, then I have no problem in trolling from A to B, hell, who knows, maybe I discover a spot where fish are holding in the process.
Hawkeye21 reply :
On 4/13/2017 at 11:21 PM, WRB said:Are you saying you can't use lures 3 hooks in Iowa? If that is true there are several lures with 3 treble hooks that would be outlawed. California has a 3 hook rule/ 3 lures on 1 line rule for fresh water. Arizona has a 3 hook rule with 2 individual lures on 1 line rule. Each state is different regarding regulations.
Drifting away from the topic of trolling, however umbrella rigs originated as a trolling device along with spreader bars decades ago.
Tom
I think you can have three hooks on a lure like a jerk bait. You can't have a line out with more than two hooks on it. Here is rule from their regulations.
"HOOKS When fishing by hook and line you cannot use more than two lines or more than two hooks on each line when still fishing or trolling. When fly fishing, you cannot use more than two flies on one line. When you are trolling and bait casting, you cannot use more than two trolling spoons or artificial baits on one line. A third line may be used when possessing a valid third line fishing permit. You cannot leave fish line or lines with hooks in the water unattended by being out of visual sight of the lines. One hook means a single, double or treblepointed hook, and all hooks attached as a part of an artificial bait or lure shall be counted as one hook. An Alabama (umbrella) rig is not an artificial bait or lure."
On 4/13/2017 at 11:43 PM, Raul said:I don't fish tournaments so any tournament rule doesn't apply to me, it's not illegal in my neck of the woods and, well, if I'm in spot A and I'm going to move to spot B, then I have no problem in trolling from A to B, hell, who knows, maybe I discover a spot where fish are holding in the process.
The thing is, it's allowed in many kayak fishing tourneys but some members were complaining that it shouldn't be allowed. Some say it's not fair and other have some sort of moral reasons why it shouldn't be allowed. None actually offered a legit reason as to why though.
Your idea about trolling while traveling to another location is exactly what I do and see no reason why it wouldn't be allowed in a tourney.
WRB reply :
If a Alabama rig isn't a artificial bait or lure according the the last sentence, what is it?
The regs you posted allows a single lure to be tied on a single line with up to 2 hooks, or 2 flies, on a lure on a single line. A lure with 3 hooks on a single line would illegal, like a 3 treble hook lure.
Tom
NYWayfarer reply :
On 4/5/2017 at 1:25 AM, BrianinMD said:boring.......zzzzzz...
Exactly!
I have friends that invite me all the time on their boats to troll for Lake Trout and Salmon. Big fish, exciting fight, great to eat but most boring fishing imaginable.
Take that from someone who loves finesse fishing for Bass and it means that much more.
the reel ess reply :
I've never caught many bass trolling. I used to catch a lot of white bass and peanut stripers doing it though. It wasn't unusual to find a yearling largemouth chasing the bait with those "other bass". Now I troll with my friend for crappie and occasionally there is a bycatch of bluegill or bass.
Hawkeye21 reply :
On 4/14/2017 at 1:53 AM, WRB said:If a Alabama rig isn't a artificial bait ot lure according the the last sentence, what is it?
The regs you posted allows a single lure to be tied on a single line with up to 2 hooks, or 2 flies, on a lure on a single line. A lure with 3 hooks on a single line would illegal, like a 3 treble hook lure.
Tom
I didn't really understand how the Alabama rig isn't considered an artificial bait and according to what I posted it doesn't look like my 3 treble hook jerk bait would be legal either. Not a big deal though, that can be easily removed.
This is what I use. https://www.amazon.com/Z-Man-QuadZilla-4-Arm-Spinnerbait-Silver/dp/B00FPQPECI/ref=sr_1_25?ie=UTF8&qid=1492111088&sr=8-25&keywords=umbrella+rig
J Francho reply :
It's a rigging for five baits, not a single bait.
Hawkeye21 reply :
On 4/14/2017 at 3:21 AM, J Francho said:It's a rigging for five baits, not a single bait.
What is?
RichF reply :
Bass fishing for me is more than just getting the bites and reeling them in. I love the art of casting and the skill it takes to pinpoint place baits at certain targets. I get a lot of satisfaction when I make an impossible skip under a dock or tree, even if I don't get bit. Trolling eliminates that aspect of bass fishing so I choose not to do it. I don't think it's evil, just a little bit lame (for bass fishing anyway).
J Francho reply :
Umbrella Rig. The question was how is it not an artificial bait. It isn't bait. It's a rigging. That rigging could prerigged with a bait, or attractors, or some combination.
Hawkeye21 reply :
On 4/14/2017 at 3:50 AM, RichF said:Bass fishing for me is more than just getting the bites and reeling them in. I love the art of casting and the skill it takes to pinpoint place baits at certain targets. I get a lot of satisfaction when I make an impossible skip under a dock or tree, even if I don't get bit. Trolling eliminates that aspect of bass fishing so I choose not to do it. I don't think it's evil, just a little bit lame (for bass fishing anyway).
I feel that way too for the most part and I think most bass fishermen feel that way too. Just because we prefer it that way doesn't mean we should outlaw the ways we don't like though, right? The people I'm talking about come off as some type of bass fishing purists that feel it should only be done a certain even though the other ways are legal.
RichF reply :
On 4/14/2017 at 3:55 AM, Hawkeye21 said:
I feel that way too for the most part and I think most bass fishermen feel that way too. Just because we prefer it that way doesn't mean we should outlaw the ways we don't like though, right? The people I'm talking about come off as some type of bass fishing purists that feel it should only be done a certain even though the other ways are legal.
I'm completely fine with guys trolling for bass. I do, however, agree that it doesn't belong in tournament competitions. But then again, I don't like anything that removes the need for good ol' fashioned skill during competition. If I had it my way, spot lock trolling motors, 3D-mega-side-imaging (whatever), 250hp motors, and senkos would all be banned haha.
Hawkeye21 reply :
On 4/14/2017 at 4:07 AM, RichF said:
I'm completely fine with guys trolling for bass. I do, however, agree that it doesn't belong in tournament competitions. But then again, I don't like anything that removes the need for good ol' fashioned skill during competition. If I had it my way, spot lock trolling motors, 3D-mega-side-imaging (whatever), 250hp motors, and senkos would all be banned haha.
But now that brings up the argument. Why shouldn't it be allowed in tournaments? I have yet to hear a legitimate reason.
I'm not trying to say that it needs to be allowed but I keep seeing people say it shouldn't be allowed yet none of them can give a solid reason as to why other than their own personal feelings.
RichF reply :
First off, I don't think it's really a great way to catch bass in the first place so I couldn't even see a lot of guys doing it during competition. Maybe in the summer on the TVA lakes when the bass are 30ft deep chasing shad, but that's about all I can think of. Secondly, it wouldn't be very exciting to watch as a spectator of the sport (there goes BASS Live, FLW Live, and MLF coverage). Thirdly, well I can't think of a thirdly. Are these legitimate reasons? Eh. Maybe #2, at least for those big organizations. Can't make $$ if nobody wants to watch your stuff. Have you ever watched a televised walleye tournament? I'd rather watch paint dry while someone kicks me in the nuts repeatedly. Yes it's that boring. Can you imagine an Elite Series pro using his Ultrex to map a path along a Kentucky Lake ledge, chuck a 6xd behind the boat, and watch him sit there doing absolutely nothing while his boat runs itself? I would actually prefer to work on Fridays rather than watch BASS LIVE coverage!
Hawkeye21 reply :
On 4/14/2017 at 4:35 AM, RichF said:First off, I don't think it's really a great way to catch bass in the first place so I couldn't even see a lot of guys doing it during competition. Maybe in the summer on the TVA lakes when the bass are 30ft deep chasing shad, but that's about all I can think of. Secondly, it wouldn't be very exciting to watch as a spectator of the sport (there goes BASS Live, FLW Live, and MLF coverage). Thirdly, well I can't think of a thirdly. Are these legitimate reasons? Eh. Maybe #2, at least for those big organizations. Can't make $$ if nobody wants to watch your stuff. Have you ever watched a televised walleye tournament? I'd rather watch paint dry while someone kicks me in the nuts repeatedly. Yes it's that boring. Can you imagine an Elite Series pro using his Ultrex to map a path along a Kentucky Lake ledge, chuck a 6xd behind the boat, and watch him sit there doing absolutely nothing while his boat runs itself? I would actually prefer to work on Fridays rather than watch BASS LIVE coverage!
I think not allowing it for televised tourneys makes sense since not many want to watch it but how many are actually going to be trolling? That doesn't affect a kayak bass fishing tourney though.
WRB reply :
On 4/14/2017 at 3:50 AM, J Francho said:Umbrella Rig. The question was how is it not an artificial bait. It isn't bait. It's a rigging. That rigging could prerigged with a bait, or attractors, or some combination.
It's still an artificial lure regardless how many wires it may have or hooks, jigs or bait is added. If they don't want umbrella rigs used they should clearly state that.
Tom
J Francho reply :
I'm with you Tom. Just relaying the legalese definition that I see in fishing regs. It's not easy determining what is fair and what is not.
gimruis reply :
On 4/14/2017 at 4:10 AM, Hawkeye21 said:But now that brings up the argument. Why shouldn't it be allowed in tournaments? I have yet to hear a legitimate reason.
I mentioned this before but I'll do it again. Seems like almost every state has different fish and game laws and when it comes to trolling, the more lines the better. Plus, its a method of fishing where you actually physically can put out multiple lines by yourself with rod holders and manage it. You really can't cast like most bass anglers do with more than one line at a time because it requires the use of both your hands. I think the same can be said as for partially why the use of live bait is banned (I say partially because live bait often results in higher mortality and bass tournaments try to release their fish fully alive). You could throw out 8 bobbers with shiners and put them in rod holders. Banning trolling and live bait in bass tournaments levels the field from state to state by making anglers cast with one line at a time.
WRB reply :
Multiple lines in the water at the same time was not allowed from day 1 with B.A.S.S. independant issue. Agree multiple lines can be trolled however can also be cast one at a time and still be in the water at the same time, picked and retrieved separately.
Lots of fishing tournaments allow and rely on trolling, bass tournaments stands alone on this issue.
Tom
joeblowwwww reply :
On 4/13/2017 at 2:27 AM, Hawkeye21 said:
Oh, come on. You can't get away with saying that without giving your reason. Nothing wrong with not liking it but I'm curious why.
Ha! I'm just kidding nobody was saying evil. trolling for bass has never been my favorite but to each his own.
basscatcher8 reply :
Trolling if you can master it and get it right is very effective. I have my bass boat setup to do it. But I also don't go everywhere to fish for bass and when I do travel Largemouth is usually the bottom of the list anyway. Like mentioned earlier in a weedy lake or something no I'll stay up front casting. But when I go to some of the big deep lakes like in the Ozarks, I'll have my trolling rods all ready. And I'll run around till I start seeing something on the screen and start trolling around the area to try and learn what's going on. If I run into a good group, I'll pull up the trolling rods and spend awhile casting. If you've only got a couple days to fish a place and need to find fish quick its a great tool and technique to use.
Catt reply :
As to why Ray Scott banded trolling y'all just guessing!
Don't where is idea the early Pro's were "paired", ugh! No the were not!
Co-anglers & the Marshalls were added to deter cheating.
Can someone explain how trolling is cheating?
roadwarrior reply :
On 4/15/2017 at 4:38 AM, Catt said:Can someone explain how trolling is cheating?
You catch too many fish drinkin' beer and gettin' sunburned.
Team9nine reply :
On 4/15/2017 at 4:38 AM, Catt said:As to why Ray Scott banded trolling y'all just guessing!
Don't where is idea the early Pro's were "paired", ugh! No the were not!
Co-anglers & the Marshalls were added to deter cheating.
Can someone explain how trolling is cheating?
I'm not guessing 
straight from the mouth of Harold Sharp, and confirmed by Al Lindner. Remember, I write for BFA, and Harold was one of our contributors.
Harold and Ray wrote the rules, and Harold enforced them as B.A.S.S.'s first tourney director. Co-anglers and marshals came much, much later in the game. Everyone got paired in the early days, 2 men per boat, and no two from the same state to prevent cheating (except events like the Classic where pros fished with outdoor writers/press observers). Often ended up "boater-boater" as much of the old film coverage shows now big named pros fishing together. Whose boat to take when that occurred was always a big deal.
-T9
.ghoti. reply :
I fail to see why anybody would regard trolling as evil or cheating. And, if you think it doesn't take old fashioned skill to be successful trolling, you are sadly misinformed.
I don't do it for two reasons. It bores me to death. And, Ive never taken the time to learn to do it properly, probably because it bores me to death.
Catt reply :
@Team9nine
I know Dave Precht Editor in Chief of Bassmaster Magazine & little known Paul Key who took B.A.S.S. to South Africa, Zimbabwe, & Spain.
I must have missed that class cause don't remember two in a boat!
Edited by CattOperator error
Bucky205 reply :
You can troll an Alabama rig on a heavy rod and it will definitely work. I bass fish for sport. But I will eat a mess of crappie in a heartbeat. B.A.S.S. and FLW they are not allowed. It's funny the local tournaments allow it but I don't see a lot of people throwing it, or towing it.
Team9nine reply :
On 4/16/2017 at 6:05 AM, Catt said:@Team9nine
I know Dave Precht Editor in Chief of Bassmaster Magazine & little known Paul Key who took B.A.S.S. to South Africa, Zimbabwe, & Spain.
I must have missed that class cause don't remember two in a boat!
That's OK, @Catt - from the original 1968 B.A.S.S. rules:
CONTESTANTS PAIR OFF: Two contestants will be assigned to each boat (except the top 20 leaders on the last two days). Wherever possible no two contestants from the same city or state shall fish together. No two contestants shall fish together more than one (1) day. Announcement of your fishing partner shall me made on the evening prior to each day. It shall be the responsibility of each boat partner to have his partner at the mutually agreed upon departure dock on time for check out. It is suggested that the partners meet at least 30 minutes before check out time at the Booster Club. When two contestants check out at beginning of the day they MUST STAY TOGETHER AND IN SIGHT OF HIS PAIRED PARTNER AND HIS PARTNER'S "FISH" THROUGHOUT THE DAY AND UNTIL THEIR WEIGH-IN IS COMPLETED. A CONTESTANT MUST NOT ALLOW ANY FISH CAUGHT BY HIM TO BE COUNTED ON THE SCORE OF ANOTHER CONTESTANT. In such case, both contestants will be disqualified for this tournament and all other All-American Tournaments.
OBSERVERS: During the second and third day each of the top twenty (20) leaders will fish only with an official observer. (All others will fish with partners.) The boat must be fully operated by the contestant. The observer is not to operate the boat, shall not fish, nor in any way interfere with the fisherman. The observer is to observe only and shall have no other official duty nor responsibility. Fisherman and observer must stay together at all times throughout the day and until the weigh-in is completed.
see: Original 1968 B.A.S.S. Rules
EDIT: this site won't let me link to the original story posted at BF...
Catt reply :
@Team9nine could not have lasted more than a year or two. A good friend of mine Mike Bono Sr won the 1970 Toledo Bend Invitational, there was an observer but no Pro anglers.
Huh! Great memories right there 
WRB reply :
Another rule during the early years of B.A.S.S. was contestants had to agree who would run the boat the first 1/2 of the day and the second 1/2. The boat owner didn't have the right to dominate running his boat, must be shared unless agreed otherwise. The partner draw was a blind draw during the pre event dinner. Pray Scott was focused on preventing any cheating.
Tom
BassThumb reply :
On 4/15/2017 at 11:59 PM, .ghoti. said:I fail to see why anybody would regard trolling as evil or cheating. And, if you think it doesn't take old fashioned skill to be successful trolling, you are sadly misinformed.
I don't do it for two reasons. It bores me to death. And, Ive never taken the time to learn to do it properly, probably because it bores me to death.
I couldn't have said it better myself.
I troll for walleyes sometimes, and the hours seem to go by so slowly, even when catching fish. It's boring watching a rod tip, but it does take some serious skill in terms of boat placement to do it right. It's a different kind of fishing art.
scaleface reply :
I enjoy trolling . I'll troll at the depth most fish activity is showing up . As far as bass tournaments it would cause a lot of friction . The trollers are going to be fishing the same places as the casters . Effective trolling is done on good spots .
TnRiver46 reply :
On 4/10/2017 at 6:03 PM, reason said:If ANY kind of fishing is wrong, then I don't want to be right. If it has gills and fins, I'm catching it like it wants to be caught, I own a 3 wt fly rod, 130 Internationals, and everything in between. No holds barred.
I don't think I have ever read a better post. And believe me I have read a lot of them
RAMBLER reply :
I troll, once in a while, generally after a full day of casting/tossing lures, I'm tired but don't want to go home, yet. I'm also exploring the water while I'm trolling. I have caught more crappie, bluegill, and catfish while trolling and very few bass.
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