Lead Banned by 2022 2024
TheJman reply :
On his way out of office Obama put a ban on lead in all fishing lures and tackle with a complaint date of 2022. It looks to effect a large chunk of everything we use. My question isn't so much how it'll effect the angler as far as having to replace our lures and tackle but how it effects the little manufacturers. Will they be able to make a switch over without going belly up? Or will we all be stuck throwing a select few companies products?
YUT18 reply :
On 1/26/2017 at 2:27 AM, TheJman said:On his way out of office Obama put a ban on lead in all fishing lures and tackle with a complaint date of 2022. It looks to effect a large chunk of everything we use. My question isn't so much how it'll effect the angler as far as having to replace our lures and tackle but how it effects the little manufacturers. Will they be able to make a switch over without going belly up? Or will we all be stuck throwing a select few companies products?
The ban only applies if your are on Federal land. I work on a Military installation and the only ban I have heard of so far is lead ammo can no longer be used. They try to cite environmental impacts as to the reason why. If the ban on lead lures applies to federal land only then it should not have any affect on small manufacturers unless their demographic is the federal pond jumpers.
J Francho reply :
Here's the Director's Order #219 from US Fish and Wildlife:
https://www.fws.gov/policy/do219.html
The second this turns into a politics discussion, I will lock it up, and suspensions will be issued. That means limit the discussion to how you think this affects anglers and tackle manufacturers.
I don't think it amounts to much, though an all out ban on lead seems imminent, and not out of the question.
blckshirt98 reply :
Because that's not to be confusing as sh**. I checked a local map and it looks like San Luis Reservoir/Forebay are the only local waters I really ever fish, but I can see some other parts of the country where there's going to be a lot of "didn't know this was federal land" fines being handed out.
A-Jay reply :
Not looking to debate this one way or the other ~ Just FYI
"Fortunately, action was taken by the new administration the day after the rule was issued that could hinder its effectiveness. A memorandum issued from the White House to departments and agencies announced a freeze on implementing new regulations, pending review. Still, individual jurisdictions within FWS might choose to enforce the rule."
http://www.theoutdoorwire.com/story/1485302084ts5bc9g0n19
A-Jay
gimruis reply :
On 1/26/2017 at 3:00 AM, J Francho said:I don't think it amounts to much, though an all out ban on lead seems imminent, and not out of the question.
That seems likely down the road at some point. A lead ban on ammo when hunting for waterfowl and upland bird species on public land has been the rule in Minnesota for as long as I've been hunting (20 years).
TheJman reply :
I guess I didn't phrase my question like I should of. I didn't fully understand the jest of the ban either. I thought it was a public ban, I didn't catch The federal part of it until someone mentioned it about. I guess I should've asked in the tackle making section I was trying to stay out of the political part of it and wanted to find out how costly it would be on the smaller guys to make a switch over to a different materiel if they had too? I guess I should of just asked that question without bringing up the ban. Thanks for all the replys so far.
J Francho reply :
It's all good, @TheJman....I was just trying to figure out how to keep the thread cooking, as to inform, have discussion, and educate without getting into politics.
Something to ponder: where is tungsten tackle made? Will there be tariffs added to it in the future?
TheJman reply :
On 1/26/2017 at 3:34 AM, J Francho said:It's all good, @TheJman....I was just trying to figure out how to keep the thread cooking, as to inform, have discussion, and educate without getting into politics.
Something to ponder: where is tungsten tackle made? Will there be tariffs added to it in the future?
Good question. I'm pretty clueless when it comes to this stuff. It just striked the curiosity in me so figured I would ask here. I would think most of the company's have a plan in place or at least studied it.
Choporoz reply :
I do a lot of fishing on/from federal waters/lands. It will be interesting to see how this is implemented. I assume it will apply to National Parks and Forests, as well as military bases.
I found it interesting to see how much of federal land there actually is:
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Federal_lands
J Francho reply :
On 1/26/2017 at 3:40 AM, TheJman said:I would think most of the company's have a plan in place or at least studied it.
I know at least one of our sponsors, Siebert Outdoors - a small company - has been working with alternative materials for a while now.
.ghoti. reply :
Lead metals at about 620 F. Tungsten, over 6000 F.
Dont think we will be seeing any independent tackle makers molding their own tungsten products anytime soon.
Bismuth melts at a slightly lower temp than lead. Is this where we're going?
scaleface reply :
Thats not the only thing happening . I just heard trump banned catch and release . 
DogBone_384 reply :
Massachusetts banned lead of any kind under 1 oz. for fishing years ago.
J Francho reply :
New York banned the sale of sinkers under an ounce a few years ago.
WRB reply :
May want to buy some bullet lead ingots now!
Tom
Fun4Me reply :
I've been using the steel sinkers for a while now. They're bigger, but I use them in situations where size isn't critical.
IndianaFinesse reply :
On 1/26/2017 at 4:34 AM, WRB said:May want to buy some bullet lead ingots now!
Tom
I would be stocking up on lead right now just in case, but luckily someone gave me about ten pounds of it last year, so i'm set for the next twenty years.
burrows reply :
There go all my jigs
kickerfish1 reply :
If I have to give up all my jigs I won't be happy.
J Francho reply :
On 1/26/2017 at 4:52 AM, Fun4Me said:I've been using the steel sinkers for a while now.
I actually like to use steel bullet weights when using a big plastc, and very little weight. 1/8 oz. tungsten in front of a big 12" worm is dumb.
DogBone_384 reply :
I wouldn't worry about it all that much. Between capitalism (read: alternative materials) and selective enforcement, nobody's going stop fishing their jigs, spinner baits, et al....
Choporoz reply :
On 1/26/2017 at 4:34 AM, WRB said:May want to buy some bullet lead ingots now!
Tom
Playing the odds that any future bans will be on 'sale' of lead fishing weights; vice 'use' of lead fishing weights?
thebillsman reply :
Enforcing the law might be difficult.
MassYak85 reply :
The MA lead law was instituted primarily to try and mitigate the death of Loons who accidentally were swallowing things like lead split shot weights. (There's a minuscule to non-existent native population of Loons in most parts of the state to begin with so the actual cost/benefit of the law still has many scratching their heads).
On 1/26/2017 at 4:12 AM, .ghoti. said:Lead metals at about 620 F. Tungsten, over 6000 F.
Dont think we will be seeing any independent tackle makers molding their own tungsten products anytime soon.
Bismuth melts at a slightly lower temp than lead. Is this where we're going?
Bismuth is considerably more expensive than lead is the issue. Still not as much as tungsten but if we're looking for a material to mass produce affordable fishing lures and tackle, probably going to have to look elsewhere.
fishballer06 reply :
What am I supposed to do with the 200+ pounds of Rat-L-Traps I have... 
MassYak85 reply :
Does this include ANY lures that contain lead. And also how do they define that, pretty much every lure I have ever bought says "may contain lead, a chemical known to the state of California to...". Even ones that I know for a fact do not have lead in them. The MA 1oz law is rarely enforced but they do draw a line and most lures are not part of the ban. A blanket ban though. What are they going to do, saw your crankbait in half to check whether the rattles are lead? "Oh sorry, guess they weren't, hoping you weren't expecting to be reimbursed for that". This law seems unenforceable.
grampa1114 reply :
Calm down people...finish what you've got and buy the good stuff when it's time....It's just not that much more expensive. In Massachusetts they never did bother to check anybody's tackle box for compliance. There just aren't enough folks in most states DNR's to waste their time on stuff like that. 2022 is a long way off and let's hope there's still fishable water.
fishwizzard reply :
Outing myself as a nerd here, but wargaming minitures used to be made of lead but that was more or less phased out in the late 90's for the most part. I am not sure what exactly the industry swtiched to, but it was called "white metal" and felt a little lighter then lead, but worked in lead molds.
IndianaFinesse reply :
On 1/26/2017 at 5:10 AM, Choporoz said:Playing the odds that any future bans will be on 'sale' of lead fishing weights; vice 'use' of lead fishing weights?
No, but I'm betting they aren't going to conduct house raids or tackle box checks to see if I posses any lead.
blckshirt98 reply :
I'll switch to steel/brass but this is a perfect opportunity for a company or entrepreneur to build a better mousetrap. Get a patent on an alloy or process and you'll be set!
iceintheveins reply :
Unenforceable and I have confidence it will be repealed by Trump. Most all waters are state so it won't apply.
Yeajray231 reply :
They can take my lead when they come for my guns 
Angry John reply :
I lived in ct and dealt with a lot of surrounding states with lead bans. They get complicated buit the size requirement was almost always safe for jigs. The dam bird will not eat the jig so the application of the law is everything.
georgeyew reply :
On 1/26/2017 at 5:20 AM, fishballer06 said:What am I supposed to do with the 200+ pounds of Rat-L-Traps I have...
Dang, what does 200+ lbs look like?
On 1/26/2017 at 5:26 AM, MassYak85 said:Does this include ANY lures that contain lead. And also how do they define that, pretty much every lure I have ever bought says "may contain lead, a chemical known to the state of California to...". Even ones that I know for a fact do not have lead in them. The MA 1oz law is rarely enforced but they do draw a line and most lures are not part of the ban. A blanket ban though. What are they going to do, saw your crankbait in half to check whether the rattles are lead? "Oh sorry, guess they weren't, hoping you weren't expecting to be reimbursed for that". This law seems unenforceable.
Even my fishing rods/reels comes with a warning that it may contain lead.
Jeff H reply :
I've no problem throwing brass bullets, been doing it for years but where lead is concerned...I guess I'll just be an outlaw of sorts.
mixel reply :
So brass it will be then. Any maps of which lakes are federal vs. state?
A-Jay reply :
On 1/26/2017 at 11:45 AM, mixel said:So brass it will be then. Any maps of which lakes are federal vs. state?
Federal waters border two or more states or countries.
State only waters lie completely with the boundaries of one single state.
A-Jay
iceintheveins reply :
On 1/26/2017 at 10:21 AM, Jeff H said:I've no problem throwing brass bullets, been doing it for years but where lead is concerned...I guess I'll just be an outlaw of sorts.
x2
Montanaro reply :
This applies to the sale of new lead.
You wont find it in stores.
They wont force you to throw out your lures you already have. Im just thinking that store shelves are gonna be pretty bare in future
"hamma" reply :
Correct me if I'm wrong, but, the Massachusetts law states any "weight" under 1 oz, or any "jig" under a certain length,... spinnerbaits, crankbaits, or anything that a loon cant accidentally swallow isnt a issue. Now this covers "freshwaters" and doesnt effect salt water anglers
The states environmental police do have a way to check,..I have not been, but I spoke to some shore trout anglers that told me they were checked. The State stocks trout so these lakes where stocking takes place gets more attention then "unstocked" or bass waters. I have seen one environmental police vehicle at bass waters in the past several years, at a bass lakes ramp. And I beleive it was for a complaint from a homeowner, as they didnt bother me at all, didnt even get out of the truck, So I think they were looking for someone specific.
As far as a countrywide ban on lead? All I do know is that there is a way to check compliance, and I for one want to not only do whats deemed legal, but have begun searching and will soon be gathering the means to pour my own jigs and weights.
Tungsten is out of the question for a do it yourselfer,...Bismuth/tin is a good alternative but tricky to powder coat as powdercoating, suggests 350 degrees at least for 15 minutes to "cure" and most bismuth/tins melt at 290, so if you dont want to paint your jigs/weights, this may work for you. Im looking at pewter, and a certain bismuth /tin suggested by Will Wetline. These may be the future of weights and jigs, as they are less expensive than tungsten, and much easier to work with. They both can be powdercoated, the bismuth/ tin may need "special" attention to do so, but possible the same. Brass and steel? I havent even considered yet, but, Im sure some experienced pourers would have already gone that route if they were viable.
Will the ban effect you? I dont know,... But I do know that I have been searching for quality "specialized" or "technique specific" jigs and weights at a feasable price, and have found none as of yet. So, I've come to the crossroads, of making my own.
You can find a few decent round ball jigs, football jigs, and "some" weights., in a bismuth/tin,..and oh yeah tungsten too, but they are not cheap..but if you fish any darter, stand-up, wobble heads, shad heads, etc.,... or specialized weights?,... your high and dry like me.
I cant fathom the amount of money, and time I have wasted on lead weights, jigheads, and bass jigs that at the time were fine, but now deemed illegal here,..I did send alot out to friends throughout the country that dont have lead bans. But as any true "old timer" bass angler, I keep finding more and more in my overstocked stuff.
I am almost ready to pull the trigger on my own pouring operation, and have not only sought out, and acquired the saftey requirements, but am now waiting on the New England weather to break as this will take place in my, large hand built shed, which doesnt have any heat,...lol.
This is a push comes to shove type deal for me. The techniques and tricks I've acquired over the years calls for many different means of jigs, and weights. I'd say 1/8th of them I can buy on the cheaper tin/bismuth mix,...the rest either isnt available, or are very, very expensive. So I have been relegated to abandon some of my techniques, until I can again facilitate the materials needed to do so.
As a diligent, stubborn, and resouceful cuss! I am not allowing the treehuggers to ruin my day anymore. Im going to make the stuff I need,... in the law abiding materials.
(as I raspberry p.e.t.a.) even they can,...."have a nice day",...lol
believe it? or not? ,... they did have a hand in this. Hopefully I will be forced to thank them in the near future, as this may be the beginning of "Hammafish Lure Co." if all goes well.
Yeajray231 reply :
@"hamma" get yourself a kerosene heater. I've cut tile during snowfall with a make shift tent (from tarps ) and a kerosene heater. And I was sweating... It was a wet saw so I was constantly running my hands through running water too. Itd warm up a small garage to the point you need to leave in a matter of minutes.
I'm not too worried about this.. I'll worry about it in 2022 ?
12poundbass reply :
I'm not worried about it.
? lol
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