Jerkbaits in toothy critter water 2024
cgolf reply :
On a recent thread I commented about losing 2 shadow raps in short order to big musky, and have seen them take other jerkbaits in the past. Because of the toothy critters, shadow raps are at the high end of my budget for jerkbaits.
How much will using even a short steel leader screw with the action of any jerkbait including the Megabass baits. Most cranks I can get away without a steel leader, but with jerkbaits and the bait often being on slack line I am defenseless against a toothy critter mouthing the whole bait and biting it off. What options are there other than the steel leader?
Siebert Outdoors reply :
In my experience its going to mess up the action and reduce your catch rate. I fish Lake St Clair and its the same exact way. I will lose a couple jerkbaits per week but I see it as worth it due to the increased catch. I have also caught a few nice musky off no leader jerbaits. One of the biggest musky's I've ever caught was this way.
WIGuide reply :
Personally i don't use leaders with a jerkbait, I just take my chances and for whatever reason, I actually have pretty good luck not losing them.
A-Jay reply :
On 12/21/2016 at 4:44 AM, WIGuide said:Personally i don't use leaders with a jerkbait, I just take my chances and for whatever reason, I actually have pretty good luck not losing them.
~x2~ Never go leader either on the jerkbaits.
Which is really rolling the dice in my own waters as there is a Very Healthy population of toothy face Mutants free roaming around. But despite that - I don't get many in the fall. A few in the spring, but less in the late fall, which is when the majority of my own Jerkbaiting (is that a term?) takes place.
However, Spinnerbaits, Lippless Baits, Chatterbaits & even some jigs get a wire trace, especially if & when presented on the deep weed edge.
A-Jay
Dogmatic reply :
I personally don't use a leader, mainly because I'm lazy, just accept the occasional loss, but this might be an option if it's a big problem for you.
cgolf reply :
On 12/21/2016 at 5:30 AM, A-Jay said:
~x2~ Never go leader either on the jerkbaits.
Which is really rolling the dice in my own waters as there is a Very Healthy population of toothy face Mutants free roaming around. But despite that - I don't get many in the fall. A few in the spring, but less in the late fall, which is when the majority of my own Jerkbaiting (is that a term?) takes place.
However, Spinnerbaits, Lippless Baits, Chatterbaits & even some jigs get a wire trace, especially if & when presented on the deep weed edge.
A-Jay
If you ever fish shallow sand flats definately go with a leader, I have seen multiple 50s up on these shallow flats in clear water even during mid summer. Guessing plentiful panfish pull them up there to feed. Last summer they were so aggressive I had a pike and a musky pop their heads out of the water to swipe at my leaderless lipless bait as I lifted it in the boat, wish I had the GoPro on for those.
The times I lost mine were the May opener and later August. Jerk baiting is something I am trying to learn, but if losing baits becomes a big thing I may fall back on other less expensive techniques. That said I must be doing something right to get the big girls to bite. I just want to add another option to catch fish for me when the bite gets tough.
A-Jay reply :
On 12/21/2016 at 7:05 AM, cgolf said:If you ever fish shallow sand flats definately go with a leader, I have seen multiple 50s up on these shallow flats in clear water even during mid summer. Guessing plentiful panfish pull them up there to feed. Last summer they were so aggressive I had a pike and a musky pop their heads out of the water to swipe at my leaderless lipless bait as I lifted it in the boat, wish I had the GoPro on for those.
The times I lost mine were the May opener and later August. Jerk baiting is something I am trying to learn, but if losing baits becomes a big thing I may fall back on other less expensive techniques. That said I must be doing something right to get the big girls to bite. I just want to add another option to catch fish for me when the bite gets tough.
I've have had my fair share of run ins with the teeth patrol ~ here's a couple of examples from this past fall. I did manage to get some video footage of these as well.
Like I said I use a trace of wire when needed. It is my experience that although a heavy Mono or Flouro leader may delay or even prevent some bites offs, a thin knottable wire works better for me.
A-Jay
TnRiver46 reply :
Does anyone ever eat pike? Maybe that would make them think twice about biting off all your lures.
A-Jay reply :
On 12/21/2016 at 8:04 AM, TnRiver46 said:Does anyone ever eat pike? Maybe that would make them think twice about biting off all your lures.
I do not but many a human do consider them very favorable table fare.
btw - if you get a pike that does strike after you eat it - be worried.
A-Jay
cgolf reply :
On 12/21/2016 at 8:04 AM, TnRiver46 said:Does anyone ever eat pike? Maybe that would make them think twice about biting off all your lures.
I have never tried it, but I have heard pickled pike is incredible. The only issue with them is they have a Y bone is more difficult to filet out.
On 12/21/2016 at 4:44 AM, WIGuide said:Personally i don't use leaders with a jerkbait, I just take my chances and for whatever reason, I actually have pretty good luck not losing them.
How do you manage, I lost 2 shadow raps in 40 casts, one was on the 4th cast, granted the lake is pretty thick with muskys, but that is crazy.
It might be a case I need to move them more or go with less slack in the line, because I was missing some bass that were there and then gone when I gave a jerk after a pause
Dogmatic reply :
On 12/21/2016 at 8:52 AM, cgolf said:
How do you manage, I lost 2 shadow raps in 40 casts, one was on the 4th cast, granted the lake is pretty thick with muskys, but that is crazy.
Sheesh!...so much for being "the fish of a 1000 casts"! ?
Hurricane reply :
On 12/21/2016 at 7:35 AM, A-Jay said:I've have had my fair share of run ins with the teeth patrol ~ here's a couple of examples from this past fall. I did manage to get some video footage of these as well.
Like I said I use a trace of wire when needed. It is my experience that although a heavy Mono or Flouro leader may delay or even prevent some bites offs, a thin knottable wire works better for me.
A-Jay
On 12/21/2016 at 7:35 AM, A-Jay said:I've have had my fair share of run ins with the teeth patrol ~ here's a couple of examples from this past fall. I did manage to get some video footage of these as well.
Like I said I use a trace of wire when needed. It is my experience that although a heavy Mono or Flouro leader may delay or even prevent some bites offs, a thin knottable wire works better for me.
A-Jay
Awesome fish Ajay
smalljaw67 reply :
I have lost numerous Pointer 100s, and a single Megabass Vision 110 to the toothy ones and I found a solution. The Storm Twitch Stick, it has a similar profile and action as a Pointer 100, it has good finishes but nothing close to LC but the bait does have great triggering properties. The bait is $5 and it is that good I'd even pay $10 for a few of the colors but the best thing is the price, if a toothy fish grabs it and you lose it, the hurt isn't too bad.
Megastink reply :
I fish lakes with a lot of chain Pickerel in them. Losing baits is part of the game. I lost a 110 two winters ago and haven't thrown them in those waters since. I save my high dollar baits for tournaments. If I'm fun fishing, I'll choose a Strike King KVD J300. They work very in my waters. We've got some whopper Pickerel up here in PA too, so no matter what I'm throwing, I'm always a little nervous. 
fishwizzard reply :
Man, if I could consistently catch huge pikes like in these pictures, I wouldn't bother with bass.
We only really have pickerel around here and I loose the occasional perch spinner to them, but have never had them bite off a larger bass lure. I did a little test trying to use like a 20lb leader to my 6lb braid mainline but I could never get the knots to hold.
Scarborough817 reply :
i've had my fair share of teeth try to take jerlkbaits but they have never succeeded in breaking my line, now it may just be that i'm lucky.
On 12/21/2016 at 11:32 PM, Bunnielab said:Man, if I could consistently catch huge pikes like in these pictures, I wouldn't bother with bass.
We only really have pickerel around here and I loose the occasional perch spinner to them, but have never had them bite off a larger bass lure. I did a little test trying to use like a 20lb leader to my 6lb braid mainline but I could never get the knots to hold.
what knot were you using to tie the leader? also what kind of braid was it?
fishwizzard reply :
The braid was Suffix 832 and I was using an Alberto. The issue seemed to be that the mono was so stiff that it would let the braid loosen over a few casts. I don't know what the brand of line was, it was given to me off of a large spool when I needed some some leader for surf fishing. The 12lb that I got to work was YZH, so maybe I just need to try a more supple heavy line. I am throwing like 1/16-1/8oz spinners so more then a foot or three of leader kills my casting but I am finding that a the heavier leader helps keep the lure down during the retrieve, so it's something I want to keep playing with. I am going to buy some of that tie-able wire soon to see how it works.
A-Jay reply :
On 12/21/2016 at 11:34 PM, Scarborough817 said:i've had my fair share of teeth try to take jerlkbaits but they have never succeeded in breaking my line, now it may just be that i'm lucky.
what knot were you using to tie the leader? also what kind of braid was it?
I been using a uni to uni-knot to connect braid to a mono leader for several years and when tied correctly and re-tied when needed, it's NEVER let me down. I've attached a thread (and video) of a 25 lb plus pike that I fought & landed with spinning gear while smallie fishing. This battle lasted over 15 minutes. The 10 lb Sufix 832 braid and 10lb Berkley Big Game (green) mono leader that included a uni to uni knot was certainly tested but did it's job. There are certainly any number of connection knots that when tied correctly would have worked here - the uni is the one I choose & have confidence in; especially after this event. I'll admit and you'll hear in the video - I was intially a little concerned.
A-Jay
Fishes in trees reply :
There aren't any toothy fish where I fish. However, if there were and I didn't want to use wire, I think I could make a leader out of 60 or 100 lb fluorocarbon leader material that would work great.
Attila reply :
Tonnes of toothy critters up here where I live. I use a very light leader if I'm targeting pike (spring of the year) but remove it once bass season opens up. I've caught a lot of musky on jerkbaits up to around 40" with no leader as due to its erratic action I find they're normally hooked on the outside of the mouth, in the summer at least.
I forget the name of the leader, will post it when I get home.
Bradfords Gone! reply :
I use a small barrel swivel on the end of my braid and tie 1 foot of 30 lb mono. I guess i'm lazy but it works for me. I only have to deal with pickerel.
papajoe222 reply :
On 12/21/2016 at 8:52 AM, cgolf said:
the lake is pretty thick with muskys, but that is crazy.
It might be a case I need to move them more or go with less slack in the line, because I was missing some bass that were there and then gone when I gave a jerk after a pause
Two things I'll add; First, WHERE IS THIS LAKE that's thick with muskies?????
Second is you need to remember that in muskie and pike waters, bass are not at the top of the food chain and you will do better fishing for them in non-prime habitat. Stay away from flats with cabbage or pond weed. Coontail and hydrilla offer better cover for them and make it difficult for the longer fish to move around in. Small, isolated pieces of cover are another great target and mid-day dock fishing can be very productive, but avoid flats and docks early and late in the day.
Now back to that first thing I mentioned...................
cgolf reply :
On 12/22/2016 at 12:30 PM, papajoe222 said:Two things I'll add; First, WHERE IS THIS LAKE that's thick with muskies?????
Second is you need to remember that in muskie and pike waters, bass are not at the top of the food chain and you will do better fishing for them in non-prime habitat. Stay away from flats with cabbage or pond weed. Coontail and hydrilla offer better cover for them and make it difficult for the longer fish to move around in. Small, isolated pieces of cover are another great target and mid-day dock fishing can be very productive, but avoid flats and docks early and late in the day.
Now back to that first thing I mentioned...................
My guess is you have fished the area;) pm me if truly interested.
And Delavan over Geneva? I grew up down there and remember when they completely drained Delavan. Just wish I had fished more when I was a kid with Geneva 3 minutes from my house.
Attila reply :
Follow up; here's the leader.
"hamma" reply :
We have alot of pickerel laden waters over here, and I've found that if your getting more hits from them, move out just a bit deeper, and the bass will outnumber pickerel.,..Only exception being frog fishing lillies in the summer.
cgolf reply :
On 12/22/2016 at 8:32 PM, Attila said:Follow up; here's the leader.
I like that, wonder if they are still available now that Mustad is selling the clips? I do have some lighter wire, not titanium leaders I may try close to the boat and see what difference it truly makes in the bait. I just don't believe in heavy flourocarbon leaders. Growing up fishing a gin clear lake and catching pressured fish on good old trilene solar XT line, incredible stuff in its day, taught me that line color is pretty much all hype. Further testing with fireline and braid on other clear lakes with and without a flouro leader is enough evidence for me.
primetime reply :
Walmart has Bomber Long A's in both standard and Salt series for $1 right now. Just picked up a ton to sell on ebay. Right now you can buy 5 for $20 free shipping and I use them for salt and fresh, work as good as any, I like the Shadow rap but the bomber will produce just as good.
Bomber now has about 60 colors out, same as shadow raps with oranges, Purples etc...I would go that route and not use heavy wire but Berkley makes a black coated wire that looks and feels like braid. Guys use that for saltwater all the time and do fine.
cgolf reply :
On 12/23/2016 at 2:47 AM, primetime said:Walmart has Bomber Long A's in both standard and Salt series for $1 right now. Just picked up a ton to sell on ebay. Right now you can buy 5 for $20 free shipping and I use them for salt and fresh, work as good as any, I like the Shadow rap but the bomber will produce just as good.
Bomber now has about 60 colors out, same as shadow raps with oranges, Purples etc...I would go that route and not use heavy wire but Berkley makes a black coated wire that looks and feels like braid. Guys use that for saltwater all the time and do fine.
I think the biggest problem with a lot of leaders is the size of snaps, it isn't easy to find a quality leader with a smaller snap. That is the draw to the fastech one posted above, the snap looks to be about the same size I normally use.
The Bassman reply :
On 12/21/2016 at 7:18 PM, Megastink said:I fish lakes with a lot of chain Pickerel in them. Losing baits is part of the game. I lost a 110 two winters ago and haven't thrown them in those waters since. I save my high dollar baits for tournaments. If I'm fun fishing, I'll choose a Strike King KVD J300. They work very in my waters. We've got some whopper Pickerel up here in PA too, so no matter what I'm throwing, I'm always a little nervous.
That's an impressive pickerel! Do you know what it weighed? The world record isn't ten lb.
primetime reply :
On 12/23/2016 at 4:23 AM, cgolf said:
I think the biggest problem with a lot of leaders is the size of snaps, it isn't easy to find a quality leader with a smaller snap. That is the draw to the fastech one posted above, the snap looks to be about the same size I normally use.
I would check the offshore fishing threads for grouper rigs, King Fish, saltwater stuff. I have seen custom made rigs that were maid from different types of Kevlar, Teflon, mixed with braids....Never really made any rigs like that but Saltwater shops carry tons of different types of rigs, has to be away to pick the right snap with crimps & I bet a thread would know what to do.
I think the wire my Brother uses is a 7 strand coated wire, pure fishing makes it, It holds big Stripers in rocks & does not appear to be thicker than 65lb braid from what I remember.
Hope that helps..I would look up King Fish rigs but they use thicker wire, but may get some images on Google if you search and click images, that is what I do for almost anything when I need a Picture to make something.
Good Luck. Worst Case, Keep looking on Ebay this time of year for a lot of 30 old jerkbaits on auction and win it for really cheap so losing lures doesn't hurt, but losing fish probably hurts more. I would also look at live bait rigs for bottom fishing.
For Muskie and Pike you would need at least a 40lb snap min right? Tsunami makes really strong swivels and snaps that are better than the Spro stuff & much cheaper. I have 80lb snaps and swivels the size of a 30lb Mustad for example. Saltwater grade, Still not cheap but tiny. I would check them out, Tsunami is not a cheap company as many think. If you like many lures & tackle you fish now, you will be happy with Tsunami products.
Megastink reply :
On 12/23/2016 at 4:59 AM, The Bassman said:
That's an impressive pickerel! Do you know what it weighed? The world record isn't ten lb.
Thanks! Maybe 5-5.5lbs. There are some trophies up here for sure.
cgolf reply :
On 12/23/2016 at 5:23 AM, primetime said:I would check the offshore fishing threads for grouper rigs, King Fish, saltwater stuff. I have seen custom made rigs that were maid from different types of Kevlar, Teflon, mixed with braids....Never really made any rigs like that but Saltwater shops carry tons of different types of rigs, has to be away to pick the right snap with crimps & I bet a thread would know what to do.
I think the wire my Brother uses is a 7 strand coated wire, pure fishing makes it, It holds big Stripers in rocks & does not appear to be thicker than 65lb braid from what I remember.
Hope that helps..I would look up King Fish rigs but they use thicker wire, but may get some images on Google if you search and click images, that is what I do for almost anything when I need a Picture to make something.
Good Luck. Worst Case, Keep looking on Ebay this time of year for a lot of 30 old jerkbaits on auction and win it for really cheap so losing lures doesn't hurt, but losing fish probably hurts more. I would also look at live bait rigs for bottom fishing.
For Muskie and Pike you would need at least a 40lb snap min right? Tsunami makes really strong swivels and snaps that are better than the Spro stuff & much cheaper. I have 80lb snaps and swivels the size of a 30lb Mustad for example. Saltwater grade, Still not cheap but tiny. I would check them out, Tsunami is not a cheap company as many think. If you like many lures & tackle you fish now, you will be happy with Tsunami products.
Thanks for the ideas. I actually think I have the pure fishing leader you are speaking of. In the picture is that leader, a silver 21 strand 100 lb test leader with 50 lb power pro in the middle. The shadow rap shad is in the picture to give an idea of the snap size. The 21 strand leader will be for Musky baits and RESs as long as the snap doesn't mess with the action.
The pure fishing leader might be a winner.
I do do wish the pure fishing leader was a bit longer, musky, like smallies, know they are bad**** and run you under the boat, jump, change directions, and are just plain nuts. Beyond the initial bite the will saw you off depending on how they took the bait. Lt. of fun though, I do better bass fishing for them than tossing musky lures.
WIGuide reply :
On 12/21/2016 at 8:52 AM, cgolf said:
I have never tried it, but I have heard pickled pike is incredible. The only issue with them is they have a Y bone is more difficult to filet out.
How do you manage, I lost 2 shadow raps in 40 casts, one was on the 4th cast, granted the lake is pretty thick with muskys, but that is crazy.
It might be a case I need to move them more or go with less slack in the line, because I was missing some bass that were there and then gone when I gave a jerk after a pause
There will be days where you lose them like that, just like any bait, but then you'll have some baits you'll use a few years before you lose them. It stinks when you lose more expensive baits, but part of that is going to be the cost of fishing unfortunately. That's the reason I don't have a Vision 110 or anything Lucky Craft. If the toothy critters are too thick anyway, it'd be worth trying some of that tie-able wire A-jay told you about.
Also, as far as eating the toothy critters, if you like pickled fish there's a great way to cut them up so you don't waste meat and you don't have to deal with the bone. You take the clean strips to fry up and then you pickle the rest when you save enough up.
Jeff H reply :
On 12/23/2016 at 6:48 AM, WIGuide said:
Also, as far as eating the toothy critters, if you like pickled fish there's a great way to cut them up so you don't waste meat and you don't have to deal with the bone. You take the clean strips to fry up and then you pickle the rest when you save enough up.
Too much bother, they do a better job helping to grow vegetables in the garden! 
Freakin' gators! If it's one thing I can't stand...
WIGuide reply :
On 12/23/2016 at 6:52 AM, Jeff H said:
Too much bother, they do a better job helping to grow vegetables in the garden!
I'm sure they do a good job there too, but being to much of a bother is debatable haha
fishwizzard reply :
Pickled pike? I have liked every other pickled thing I have tried, but I am not so sure about pickled fish.
Dwight Hottle reply :
Shore lunch of pike is as good as walleye.
fishwizzard reply :
I looked up some recipes and the next fat pickerel I catch is going to get eaten.
I also hereby call dibs on the name "The Picked Pike" for the dock bar I plan to open in my retirement.
WIGuide reply :
On 12/23/2016 at 7:06 AM, Bunnielab said:Pickled pike? I have liked every other pickled thing I have tried, but I am not so sure about pickled fish.
If you like pickled hearing, you'll most likely enjoy pickled pike. It's firmer, less, slimy, and has a sweeter taste to it. It will stink up the house a bit when you make it because of the pickling spice, but it's definitely worth it!
cgolf reply :
On 12/27/2016 at 9:28 PM, WIGuide said:If you like pickled hearing, you'll most likely enjoy pickled pike. It's firmer, less, slimy, and has a sweeter taste to it. It will stink up the house a bit when you make it because of the pickling spice, but it's definitely worth it!
My grandpa got me started on pickled herring, awesome stuff, then I got married and my wife can't stand it. Once in a great while I will buy a jar and keep it in the fridge at work to get my fix.
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