Backlashing mid cast/ Can't get distance 2024
Shak Muscles reply :
So I just got a baitcasting setup and I'm a pretty casual fisherman so I have no clue what I'm doing. I've read all the articles and such and adjusted my spool tension to match my bait(I throw mostly senkos which are about 3/8 oz). I have my brakes around 7-9 out of 9 total brakes. However, even with smooth motions I still end up backlashing when I do overhead casts, and it is often mid cast even though I'm thumbing the spool and making it stop before it hits the water. Any tips on how to fix this?
Also, using the measure distance tool on google maps, I estimated that in general I'm only casting around 25 yards tops(usually around 20-25 yds). And I've heard that most people can throw most lures around 30-40 yards. Casting distance is needed for me since I fish from the shore on ponds and some areas are inaccessible on foot. On my spinning setup which is just a 50$ combo from bass pro I can cast around 30 yds pretty easily. And I thought that baitcasters in general cast further than spinning rods.
As for my equipment, I didn't buy anything super expensive since I'm just a casual fisherman.
Rod- *** Fate Chrome 7'1" Medium power Extra fast action. Lure weight 1/4oz to 3/4oz or something like that
Reel- KastKing assassin (I heard good reviews about this reel)
Line- Powerpro super 8 slick 20lb braid.
riverbasser reply :
Normally a backlash mid cast has to do with brakes since bait is normally being caught in wind. But since your brakes are near maxed out I'm not sure what's happening. I will say 20lb braid is pretty small for a BC. I use 30lb minimum. I also don't fish weightless senkos. This is a job for a spinning reel.
Have you tried throwing any other lures with some more weight to them?
Hez reply :
I let a fellow angler use my son's Kast King Legend this past Saturday. He backlashed often (the guy is a BFL co-angler, he knows how to use a baitcaster) as well. When I got home I took the kast king apart to see if I could figure out what the problem might have been.
Only thing I noticed was that the #1 centrifugal brakes on the interior was in the on position. I have not got to take this reel back out and test it yet, but I encourage you to check out yours (maybe watch a how-to video on adjusting them first) and see if this helps.
Some of the admins here have received a few of these reels to test them out, and have actually taken them apart to compare the guts. One of those guys might have more to say on this particular topic.
Montanaro reply :
Mid cast would seem to indicate that your spool is spinning faster than your lure is pulling out line. Use heavier lure/tighten spool tension knob/try not to whip your cast as it will create excessive spool rpm.
fishballer06 reply :
Your braking on your reel sounds good (in fact, maybe overkill for a Senko), but I would question if your spool tension needs adjusted more. You want that bait to just fall slowly if you release the clutch with the bait just hanging. The best way I would say to do this for a beginner is to tighten it to the point that the bait won't fall at all, and then slowly loosen it up until the bait starts barely falling. Take a few casts with it like that. Once you get the feel of it, loosen it up a hair more so you've got a slow but consistent fall to the bait. This should give you an optimal balance of casting distance and backlash control.
This also could all be overthinking on my part. You mentioned this only happens during overhead casts. Do you have this issue with side arm casts or while pitching? If it's only during over head casting, it's possible your form isn't perfect yet. Keep practicing and it will come to you.
As for your distance, 25 yards with a weightless Senko is still pretty darn good. You're talking 75 feet at that point. In reality, a weightless Senko with a hook is probably around a 1/4oz. (maybe a hair over). You've got the proper rod for fishing a Senko, so I wouldn't blame it on that. With practice, you'll get better. If you're beating the banks and want to reach spots that you couldn't reach before, consider purchasing some knee high muck boots or some hip waders. Back whenever I fished the banks, I wore hip waders to help get me out into deeper water that the normal bank guys weren't fishing. Spots that I thought were good fishing spots, were only two feet deep at 60 feet out from the shore.
12poundbass reply :
Like Fishballer said try a sidearm cast or something in between. I have the same problem when I cast overhead. I switched to a sidearm cast and no problems since.
RoLo reply :
Overrun during mid-cast points to the braking system, but if it occurs
during the last half of the cast, as I suspect, I'd re-adjust the spool tension.
Hold the rod parallel to the ground, depress the thumb bar and let the lure
hit the ground in a freefall. If there's any indication of overrun on the spool,
(fluffy line) get rid of it by tightening your tension knob.
Roger
BaitFinesse reply :
It sounds like your spool speed is too fast and is feeding more line to the bait than it can take causing the line to fluff up mid cast and then the spools slows too rapidly at the end of the cast shortening distance.
CLASSIC linear mag braking behavior.
What you're after is a reel with a centrifugal braking componet. Centrifugal brakes will cut in through centrifugal forces and govern the spool rpm then cut out as the spool slows alowing for long casts. If you are ok with a plastic frame reel I would try to find a Shimano Casitas or other Shimano SVS reel. You can set up an SVS reel with little to no spool tension and the centrifugal brakes are suffcent to contol the spool.
Team9nine reply :
Sounds like your outfit is fine. Based on the bait and what you wrote, I'm chalking this one up to inexperience and over expectations. I think things will improve with a little more time and experience.
david in va reply :
Well mine [Kastking Stealth] was doing the same thing, I can help I think. take the side cover off and put all the brakes on, turn the dial to 9, adj the spool so the bait falls slowly to the ground and the spool stops when the bait touches ground. and put 50 lb braid on, make sure you wind it tight.
Then make some casts side arm. cast with just the wrist. Thumb the reel just as the bait hits water
you can back off the brake after you get use to it.
David
Edited by david in vaspelling
offsidewing reply :
A rod has a rating for line diameter like lure weights (20lb braid is about same diameter as 6 or 8lb mono) so check on that. Also make sure your spool isn't over filled with line. Keep in mind if you're whipping a casting rod like a spinning rod you're gonna have issues, especially with thin diameter line.
I will avoid any comments on quality or longevity of the forum sponsor Kast King reels, but about the only non-glowing comment they receive from the mods who tested them are that they require a trained thumb when casting.
Delaware Valley Tackle reply :
First off, for sheer distance spinning tackle is the way to go. That said, 25 yards is not terrible. Over head casts are rarely the best. Whipping the rod gets the spool spinning fast causing the over run as the bait decelerates. The rod may well be too powerful and not loading correctly. Cast with a smooth motion. Let the rod do the work
moguy1973 reply :
On 4/25/2017 at 5:40 AM, LowRange said:It sounds like your spool speed is too fast and is feeding more line to the bait than it can take causing the line to fluff up mid cast and then the spools slows too rapidly at the end of the cast shortening distance.
CLASSIC linear mag braking behavior.
What you're after is a reel with a centrifugal braking componet. Centrifugal brakes will cut in through centrifugal forces and govern the spool rpm then cut out as the spool slows alowing for long casts. If you are ok with a plastic frame reel I would try to find a Shimano Casitas or other Shimano SVS reel. You can set up an SVS reel with little to no spool tension and the centrifugal brakes are suffcent to contol the spool.
The Kastking Assassin has centrifugal brakes. I'm guessing none of them are on. I would start with 3 of them on and three off and go from there. Make sure they are on in a triangle pattern skipping every other one.
david in va reply :
On 4/25/2017 at 6:35 AM, offsidewing said:A rod has a rating for line diameter like lure weights (20lb braid is about same diameter as 6 or 8lb mono) so check on that. Also make sure your spool isn't over filled with line. Keep in mind if you're whipping a casting rod like a spinning rod you're gonna have issues, especially with thin diameter line.
I will avoid any comments on quality or longevity of the forum sponsor Kast King reels, but about the only non-glowing comment they receive from the mods who tested them are that they require a trained thumb when casting.
I have a quality reel coming to compare the Kastking with. I will let all know the outcome
David
BaitFinesse reply :
On 4/25/2017 at 6:57 AM, moguy1973 said:The Kastking Assassin has centrifugal brakes. I'm guessing none of them are on. I would start with 3 of them on and three off and go from there. Make sure they are on in a triangle pattern skipping every other one.
I wouldn't call those centrifugal brakes. They're fitted to the palming plate and as such do not rotate meaning that they are not activated through centrifugal forces. They're more like a spring driven mechanical brake. Turning a few of them on would probably help though.
Shak Muscles reply :
On 4/25/2017 at 3:24 AM, riverbasser said:Normally a backlash mid cast has to do with brakes since bait is normally being caught in wind. But since your brakes are near maxed out I'm not sure what's happening. I will say 20lb braid is pretty small for a BC. I use 30lb minimum. I also don't fish weightless senkos. This is a job for a spinning reel.
Have you tried throwing any other lures with some more weight to them?
No a senko is all I've tried so far.
On 4/25/2017 at 3:42 AM, fishballer06 said:This also could all be overthinking on my part. You mentioned this only happens during overhead casts. Do you have this issue with side arm casts or while pitching? If it's only during over head casting, it's possible your form isn't perfect yet. Keep practicing and it will come to you.
I usually only have issues with overhead casts, but sometimes when I whip sidearms I get the issue. Maybe I'm so used to using a spinning rod that I am whipping the rod without really noticing it, like other posters have said.
Also, I think I was being too vague when I just said mid cast. I meant that the senko would be flying out just fine and look like it was going to be a nice and smooth cast and then out of the blue without warning it would just knot up and the bait would jerk to a stop and flop on the water. And these backlashes aren't bad they're only tiny little twists(or whatever they're called) which I get out in like 5 seconds but it gets annoying when it seems every cast just jerks to a stop.
BaitFinesse reply :
is your spool over filled? Too much line on the spool can have problems getting out of its own way and wrap up on itself causing spool stops. Light braid is particularly prone to this.
RoLo reply :
On 4/25/2017 at 5:58 AM, Team9nine said:I'm chalking this one up to inexperience and over expectations.
Yah, I suppose that's what I should've said
Then again, I wasn't sure how to spell 'inxpeeriense' 
Roger
Shak Muscles reply :
On 4/25/2017 at 7:52 AM, LowRange said:is your spool over filled? Too much line on the spool can have problems getting out of its own way and wrap up on itself causing spool stops. Light braid is particularly prone to this.
I think that its not overfilled but I'm not sure. Its a little below the edge of the entire spool. On the Assassin reel atleast there is a blue line which marks the end of the spool and the line goes a bit under that. So I don't think its over filled but I'm not completely sure.
I actually went out today and practiced my casts and I was casting much smoother than the past few days. It wasn't backlashing as much and I tried some of the tips such as setting the brakes at 0 before setting tension and I purposely set my tension a bit higher than usual and kept my brakes at 9. I also opened up the brake compartment of my reel but I didn't see any brake thingys inside except for the dial, so I'm not sure about setting the centrifugals on the reel.
I feel like the big difference actually came from my casting motion, this time it was less of a whip and more of a smooth full body cast, meaning I put my whole body momentum into it like throwing a football. It seemed kinda odd but it worked. And I was getting better distance despite my tension being high and my brakes on full. I can say maybe I touched 90 ft(about 30 yds). Which is an improvement for me. It seems I just need more hang time on my casts. However occasionally I still experienced the sudden stop of the spool in mid air. Honestly I wouldn't really call it a backlash more just a abrupt stop due to the line getting a little tangled up.
Could it be that I'm just not feathing the spool properly. When I set the tension high I just quit feathering the spool because I didn't want to cast really short and it worked out fine for the most part. I feel like when I feather the spool the cast ends up being much shorter, and it doesn't really make a difference on the backlashes. Maybe my thumb is doing things incorrectly?
david in va reply :
The 20 lb braid is the problem with the mid air stops the line is biting into the lower layers
the internal breaks are under the dial;
line too small
.ghoti. reply :
On 4/25/2017 at 8:02 AM, RoLo said:
Yah, I suppose that's what I should've said
Then again, I wasn't sure how to spell 'inxpeeriense'
Roger
Now that's droll, right there.
RoLo reply :
On 4/25/2017 at 9:42 AM, .ghoti. said:Now that's droll, right there.
fishnkamp reply :
For your next practice session tie on a heavier bait like a texas rigged plastic worm with a 3/8 or 1/2 ounce worm weight. I want you to get used to how the reel plays. As you get better with it loosen off the brakes and the cst control a tiny bit at a time. If you are set at 9 on the brakes, practice till that feels good. Then back off to 7 or 8 and loosen up the spool tension a touch, just a little. As you get better you will see longer distances. I also recommend buying a cheap hula hoop from the dollar store. Begin trying to cast into the hoop for learning accuracy.
I agree with many of these guys I would probably pull off your braid ( put it on a spool to reuse on some spinning gear.
I like to first spool some mono then fill the rest of the spool with the braid. If I fill the reel half way with both lines I make my more expensive braid spool fill two reels.
Mosster47 reply :
You're casting too hard.
fishballer06 reply :
On 4/25/2017 at 9:36 AM, david in va said:The 20 lb braid is the problem with the mid air stops the line is biting into the lower layers
the internal breaks are under the dial; line too small
I'm starting to think the same thing too. Step up to 40 lb. braid and it should help ease this issue.
TX-Deluxe reply :
Have you tried all the brakes on?
Shak Muscles reply :
On 4/25/2017 at 10:12 AM, fishnkamp said:I agree with many of these guys I would probably pull off your braid ( put it on a spool to reuse on some spinning gear.
I like to first spool some mono then fill the rest of the spool with the braid. If I fill the reel half way with both lines I make my more expensive braid spool fill two reels.
Yeah I used the mono backing trick so I don't cover my entire spool with braid. The reason I went with 20lb test braid was so that I could use a fluorocarbon leader on it and tie the FG knot. With the FG knot you pretty much need thin(er) braid so that it can dig into the fluorocarbon line. And I think my rod has microguides, I need the slim profile of the FG knot. If I put 40lb braid and 20+lb fluoro as my leader I think the knot would have a harder time getting through the guides.
I'm in a dilemma here. I guess I could go with just braid and forget the leader.
I do get the feeling that the braid is digging into itself and causing my casts to stop abruptly. So I guess I gotta get 40lb test. Would that be bad for microguides though, since my line will be much thicker?
fishnkamp reply :
Try using P line CXX 8 pound test for the leader. I use it with 14 pound tes FireLine, 30 pound Power Pro Spectra braid and 832 braid.
CTBassin860 reply :
Tighten your spool tension and try using a "roll cast"
nameiztaken reply :
2 Problems:
1: Weightless Senkos are for Spinning reels.
2: 30lb braid minimum. 20 is too small imo.
Shak Muscles reply :
On 4/26/2017 at 11:38 AM, nameiztaken said:2 Problems:
1: Weightless Senkos are for Spinning reels.2: 30lb braid minimum. 20 is too small imo.
Weightless senkos are around 3/8 oz so I feel like they should work fine with baitcasters, but yeah I gotta look into getting thicker braid.
lilbuddy reply :
On 4/25/2017 at 9:17 AM, Shak Muscles said:
I actually went out today and practiced my casts and I was casting much smoother than the past few days. It wasn't backlashing as much and I tried some of the tips such as setting the brakes at 0 before setting tension and I purposely set my tension a bit higher than usual and kept my brakes at 9. I also opened up the brake compartment of my reel but I didn't see any brake thingys inside except for the dial, so I'm not sure about setting the centrifugals on the reel.
When you take the side off you'll see 4 little orange plastic nubs...they're in a square shape.... If they are up then push them all down...that will tighten up the brakes as well...then once you get use to the reel push on brake up....All of my baitcasters I have 2 up and 2 down (every other one).....
Ok, now Im jumping onto this thread b/c I started a similar thread on this issue but with a 6 gill reel.... I don't consider myself a pro (even though they get backlashes too) but I've used baitcasters all the time. I had seen advertisements for 6 gill and thought I would try it out given they were running a promo.
I'm having the same issue with the reel backlashing as the lure is half way to the location Im casting to. I've played with the brakes and tried everything I can think of and everything that was mentioned here....the only thing I haven't done was to take the reel totally apart and clean it. I've taken the side plate off and pulled the spool out....cleaned all those parts and oiled them back up...I did that before I even put line on the reel.
I have a variety of baitcasters like abu, bps (bionic) and lews......NONE of those reels do I have an issue with...I even have a cheap abu silver max that works pretty good for the money.
I'm starting to chalk this up to a cheap POS reel....I plan on having a buddy try it who definitely has more experience than me.
If you want to see the other thread I had on this product you can find it https://www.bassresource.com/bass-fishing-forums/topic/189893-6-gill-casting-reels/#comment-2144323
A-Jay reply :
So much good advice already offered here.
Not wanting to repeat any of it, I would like to humbly offer the following . . . . .
Rarely has a casting reel Ever Backlashed on it's own.
But anglers have been know to do so.
A-Jay.
RoLo reply :
On 4/27/2017 at 9:51 PM, A-Jay said:So much good advice already offered here.
Not wanting to repeat any of it, I would like to humbly offer the following . . . . .
Rarely has a casting reel Ever Backlashed on it's own.
But anglers have been know to do so.
A-Jay.
Watch You Talkin Bout Willis?
Roger
A-Jay reply :
On 4/27/2017 at 10:04 PM, RoLo said:Watch You Talkin Bout Willis?
Roger
A-Jay
Shak Muscles reply :
Thank you all for the good advice. I took your guys' advise and bought myself some 40lb Powerpro superslick line and I'll leave the 20lb for my spinning reel. I also looked into the braking system and apparently the centrifugal brakes on the Assassin are set with a dial rather than manually pulling each brake. So I set the centrifugals to 3 out of 6(I'm not sure what it was at to begin) and right now I still have the magnetics at max but I'll probably drop them significantly since I've read its better to rely on centrifugal brakes more anyway. Once my power pro comes in I'll try it out and see if I can have some more success!
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