Don't Believe The Hype 2024
DelcoSol reply :
Hey guys, I have a question to pose for everyone: Are there any "rules" I guess you would call them of bass fishing that you just do not believe in? Wether it is a pattern, lure type etc. For example you hear many things about different colors or sounds, also it may be something like the weather is X so the fish are supposed to do Y.
This year for example, the summer is supposed to be some of the toughest time to fish, while spring and fall and the best. I have had much better luck during the summer than spring and so far fall. I am not saying its not true, but as anglers hearing all of these "experts" spout off all of these different things that kind of stick into everyone's head, may cause us to do things that we are "supposed" to do. I know I myself am addicted to fishing and come here to try to learn everything I can, but the thing I wonder is that am I overcomplicating things? I think now to Mike Iaconelli's book where he talks about fishing in the moment. I really don't do this enough. I spend too much worrying about what the fish are supposed to be doing rather than fishing to what they are doing. Anyway, I just wanted to hear your thoughts on this. I am sorry if this rambling is too hard to follow.
Sam reply :
As a Flyers' fan you could never ramble. Now if you are a Jersey or New York fan you would be too dumb to ramble.
To answer your question, no real "rules" just taking each situation as it presents itself and having to decide on baits and presentations.
The main problem with fishing "rules" is that the bass can't read so they don't know them. This means the bass act as they wish under different conditions, even when you expect them to do "A" and the do "B."
Some guys have rules, like dark colors in stained or muddy water (caught nice one on a lemon Senko in dirty water); or using a quiet skinny lipless crankbait in cold water; or throwing only a buzzbait for a topwater; and the list can go on.
Your goal is to figure out the pattern. You first use your experience and knowledge and then after that fails throw whatever you want with whatever presentation you want until the bass tell you what they want.
The only rule I follow is no bananas on the boat. That's it. Open season on everything else.
Now go watch some preseason Flyers games and go fishing before the waters freeze over on the Main Line, where the Men Are Successful, the Women Attractive and the Children are Smart.
roadwarrior reply :
Well, as a specific example: I like a big splash to attract curious bass.
On the Tennessee River our brown and green fish like Country Music
played LOUD!
Tartan34 reply :
I don't believe that topwater fishing is only for mornings/evenings.....and can't be fished all day long on bright, sunny, hot days.
DelcoSol reply :
LOL Sam you never cease to crack me up. Flyers are on tomorrow BTW 
The past three weekends have been tough for me. The weather is really cold at night then warm in the day. I assume this is the issue? I just keep reading all of these things about how the cooler fall weather turns the fishing on and it seems like it's the opposite for me. I have been throwing all kinds of things starting with the things the fish are supposed to want this time of the year with no luck. Bottom line is that I just need to find what the fish want at that given moment and not focus on fall type patterns.
I was actually talking to a buddy of mine about how funny it would be if fish couldn't hear. Talk about one of the biggest scams ever. All of these lures used to make sounds, along with all of the tactics we use to be quiet, would be quite ironic.
Catt reply :
The presumable seasonal pattern for winter is to fish slow.
The first question I ask is can someone explain why a Rat-L-Trap is so deadly in cold water?
Never did get an answer 
Many anglers try to apply "science" to bass fishing but outside of environmental & biological needs one can not apply science to bass fishing.
In the scientific community any studies called "scientific" when said studies are done on bass in an aquarium (tank) are not accepted as scientific.
Scientific laws are statements that describe, predict, & perhaps explain why, a range of phenomena behave as they appear in NATURE!
flyfisher reply :
My biggest one is that fly rods are only for trout and there is no way you can catch a large fish on one of those "noodle rods" 
pbizzle reply :
On 9/24/2013 at 9:57 AM, Catt said:The presumable seasonal pattern for winter is to fish slow.
The first question I ask is can someone explain why a Rat-L-Trap is so deadly in cold water?
Never did get an answer
Many anglers try to apply "science" to bass fishing but outside of environmental & biological needs one can not apply science to bass fishing.
In the scientific community any studies called "scientific" when said studies are done on bass in an aquarium (tank) are not accepted as scientific.
Scientific laws are statements that describe, predict, & perhaps explain why, a range of phenomena behave as they appear in NATURE!
A scientific law in my mind is best put into fishing terms like this "if the conditions are X than the fish must be Y." Well in bass fishing we can't do this because of the amount of variables. While there are instincts that may make this true for a percentage of fish, not all fish have the same reactions when put into any given situation. Therefore, because a scientific law must be true 100% of the time, you can't have a scientific law that works with bass fishing.
DISCLAIMER : That's coming from a 14 year old so correct me if I'm wrong.
Catt reply :
Dang a 14 year gets what most adults can't
SudburyBasser reply :
On 9/24/2013 at 8:38 AM, Tartan34 said:I don't believe that topwater fishing is only for mornings/evenings.....and can't be fished all day long on bright, sunny, hot days.
I practically won a tournament fishing top waters all day. I am in total agreement.
To add to the thread: I don't think colour is as important as people argue.
bigbill reply :
At the start I throw a variety of different colors and style of lures till something works. It's topwater, shallow cranks, senkos, deeper cranks, spinnerbaits, inline spinners and minnowbaits. Most of the time my system works. If I still didn't catch anything I go though my lures again by changing the presentations. I do get action on the second run thru my tackle box. If not I practice my presentations. Then a bass will interrupt me. I hate being interrupted. Its what it is, its called fishing.
Grizzn N Bassin reply :
Well idk I agree with catt I throw swim baits in the winter up here and I do just fine... one day comes to mind ... mid 20's windy cloudy, half the lake had ice on it... caught a few pigs swiming swim bait..the 2 days prior I was dragging jigs with junks on the back.not one bass...
Grizzn N Bassin reply :
I've caught them with R-traps and baits moving super slow... I just fish and don't "believe the hype"
Bluebasser86 reply :
One of the biggest one I argue with is the "match the hatch" rule. Sometimes it is 100% true, but times when there's millions of shad in the lake I do much better to offer them something in a different color or size to stand out from the crowd.
TBendBassin reply :
There are absolutely no rules in bass fishing, just guidelines. Don't ever forget that!! When you limit yourself to those so called "rules" you will never progress into a better angler. There is one rule though that is absolutely 100% true... And that is time on the water is the only way to become a better angler.. I know I sound like a broken record when saying that but it's the truth. forums like this one are absolutely great for people to get ideas and get started on learning different techniques and such but there is a HUGE difference in reading about it and actually doing it and figuring out all the details involved. One of the biggest mistakes I see alot of novice anglers make is reading all they can about techniques and seasonal patterns and then try and force that information when they are on the water. That's just not how it works! The more time you spend on the water the more you will start to understand bass behavior and the little signs and details that will get you dialed in on the fish. Ok I guess I got a little of topic there lol but
Loop_Dad reply :
When I hear "rules" I want to know why of it. Then I make my own theory and try it out. If it works, great. If not, try something else. And I enjoy this process.
One rule I do not really believe is darker lure for low light condition. I don't think that's that simple. If the lure is above the fish and then the fish see silhouette. The color should not matter as long as it is not a transparent lure. If the lure is below the fish the fish is seeing reflection of the what ever low light there is, so brighter color should be more visible. However more visible does not necessary mean more fish. I also learned that red and yellow goes through the most in the water. So my thing now is a bit of yellow/chart on my lure in darker condition to help fish notice my lure passing by.
SirSnookalot reply :
On 9/24/2013 at 10:22 AM, flyfisher said:My biggest one is that fly rods are only for trout and there is no way you can catch a large fish on one of those "noodle rods"
I've seen more this year than I can remember, fishermen using fly rods to fish the inlet. Most of the time the current is running 7-10 knots, that's pretty fast water with the primary species being snook, tarpon, barracuda and jack crevalles, these are not small fish.
Back to bass, I don't over analyze and seldom read articles, I don't think anything has helped me more than time fishing and knowing my home waters. I keep things simple using only a few different types of lures. I didn't always fish ponds and canals in Florida I grew up fishing Lake St Clair and lake Erie (Rondeau Bay) in a rowboat with 6.5 hp Elgin with no electronics, in hindsight it wasn't a bad way to learn how to fish. That said being on the right water is a big equalizer.
DelcoSol reply :
On 9/24/2013 at 1:17 PM, TBendBassin said:There are absolutely no rules in bass fishing, just guidelines. Don't ever forget that!! When you limit yourself to those so called "rules" you will never progress into a better angler. There is one rule though that is absolutely 100% true... And that is time on the water is the only way to become a better angler.. I know I sound like a broken record when saying that but it's the truth. forums like this one are absolutely great for people to get ideas and get started on learning different techniques and such but there is a HUGE difference in reading about it and actually doing it and figuring out all the details involved. One of the biggest mistakes I see alot of novice anglers make is reading all they can about techniques and seasonal patterns and then try and force that information when they are on the water. That's just not how it works! The more time you spend on the water the more you will start to understand bass behavior and the little signs and details that will get you dialed in on the fish. Ok I guess I got a little of topic there lol but
This is exactly my point. Sometimes we will tend to get tunnel vision. The bottom line is that you can't catch them from your living room. The more you're out there the beter your odds are. Find what they want at that given moment and stick with it. Sometimes forums can be a bad thing. As an automotive technician I see a lot of people bring their cars in to get fixed after reading various forums insisting that I need to do X or Y, when me being the professional knows what's wrong and their forum info is incorrect. I guess if it's on the internet it has to be true lol.
Fishing Rhino reply :
On 9/24/2013 at 1:17 PM, TBendBassin said:There are absolutely no rules in bass fishing, just guidelines. Don't ever forget that!! When you limit yourself to those so called "rules" you will never progress into a better angler. There is one rule though that is absolutely 100% true... And that is time on the water is the only way to become a better angler.. I know I sound like a broken record when saying that but it's the truth. forums like this one are absolutely great for people to get ideas and get started on learning different techniques and such but there is a HUGE difference in reading about it and actually doing it and figuring out all the details involved. One of the biggest mistakes I see alot of novice anglers make is reading all they can about techniques and seasonal patterns and then try and force that information when they are on the water. That's just not how it works! The more time you spend on the water the more you will start to understand bass behavior and the little signs and details that will get you dialed in on the fish. Ok I guess I got a little of topic there lol but
I disagree with your only rule. You can become a better angler by learning from the experiences of others, be it through any form of communication, printed, spoken, or video.
If all one did was to fish, everything they learned would be through trial and error. Why not learn from the experience of those who share their knowledge, and eliminate a lot of trial and error?
flyfisher reply :
On 9/24/2013 at 8:00 PM, Fishing Rhino said:I disagree with your only rule. You can become a better angler by learning from the experiences of others, be it through any form of communication, printed, spoken, or video.
If all one did was to fish, everything they learned would be through trial and error. Why not learn from the experience of those who share their knowledge, and eliminate a lot of trial and error?
I think it is more learn what you can from others and practice those techniques. Someone can tell you what a hit on a texas rigged plastic feels like but even with that knowledge you will still miss fish until you experience it yourself.
Dwight Hottle reply :
On 9/24/2013 at 8:57 PM, flyfisher said:I think it is more learn what you can from others and practice those techniques. Someone can telly ou waht a hit on a texas rigged plastic feels like but even wwiht that knowledge you will still miss fish until you experience it yourself.
It's too early to be drinking, hangover maybe? LOL
flyfisher reply :
On 9/24/2013 at 9:13 PM, Dwight Hottle said:It's too early to be drinking, hangover maybe? LOL
I didn't know it was ever to early....
*Hootie reply :
One popular bass magazine, with every issue, has a, "throw this, don't throw this" list. Many times, I am having my best luck from a bait on the don't throw this list. Go figure.
Hootie
Hyrule Bass reply :
search baits, dont believe in the concept of them. you can call it that if you want because its the first thing you tie on or throw, but it doesnt mean its going to find you fish or work better than any other bait you couldve thrown first.
roadwarrior reply :
On 9/24/2013 at 8:00 PM, Fishing Rhino said:I disagree with your only rule. You can become a better angler by learning from the experiences of others, be it through any form of communication, printed, spoken, or video.
If all one did was to fish, everything they learned would be through trial and error. Why not learn from the experience of those who share their knowledge, and eliminate a lot of trial and error?
I agree and would add that hiring the right guide can be the best thing you will ever do to rachet up your game quickly.
Catt reply :
The difficulty with any " forum", be it on the internet or what we call "dock" talk is to decern between what is applicable & what is just talk.
With the advent of the internet came an explosion of knowledge but sadly there is very little wisdom.
If you don't believe a "forum" setting can be helpful then you need to read my thread on Toledo Bend which has helped dozens of anglers become familiar with the lake & thus become better anglers.
Practice only makes one better if what is practiced is the correct way.
J Francho reply :
I think my favorite bass idiom to ignore is to downsize after a cold front.
Raul reply :
I have one rule:
1.- there are no rules
For any other "rule" ----> go to Rule No1.
SPEEDBEAD. reply :
Swimbaits only work in California.
LOL, sure....
pbizzle reply :
On 9/24/2013 at 9:41 PM, flyfisher said:I didn't know it was ever to early....
Remember it's perfectly acceptable to start drinking at 8 am... in nearly every trailer park.
Mike L reply :
Improvise, Overcome, Adapt...
Rules, der ain't no stinkin rules!!
I wish there were, it would make our lives much easier. Just follow along and get in line.
For some reason I really don't think we'd like that very much. I know I wouldn't.
That's what I love about Bass fishing, it's the color, speed, action, water, weather, size, approach, angles, line size, etc etc. It doesn't end.
When I first moved to Florida all everyone I knew wanted to fish was salt water...Just throw something out there and you'll catch something.
Don't know what, but you'll catch something...If you didn't care and were'nt targeting anything specific, you did.
Mike
Snakehead Whisperer reply :
On 9/24/2013 at 8:40 AM, DelcoSol said:
I was actually talking to a buddy of mine about how funny it would be if fish couldn't hear. Talk about one of the biggest scams ever. All of these lures used to make sounds, along with all of the tactics we use to be quiet, would be quite ironic.
There is actually quite a bit of research that mostly concludes that bass (and most other fish) cannot hear the sound frequencies of metal bb's used in fish lures. They can feel the vibration of them rolling around and clacking the inside of the bait, however. Here's a mention of it in the NY Times. Don't have any web links for the rest, it's all in printed material from university studies/DNR stuff (old.)
I make crankbaits and lures a lot, and typically I make silent lures nowadays. I've found that most baits perform as well or better without making any extra sound. A crankbait naturally pushes water and creates a thumping vibration as it's retrieved, which is more similar to the sound of natural forage swimming. There are times when loud lures seem to draw strikes, but I still doubt it's the rattle. For example, most wakebaits have loud rattles but they also push a lot of water. Fish that are in an aggressive feeding mood will hit most anything that moves and will fit in their mouths.
Bait fish don't rattle and they don't turn black at night/in turbid water. Bass seem to find them just fine, regardless. Confidence is a major factor, and whatever an angler has confidence in will outproduce other baits simply because you will be more at ease with presentation if you're confident in a bait. Obviously baits with rattles work, and so does throwing dark baits at night... the question is whether it's necessary to throw them, or if it's just an accepted protocol. I've found that very few are willing to experiment with these types of things.
There is so much hype in fishing that I couldn't even begin to tell you all of my opinions. But so is life. Inquisitive people will find the truth on their own, and many won't.
bigbill reply :
The bass can't see all the colors like we do all the time. Somedays one color will work and on other days an assortment of colors will work do to the water conditions, the plant life and the sunlite. I figure a lure with a rattle plus using a scent gives me an edge. But finding what color they can see at this time is important too.
jignfule reply :
On 9/24/2013 at 10:13 PM, Catt said:The difficulty with any " forum", be it on the internet or what we call "dock" talk is to decern between what is applicable & what is just talk.
With the advent of the internet came an explosion of knowledge but sadly there is very little wisdom.
If you don't believe a "forum" setting can be helpful then you need to read my thread on Toledo Bend which has helped dozens of anglers become familiar with the lake & thus become better anglers.
Practice only makes one better if what is practiced is the correct way.
I agree "Practice makes perfect" ? NO WAY !!! "Perfect practice makes perfect"
pbizzle reply :
On 9/25/2013 at 4:53 AM, jignfule said:I agree "Practice makes perfect" ? NO WAY !!! "Perfect practice makes perfect"
That's what my old wrestling coach said.
aquaholic reply :
On 9/24/2013 at 9:48 PM, Red Earth said:search baits, dont believe in the concept of them. you can call it that if you want because its the first thing you tie on or throw, but it doesnt mean its going to find you fish or work better than any other bait you couldve thrown first.
I am 100% with this. I see a lot of people talking about throwing search baits out and then moving to a slow bait . I start with the slow bait a majority of the time.
K_Mac reply :
I will agree that bass are opportunistic predators and will sometimes bite anything that moves. I will also agree that sometimes going against conventional wisdom can be a winning approach. Having the skill, experience, and confidence to effectively and consistently do things a little differently than everyone else is how champions are made. That only happens, in my opinion, through knowledge and understanding of bass and the tools available to catch them, and then figuring out what works best for you.
Scott F reply :
On 9/24/2013 at 9:48 PM, Red Earth said:search baits, dont believe in the concept of them. you can call it that if you want because its the first thing you tie on or throw, but it doesnt mean its going to find you fish or work better than any other bait you couldve thrown first.
If you are fishing new water and don't know where the fish are, you need to locate them before you can catch them. The purpose of search baits is to cover a lot of water quickly. Once you locate bass, you can slow down and spend your time fishing where they are instead of spending a lot of time fishing where they aren't.
Loop_Dad reply :
On 9/24/2013 at 9:45 PM, hootiebenji said:One popular bass magazine, with every issue, has a, "throw this, don't throw this" list. Many times, I am having my best luck from a bait on the don't throw this list. Go figure.
Hootie
Where is the current don't throw list? I think you might be on to something. Maybe many people believed the magazine and stopped throwing them, therefore it worked for you (and the editor of the magazine )
SirSnookalot reply :
On 9/25/2013 at 3:01 AM, Mike L said:Improvise, Overcome, Adapt...
Rules, der ain't no stinkin rules!!
I wish there were, it would make our lives much easier. Just follow along and get in line.
For some reason I really don't think we'd like that very much. I know I wouldn't.
That's what I love about Bass fishing, it's the color, speed, action, water, weather, size, approach, angles, line size, etc etc. It doesn't end.
When I first moved to Florida all everyone I knew wanted to fish was salt water...Just throw something out there and you'll catch something.
Don't know what, but you'll catch something...If you didn't care and were'nt targeting anything specific, you did.
Mike
Couldn't be further from reality. A lot of variables determine what one is targeting at a given moment and what kind of a lure may produce the best results. Just to name a few, time of year and time of day, type of baitfish in the area, income or outgoing tide, tide change relative to sunrise and sunset, water clarity, surf height, brackish vs inshore vs offshore. It's true one can throw a spoon for example and it's pot luck on what might hit it, but how often does one cast in freshwater for bass and pull in another species like a pike, in Florida it could be a snakehead, peacock, tarpon or snook.
WRB reply :
There is good science regarding bass biology that can help you solve the problem of catching them.
Bass are cold blooded animals, live iin fresh water, breath dissolved oxygen and they are carnivors.
We can debate the water temperature range, the pH and DO levels however lots of good papers on those topics. How bass use their senses of sight, smell, hearing are also well known, however the science tends to change with added knowledge.
You can ignor seasonal period preferences and not take advantage of the basses biological characteristics and still catch bass. There are some good basics to be aware of, however you can fish with a cane pole and bobber with a minnow and do well, it comes down to personal choices and beliefs.
Tom
KyakR reply :
On 9/24/2013 at 1:17 PM, TBendBassin said:There are absolutely no rules in bass fishing, just guidelines. Don't ever forget that!! When you limit yourself to those so called "rules" you will never progress into a better angler. There is one rule though that is absolutely 100% true... And that is time on the water is the only way to become a better angler.. I know I sound like a broken record when saying that but it's the truth. forums like this one are absolutely great for people to get ideas and get started on learning different techniques and such but there is a HUGE difference in reading about it and actually doing it and figuring out all the details involved. One of the biggest mistakes I see alot of novice anglers make is reading all they can about techniques and seasonal patterns and then try and force that information when they are on the water. That's just not how it works! The more time you spend on the water the more you will start to understand bass behavior and the little signs and details that will get you dialed in on the fish. Ok I guess I got a little of topic there lol but
I so agree with this! And, as a voracious reader about fish (bass in particular) I can attest to the fact that it's hands-on that counts. I want to add that being around other anglers speeds understanding and skill enormously! I've spent a lot of time on the water but very little around other anglers, and I think of myself as almost a novice.
My particular bone to pick as far as hype is concerned is the idea that bass "fatten" for the winter. Here's an amazing article I found: http://www.fishingclub.com/magazine/articles/articletype/articleview/articleid/3548/fall-bass-blitz
Snakehead Whisperer reply :
On 9/25/2013 at 10:17 AM, Loop_Dad said:Where is the current don't throw list? I think you might be on to something. Maybe many people believed the magazine and stopped throwing them, therefore it worked for you (and the editor of the magazine
)
I never give this section of Bassmaster magazine much thought, but after reading these posts I got curious. Grabbed my copy to see what was on the list. Sep-Oct. issue says don't throw the following...
-Jerkbait
-Shaky Head
-Football Jig
-Dropshot
BassWhole! reply :
On 9/24/2013 at 8:00 PM, Fishing Rhino said:I disagree with your only rule. You can become a better angler by learning from the experiences of others, be it through any form of communication, printed, spoken, or video.
If all one did was to fish, everything they learned would be through trial and error. Why not learn from the experience of those who share their knowledge, and eliminate a lot of trial and error?
I disagree with your disagree, communication will enhance your knowledge of something (book smart) but won't improve your ability or skill, or contribute to experience. Otherwise I'd just read up on brain surgery, and start cutting..
bigbill reply :
My ritual of baits goes like this,
Topwater.............bps topnocker
Deep crank...........rebel big claw crawfish crankbait
Shallow crank........bomber fat A redapple craw
Inline spinner.......mepps Anglia silver blade,Brown tail
Topwater.............mister twister top prop fireperch
spinner bait.........Mann's or Colorado blade/white
Minnowbait...........rapala original floater blue F7
Shallow crank........bomber fat A brokerage
Inline spinner.......joesfly 1/4oz firetiger apache
Topwater.............spook any color, a big one.
Shallow crank........bomber fat A greencraw
Carolina rig.........senko Amber red flake
Topwater.............spook Jr w/prop.
Crankbait............Norman thin N chartreuse killer
Inline spinner.......strike king silver/black
Spin fly.............panthermartin silver/yellow
Carolina rig.........brushog dark red flake
Kitchen sink.........white preferred
Tackle box...........full of $$$$$$ can't buy a bite
Going back to live bait not an option that's like putting a worm on a fly rod. We do have some ethics not rules ethics. When failures happen switch back to basics. I do move away from my ritual of baits sometimes just to throw something different or new.
Kidding but usually the fish will strike one of them. My shore fishing ritual does work all the time well let's say most of the time even if I catch dinks or pickerel.
Why do so many fisherman stay with one lure when they catch nothing, I see this all the time. There doomed for failure from the start.
I throw all different color lures and different styles of lures till I get action and figure out what they want. Why do they sell all these different lures and colors?
FIRST look at the water conditions then use the correct sizes and colors.
Don't forget the scents.
Do you have a system or ritual of lures you go by?
J Francho reply :
Quote
Kitchen sink.........white preferred
LOL, you need stainless for clear water.
Catt reply :
When asked how he learned to bass fish KVD's answer was "reading Bassmaster magazine"!
Don`t believe the hype!
Bass can see your line & will spook.
If a bass sees your line what does he think it is?
Don't believe the hype!
When asked why he made lures in so many different colors Tom Mann answered "To catch the fisherman, a bass has never put a penny in my pocket."
Don't believe the hype!
Spring time lures
Summer time lure
Fall time lures
Winter time lures
Nope the lures are the same the locations change!
J Francho reply :
Quote
Nope the lures are the same the locations change!
I do agree with this, but location can have a TON of influence on what baits work, especially up here, where a bass may be in 6" of water in one season, and 60' in another. But yeah, a trap in weeds prespawn works as well as a trap in riprap in the summer.
Ratherbfishing reply :
I think a distinction needs to be made between what is "hype" and what is generally "good practice." Sure, you can fish fast* in the winter and sometimes get onto some fish. You can also fish topwater in open water on a scalding bright day in July and sometimes catch fish. But what is the most likely scenerio? I always (or nearly always) go with what I believe will work (and has worked) first and then, if that fails me, move outside the box. Except, perhaps, in extremely pressured waters, it makes little sense to start at the top (small end) of the pyramid and move down.
*There are always exceptions and perhaps the most notable one I can think of is lipless crankbaits in cold water. When I first began fishing, I was at a small pond in the early spring. NOTHING seemed to work. Well, almost nothing. I'd always heard to fish slow in cold water but since that didn't work and since i had a rat-l-trap in my box which I mostly used for white bass, I'd try that. My reasoning was if nothing slow would work, try the exact opposite. I hadn't read anything about this phenomenon before but as many other people have learned, that was the ticket.
One way you can discern "hype" is if someone is trying to make money off something. If some "pro" on your television set (who could easily be confused with a NASCAR driver) lifts a lure up to the camera lens, and tells you that you absolutely HAVE to have this lure to catch fish (or big fish), it is hype. Or if some newbie tells you someting will work because he (or she) saw it on tv or read it in a magazine, it is hype. Fisherman are always looking for that magic bullet.
Snakehead Whisperer reply :
On 9/25/2013 at 10:25 PM, Catt said:When asked how he learned to bass fish KVD's answer was "reading Bassmaster magazine"!
Don`t believe the hype!
Bass can see your line & will spook.
If a bass sees your line what does he think it is?
Don't believe the hype!
When asked why he made lures in so many different colors Tom Mann answered "To catch the fisherman, a bass has never put a penny in my pocket."
Don't believe the hype!
Spring time lures
Summer time lure
Fall time lures
Winter time lures
Nope the lures are the same the locations change!
I agree with almost everything you've said here, but there are some exceptions.
It's been proven that bass can see fishing line (article.pdf.) Whether they are line shy, who knows but them? I know for certain that bass feed in areas where people have broken off and there is a lure wedged in the rock they're hiding behind with 6' of line dangling around in the water right next to them, so maybe they disregard it for the most part. I use light weight fluoro for the most part, but mainly because I prefer light tackle fishing.
I agree that you can probably catch fish effectively with 4 colors of lures. White, black, chartreuse and natural probably cover almost any situation.
I also agree that there's no such thing as seasonal baits, but I'm not usually burning a buzzbait in Jan-Feb. when water temps are below 40. Yes, I have done this before; and yes, it has worked at times... but generally it hasn't proven too productive.
Raul reply :
There are days when you fish with rope thick line and bass don´t care, there are days when you have to fish with hair thin line and even that is too thick, there are days that the commotion caused by a grain of polen falling on the water surface send them basses running away miles away at warp speed and there are days that the commotion created by a cow landing on the water after falling from a plane 10,000 ft above won´t even bother them and actually you can see ( in clear water ) the fish approaching to see what was the fuzz. Locations and conditions can change but it´s your powers of observation and your "feel" what tells you should do this or that.
I remember many moons ago, when someone asked how to fish cold water I mentioned: burn the water ( reel as fast as you can ) with reaction baits ( lipless cranks and spinnerbaits ) all who replied said I was crazy wrong, well maybe I´m not the most adequate person to say so taking in consideration that 99% of the time the water in my neck of the woods is above freezing point but it has worked for me in lakes and ponds high in the sierra where temps do get very low and it even snows.
bigbill reply :
Fishing if it was easy it wouldn't be called fishing. Just fish it and fish it harder...........
I never try to figure out my misses I just go with the flow day to day and the bass are no different. Kidding but think about it. My youngest son asked me questions about his girlfriend I told him if you figure them out let me know. Godbless there little hearts. My point is trying to figure out what the bass wants keeps us interested and returning to fish. More time on water...
Here comes the frying pan after this post for sure.......incoming..........ouch....
TBendBassin reply :
On 9/24/2013 at 8:00 PM, Fishing Rhino said:I disagree with your only rule. You can become a better angler by learning from the experiences of others, be it through any form of communication, printed, spoken, or video.
If all one did was to fish, everything they learned would be through trial and error. Why not learn from the experience of those who share their knowledge, and eliminate a lot of trial and error?
Sorry I cannot agree with that... Let me apologize if my last post came off as "forums don't help people" because that is not what I meant. Forums like this one help people out so much it's unreal!!! What I simply meant was they cannot teach the intricate details in bass behavior. The ONLY way that is learned is time on the water. I really push this because I know first hand how important it is. Since I was a kid I've wanted one thing and that was to make a living in the fishing industry. Now before you start thinking "here we go, another kid who thinks he is the next KVD" I am not a kid and I take this very seriously. I have made so many sacrifices in my life to stay focused on my goals that most people question my sanity. With that being said I fished every weekend in high school and when I went to college I had a Monday thru Thursday job so I could still fish every weekend. That is a lot of fishing growing up! But it wasn't until after college and moving to the lake to start guiding that I realized how big of a difference time on the water makes. Up until then I had pretty much fished every weekend and had pretty good knowledge. But when I started doing it 6-7 days a week... Wow!!! Time on the water gives you a sharper instinct and very keen decisions making skills. With that you will be able to adapt quicker, find the most productive patterns, and make better decisions. Those are just some of the things time on the water will teach you that reading books cannot.
SirSnookalot reply :
I'm in the "time on water" camp. Reading articles is ok but I believe they are more generic in nature than the waters I'm actually fishing on. Forums are fine to get info the "hot" areas to fish, but IMO past experience tells me what kind of lures and techniques I need to employ to be successful.
Hooligan reply :
Anyone that says there are no rules in bass fishing is 100% wrong. There are a handful of rules, the first of which is that fish are dumb. Don't overthink the situation. The second rule is that they have to eat, if you put the right bait in front of them the right way, they're going to eat it. They are wired to do so, they cannot deny their instinct to feed.
Lastly, and possibly the most important rule is that you'll never catch a fish if your bait isn't in the water.
aceman387 reply :
This is really a great topic. It should be required reading for all the young people who are just getting into this sport. I wish i had read this a few years ago when i got back into bass fishing,i would have a lot more money put away and i would be able to fit my truck in my garage...lol. (lets face it buying tackle is fun) I remember reading a quote from Catt years ago that stuck with me,it was something like catching bass has more to do with what's between your ears and less with what's between the folds of your wallet.
KyakR reply :
I learned more in one day with a guide than I did in a year by myself
Hyrule Bass reply :
On 9/25/2013 at 8:56 AM, Scott F said:If you are fishing new water and don't know where the fish are, you need to locate them before you can catch them. The purpose of search baits is to cover a lot of water quickly. Once you locate bass, you can slow down and spend your time fishing where they are instead of spending a lot of time fishing where they aren't.
ummmm no. it doesnt even matter which body of water you are on, thats irrelevant. there isnt a bait i know of that works to catch a fish every outing, every day, every time, in every condition possible, therefore, the concept of a search bait is something i dont believe in. you can run around trying to cover water quickly if you want with what you call a "search bait", but if the fish are more interested in biting a slow moving bait then you would never know if they were there or not because youre not offering up what they want at that time. so you could be fishing where the fish are with your "search bait", its just that they dont want it. if the fish are there but keying on craws and youre throwing a spinnerbait, you might not get bit. and vice versa.
if there was a true search bait, that never failed to locate fish, then no one would ever get skunked...
Snakehead Whisperer reply :
I agree with both SirSnookalot and KyakR... time on the water and a good mentor will help more than any amount of tackle or reading.
But reading does help; the problem is that there are so many misleading articles about the subject of fishing, and so few that actually talk about relevant topics. I pretty much stop reading an article as soon as I see "throw the ___ on a __ foot __ weight ____rod with ____ reel." There are some exceptions to this, of course.
Nice_Bass reply :
On 9/27/2013 at 8:58 PM, Red Earth said:ummmm no. it doesnt even matter which body of water you are on, thats irrelevant. there isnt a bait i know of that works to catch a fish every outing, every day, every time, in every condition possible, therefore, the concept of a search bait is something i dont believe in. you can run around trying to cover water quickly if you want with what you call a "search bait", but if the fish are more interested in biting a slow moving bait then you would never know if they were there or not because youre not offering up what they want at that time. so you could be fishing where the fish are with your "search bait", its just that they dont want it. if the fish are there but keying on craws and youre throwing a spinnerbait, you might not get bit. and vice versa.
if there was a true search bait, that never failed to locate fish, then no one would ever get skunked...
I don't know- I think a plastic worm and jig do catch fish every outing in every condition...albeit, others may work better, or more efficiently at times.
bigbill reply :
Trust me if you start fishing every single day back to back for over three months from every spring till you get burned out like I did for many years you will learn something. Plus I read everything here, watched every bass fishing video from every new and old pro every off season just to stay sharp. During the spring I live bass fishing, I eat bass fishing and sleep bass fishing. Ok I eat while watching bass fishing videos or shows on tv. Now go out and try everything we learned on the water plus be ready for in education on the water. Nothing beats the time on the water fishing.
The biggest thing I do when I'm bass fishing is I block out all my personal problems, my bills, my honey do list. It's me and the fish when I'm fully in the zone. Like don't even talk to me. This is why I fish alone. If your going fishing to talk stay home. If you need to solve a problem fishing isn't going to do it.
Now get in the zone, block everything out, watch and pay attention to what the fish are doing, how they react to your lures. Look behind your lures for short strikes all the time on every cast. Scan the water in your area with your polarized glasses. These bigger gals will appear like ghosts very quietly and leave. I believe they come by to see what the smaller bass are biting on as we're catching them. Don't harass them but remember the area they appeared at for the future trip in the dark. It's like putting an "X" on that spot. If I do cast at that spot, I throw a plastic bait far behind it and bring it in slowly near it not on top or at it. Do it quietly. But I'd rather not spook her.
Short Strikes,
I learned about this from watching a Bill Dance tv show about fly fishing for bass. The cameraman was away from Bill but closer to but parallel to his casts. We could see the fly from the full cast to the boat. They never mentioned the short strikes on the program but ever cast had flashes behind his fly from short strikes. This taught me to stay focused on watching behind the lure if we can see it on every cast. Using topwater and shallow running lures. If the water is gin clear we can get quite a show. Do not over react, stay calm and fish. Don't do any quick movements with the rod go slow not to spook them, make side casts.
I'm no pro nor claim to be I'm just a fisherman like you. I just watch what's going on more. I'm in no rush to fish I just go slow. Get in the zone and don't panic during the action.
I enjoy catching any size bass if a larger one strikes so be it. I learn on every trip. Just enjoy every fishing trip and take notes, where your fishing, at what date and time, how many bass were caught and what size. Also include the moon phases too you may see a month to month pattern with the full Moon phases I won't tell you so you can decide.
With fishing tv and videos listen to what they say but watch closely how they do it. You have all the free videos here to watch too these guys are the best.
It's skill in bass fishing not luck, God bless bigbill
Hyrule Bass reply :
On 9/27/2013 at 11:52 PM, Nice_Bass said:I don't know- I think a plastic worm and jig do catch fish every outing in every condition...albeit, others may work better, or more efficiently at times.
then explain skunks. i used to only fish with plastic worms btw, and ive been skunked on them more than once...ever read the threads here of people asking for help or "what theyre doing wrong"? usually involves them saying they threw everything in their tackle box and still didnt even get a bite, much less catch a fish. there is no such thing as a search bait...
like i said earlier, if you want to call the first bait you tie on or throw on a given day a search bait thats fine. but dont act like theres a certain few magic baits that are going to help you find fish.
K_Mac reply :
There are many pros who have made a good living using "search baits" to find areas that are holding fish, and then picking those areas apart to get the maximum out of them. We can argue all day about semantics, but search baits are by definition baits that enable you to cover (or search) a large amount of water. Now how you define "a large amount of water" is open to debate, but a plastic worm fished in the traditional way would not qualify. Search baits are targeting more aggressive, feeding fish. Of course they don't always work, but many times they serve a valuable place in bass fishing IMO.
When your search baits don't work is where skill, experience, and knowledge enter the game. Knowing the "rules" of seasonal patterns, feeding patterns and choices, water temperatures, depth and clarity, structure and cover, and a dozen other variables now come into play. I can, and have, spent hours unproductively doing what worked last time, or that time 3 years ago when "we caught a boat load on this spot"; or, I can make an informed decision based on the "rules" and go try something else. I am a big fan of creativity, but ignoring or dismissing time honored and proven "rules" is best done by those who know them well in my opinion.
NathanW reply :
On 9/28/2013 at 6:32 AM, K_Mac said:There are many pros who have made a good living using "search baits" to find areas that are holding fish, and then picking those areas apart to get the maximum out of them. We can argue all day about semantics, but search baits are by definition baits that enable you to cover (or search) a large amount of water. Now how you define "a large amount of water" is open to debate, but a plastic worm fished in the traditional way would not qualify. Search baits are targeting more aggressive, feeding fish. Of course they don't always work, but many times they serve a valuable place in bass fishing IMO.
When your search baits don't work is where skill, experience, and knowledge enter the game. Knowing the "rules" of seasonal patterns, feeding patterns and choices, water temperatures, depth and clarity, structure and cover, and a dozen other variables now come into play. I can, and have, spent hours unproductively doing what worked last time, or that time 3 years ago when "we caught a boat load on this spot"; or, I can make an informed decision based on the "rules" and go try something else. I am a big fan of creativity, but ignoring or dismissing time honored and proven "rules" is best done by those who know them well in my opinion.
To add to this, most of these pros who talk about starting with search baits are looking at it from a perspective that they are fishing a 4 to 7 day tournament. 2/3 days of practice followed by 2/4 days of competition. On a giant body of water they have not been allowed to touch for a certain number of days prior to official practice. So yes, the concept of starting practice with a search bait is very real and very necessary.
Scott F reply :
On 9/27/2013 at 8:58 PM, Red Earth said:ummmm no. it doesnt even matter which body of water you are on, thats irrelevant. there isnt a bait i know of that works to catch a fish every outing, every day, every time, in every condition possible, therefore, the concept of a search bait is something i dont believe in. you can run around trying to cover water quickly if you want with what you call a "search bait", but if the fish are more interested in biting a slow moving bait then you would never know if they were there or not because youre not offering up what they want at that time. so you could be fishing where the fish are with your "search bait", its just that they dont want it. if the fish are there but keying on craws and youre throwing a spinnerbait, you might not get bit. and vice versa.
if there was a true search bait, that never failed to locate fish, then no one would ever get skunked...
Just because you don't believe it doesn't mean it doesn't work. No one ever claimed it works 100% of the time. Nothing ever does. It's worked for me more often than not for 30 years and I'll continue to search with search baits.
SirSnookalot reply :
Nothing works 100% of the time and everything works some of the time.
I fish for fun and use only the types of lures that give me the most pleasure, I don't get into worms and jigs too much.
bigbill reply :
To me it's the challenge of figuring out which lure size, lure shape and lure color will work at that moment. This is why I throw a variety of different lures, sizes and colors. Plus its fun.
Nice_Bass reply :
On 9/28/2013 at 2:27 AM, Red Earth said:then explain skunks. i used to only fish with plastic worms btw, and ive been skunked on them more than once...ever read the threads here of people asking for help or "what theyre doing wrong"? usually involves them saying they threw everything in their tackle box and still didnt even get a bite, much less catch a fish. there is no such thing as a search bait...
like i said earlier, if you want to call the first bait you tie on or throw on a given day a search bait thats fine. but dont act like theres a certain few magic baits that are going to help you find fish.
I think you are confusing the idea of a "magic bait" and eliminating non high percentage water with active feeding fish...a big difference...
Skunks happen because you fished the wrong place at the wrong time- much less to do with tackle choice than you give credit to.
Lil'Gunner reply :
I was born up north, and now live in the south. Summer was always the best season up there; that and pre-spawn. Down here, summer is tough-tough-tough, though I caught my PB this year in the dead of summer. Fished 4 hours - one hit, one fish, 12 lbs. Fall down here is great, although it seems you have to file thru several patterns to find what works, and be ready to change out of it quickly and often. The difference is that our summers are so hot, day and night, that the dissolved oxygen drops and makes them sluggish; doesn't happen up nort'.
I follow generalities, but have no rules and use my impatience to advantage. I believe if I'm doing the right things, I'll get a hit right away. So, I might start with a topwater at daybreak, but think nothing of hitting an offshore hump 20 minutes later if I haven't caught anything. Today, I got 5 for 10lbs on a windy crisp cold front day, and missed several others. I got sick of trying to position in a blasting cold wind that I underdressed for, and pulled into a lee. I threw a senko right against the bank there and caught a 2-lb, and that put me on the pattern of the day.
Catt reply :
When I first started bass fishing seriously during the 60s I believed I was really good, I seldom got skunked. But in the early 70s I attended a 5 day seminar at a little community college in Houston and the guest speaker was Elwood (Buck) Perry. What I learned in those 5 days totally changed my entire thought process. I now understood what years on the water never taught me!
Reading alone will only teach one so much but time on the water will only do so much. It takes a combination of both. Reading alone provides you with no experence, time on the water in all the wrong lures, locations, and timing gives you unusable experence.
A "search" bait is what you want it to be, no were is it written this lure is a search bait. I search structure with s Texas Rig or a Jig because there is no written law stating either must be fished slow!
Outside of the enviromental and biological needs of a bass there are no "rules".
inrll reply :
Two things.
First if you don't start with some basic plan in anything your doing then your not doing it the best you can. These "rules" are just a basic starting point for a plan of action. Ever here the saying "If you fail to plan you plan to fail"? The same holds true for a day of fishing. That plan doesn't always work but at least its a start.
Second, if you want to identify the real "hype" then look no farther than all the lures out there right now. All this talk of what baits to throw and which ones work at which times... None of that matters if your fishing in the wrong places. Fishing the right area is 90% of it. After you figure that out you could throw any number of lures to catch bass. Yes there are some lures that are better to reach certain depths and cover but focusing soooo much on lure choice is totally missing the real challenge in bass fishing.
Find your niche in bass fishing whether thats finesse or power fishing or whatever and use THAT confidence presentation, when possible, wherever the bass are that given day.
Paul Roberts reply :
On 9/24/2013 at 7:52 AM, DelcoSol said:Hey guys, I have a question to pose for everyone: Are there any "rules" I guess you would call them of bass fishing that you just do not believe in? Wether it is a pattern, lure type etc. For example you hear many things about different colors or sounds, also it may be something like the weather is X so the fish are supposed to do Y.
This year for example, the summer is supposed to be some of the toughest time to fish, while spring and fall and the best. I have had much better luck during the summer than spring and so far fall. I am not saying its not true, but as anglers hearing all of these "experts" spout off all of these different things that kind of stick into everyone's head, may cause us to do things that we are "supposed" to do. I know I myself am addicted to fishing and come here to try to learn everything I can, but the thing I wonder is that am I overcomplicating things? I think now to Mike Iaconelli's book where he talks about fishing in the moment. I really don't do this enough. I spend too much worrying about what the fish are supposed to be doing rather than fishing to what they are doing. Anyway, I just wanted to hear your thoughts on this. I am sorry if this rambling is too hard to follow.
“Are there any "rules"?”
Yes. But they are not as clear cut as “plug in A and get B”, or, maybe better, not that simple.
I knew a guy who fished one of the ponds I fished, appearing evenings after work. He fished one lure –a small black buzzbait parallel to the shorelines. He’d make a loop around the pond, then head off for home. His theory was simple: “Sometimes they bite, and sometimes they don’t”. He didn’t show up until mid spring, saying it was “too cold to catch ‘em” earlier. He fished through the spring and then disappeared until the following spring, missing maybe the best buzzbait period of the year in that area –fall. In summer, the shoreline bite tends to die out, as many of those bass move away from shorelines. And, by midsummer, most years the water gets too hot for midday action, but there is a first-light bite our guy apparently never saw. There are reasons for things that a small buzzbait fished along a shoreline in the evening just can’t get at. It’s too limited a sampling tool and methodology. And realize this was practiced on one pond. Imagine zooming out in satellite images from that pond, to surrounding ponds, to that watershed, to surrounding watersheds, out to the entire range largemouth bass occupy. Fathom that!
“Spring” and “fall” aren't supposed to be anything, don’t mean all that much, viewed across that range. But narrow things down in location, and timing comes more into focus. Ever heard, usually from experienced anglers, that “timing is everything”? Getting that nuanced is backed by a lot of knowledge and experience, and then, on any given day or hour on the water, a lot of “flying by the seat of your pants”. Scary? Get used to it.
Quote“…try to learn everything I can, but the thing I wonder is that am I overcomplicating things?”
No you are not overcomplicating things. Not recognizing what’s most important in any given moment, maybe. But you are far from alone there. Nature is enormously complicated. If you want to understand it, you’ve got a lot of work ahead of you. Hopefully it’s fun work. If you really want to catch bass consistently, esp over a large geographic area, you not only have to understand largemouth bass (to choose one), and the other critters they interact with, but the nature of waters and the atmosphere. Overcomplicating things? Hardly.
We all want to simplify. In fact, we must simplify; it’s all too friggin’ big. And our brains are devised to do just that –to make/find sense in the immense complexity nature dishes out– to our detriment sometimes as much as to our benefit. But considering the enormity of it all, we do pretty darn well.
Quote“I spend too much worrying about what the fish are supposed to be doing rather than fishing to what they are doing.”
Well, you gotta start somewhere. Every morning each one of us has “supposed’s” in our heads –best attempts at “prediction”. These tend to pan out better for more experienced and well edified anglers than for newbs. But no one can cover it all, and everyone gets thrown curves –has to adjust. This you can expect. How well you can adjust has everything to do with the knowledge, experience, decision making, and effort you can bring to bear on the problem.
“Fishing in the moment" is great. But that’s quite a leap. One has to have real stuff to draw on, and those are: knowledge and experience. Imagine someone who’s never bass fished before “fishing in the moment”.
J Francho reply :
Good stuff, Paul!
Paul Roberts reply :
Thanks, John.
Hey, that's a great avatar shot there. Barefoot? Even better.
SirSnookalot reply :
For the passionate bass fishermen there is a lot of valuable information in this thread. Like Paul's friend I've been more of the opportunist bass fisherman over the last 10 years. Even still some local knowledge is required for me, times of year when I bass fish and times I don't. Techniques and lures that give me the most enjoyment and success given the type of places I fish, I learned what I need to do by fishing over the years.
J Francho reply :
On 10/4/2013 at 8:42 AM, Paul Roberts said:Thanks, John.
Hey, that's a great avatar shot there. Barefoot? Even better.
I had my flippy-floppies on....
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