Swimbaits set-up 2025
Can't Catch Bass reply :
Hello,
I've been thinking about adding a swimbait rod/reel to my arsenal. I'm thinking of going with a Cardiff 301 and a mojo bass 7'10HF.
I've been researching this a bit and I'm pretty set at the moment with these choices, but I'm still open to advice/suggestions.
The Cardiff, I feel, is a layup for me. I'm a Shimano guy. From what I've read the guts are the same as the Calcutta and after holding a 400 vs a 300 in my hand I can tell I'll feel much more comfortable with the 300 size.
As for the rod I first researched which baits I wanted to throw. I'm not planning on throwing any baits over 6", so all of them ranged between 1.5-2.5oz, which I think would be perfect for a rod rated 1-4oz. The second piece of criteria it had to meet is it has to have split grips. I need this because I fish from a kayak and I like to leash my rod around the blank so the butt of the rod prevents the leash from slipping off.
One thing I'm not 100% sure of is line. Being that I'll be throwing lighter (1.5-2.5oz) baits would you all think I could get away with using 65# braid with a 20# mono leader without much a risk of snapping in the event of a backlash?
I'll be throwing soft bodied baits exclusively at the start (namely weedless hudd 68's and hudd gills). Later I may expand this to swavers, 6" gantarel and 6" bbz.
Please let me know what you think. Thanks.
Caliyak reply :
Sounds good to me. I fish from a kayak and I will be throwing the same baits. I am using a Curado and a heavy Shock rod. So I went with the cheaper (price) rod and I can use it also for heavy cover flipping/pitching. I am going with 50# braid and no leader. I have my baitcaster really tight to avoid a backlash.
Can't Catch Bass reply :
On 10/27/2017 at 4:36 AM, Caliyak said:Sounds good to me. I fish from a kayak and I will be throwing the same baits. I am using a Curado and a heavy Shock rod. So I went with the cheaper (price) rod and I can use it also for heavy cover flipping/pitching. I am going with 50# braid and no leader. I have my baitcaster really tight to avoid a backlash.
I have a curado 201i that I'm not using.
Would that be worthwhile replacement instead of the Cardiff?
Stephen B reply :
I would recommend the *** Muse 7'9" Heavy Swimbait rod. The Mojo Bass lacks in the sensitivity department.
Looking for the big one reply :
I would not recommend St. Croix, I bought a Bass X I’m that same model and don’t love it. Very large, double footed guides, not very sensitive, and an uncomfortable reel seat. Would go with an Irod Genesis, I’ve heard good things about them.
Can't Catch Bass reply :
On 10/27/2017 at 6:21 AM, Looking for the big one said:I would not recommend St. Croix, I bought a Bass X I’m that same model and don’t love it. Very large, double footed guides, not very sensitive, and an uncomfortable reel seat. Would go with an Irod Genesis, I’ve heard good things about them.
I was looking at the Genesis II 7'8 jr swimbait, but the reviews on TW didn't seem too good. A few were complaining of durability issues, so that's why I was straying away from this one.
Stephen B reply :
The best swimbait rod around $200 is the Muse. Unless you want to pay more for a Dobyns rod.
Looking for the big one reply :
That's a bold statement... There are a lot of great options around the $200 price point, it really comes down to preference on certain details. If I had to narrow it down for myself it would be between the Phenix M1, Daiwa DX Swimbait, or Okuma Guide Select. Again, so many good options out there, the Muse may be a good rod but I don't personally recommend it because of the trouble that brand has apparently caused on the forums.
Can't Catch Bass reply :
On 10/27/2017 at 9:19 AM, Looking for the big one said:That's a bold statement... There are a lot of great options around the $200 price point, it really comes down to preference on certain details. If I had to narrow it down for myself it would be between the Phenix M1, Daiwa DX Swimbait, or Okuma Guide Select. Again, so many good options out there, the Muse may be a good rod but I don't personally recommend it because of the trouble that brand has apparently caused on the forums.
Not to sound confrontational, but do you think your experience with the bass x 7'10 might not relate to the mojo being that they use a different blank and guides? I know you were also critical of the reel seat and grip. I own a couple Mojo's, those are comfortable in my hand, so that's not an issue for me.
Right now, at this point, I'm trying to decide between the Genesis II and the Mojo.
CroakHunter reply :
On 10/27/2017 at 9:36 AM, Can't Catch Bass said:Not to sound confrontational, but do you think your experience with the bass x 7'10 might not relate to the mojo being that they use a different blank and guides? I know you were also critical of the reel seat and grip. I own a couple Mojo's, those are comfortable in my hand.
Right now, at this point, I'm trying to decide between the Genesis II and the Mojo.
Daiwa makes a solid swimbait rod for around $110
fishwizzard reply :
I have a Irod "Freds Magic Stick" that I bought for frogs but have used like 90% of the time for small swimbaits. I love it but for one thing, the butt is way too long for my tastes. Otherwise I have really liked it for hard and soft swimbaits in the 1-2.5oz range. I will say that the rod is pretty true to it's rating and say a 3oz wakebait was too much for it and was really touch-n-go when it came to making accurate casts. I am hooked on the Spro rat so I am going to move to a heavier rod with a shorter butt, but within it's limits I liked the Fred's and would look at the swimbait rod from that line but for the long butt.
Can't Catch Bass reply :
On 10/27/2017 at 9:43 AM, fishwizzard said:I have a Irod "Freds Magic Stick" that I bought for frogs but have used like 90% of the time for small swimbaits. I love it but for one thing, the butt is way too long for my tastes. Otherwise I have really liked it for hard and soft swimbaits in the 1-2.5oz range. I will say that the rod is pretty true to it's rating and say a 3oz wakebait was too much for it and was really touch-n-go when it came to making accurate casts. I am hooked on the Spro rat so I am going to move to a heavier rod with a shorter butt, but within it's limits I liked the Fred's and would look at the swimbait rod from that line but for the long butt.
That's one thing I wasn't accounting for... That handle might play havoc with my seat in my kayak. TW has the mojo at 19.5" which would probably make it stick out a little beyond my elbow.
Thanks Wiz
fishwizzard reply :
For sure take a dowel or something and mock up the rod handle and see how it feels to "cast" it sitting. I fish out if a kayak as well and I haven't even bothered to bring the Irod onboard. But I do have a preference for shorter than norm butts in general.
Stephen B reply :
With restrictions regarding the handle as mentioned previously you will struggle to find a swimbait rod with a short enough handle. They all have long handles to allow for two-handed casting as well to balance the rod.
Caliyak reply :
On 10/27/2017 at 4:52 AM, Can't Catch Bass said:I have a curado 201i that I'm not using.
Would that be worthwhile replacement instead of the Cardiff?
Yes, use the Curado I, I have the same reel. We don't have the boat space for multiple rod set ups, so use the one combo for several techniques. Also, after reading the posts, get the rod that is within your price range and you feel comfortable with.
WRB reply :
Dobyns Fury FR 795 SB (S/H*) is ideal for your application.
TW shows you how each rod handle is measured. Swimbait rods usually have a fore grip that allows you to balance the rod with round reels like the Cardiff comfortably. The handle length includes the fore grip about 4" longer than rods without fore grips, the distance from the reel seat is equal subtracting the 4" fore grip.
Tom
* call Gary and ask if he has the split hangle(SH) or reconditioned high end model for $200 if interested.
d-camarena reply :
Get a dobyn fury, okuma guide select, diawa sb or lews extra heavy custom speed stick. I have all of these i use for swimbaits and they are solid.
MassYak85 reply :
The only two rods I can comment on are a rod that I cannot name because of forum rules, but it is a fast action rod, that's about all you need to know for this, and the Okuma Guide Select (I have the 7'1" 1-6 oz). They are very different rods. That is one thing you need to do good research on when dealing with swimbait rods. Some have extremely parabolic bends to them that are going to suit you better when fishing treble hook lures like the BBZ and the Gantarel. Then you will have some that are true fast actions designed more for jig hook style baits like the Hudds. Now as far as the specifics of the two I own...
Fast Action Rod
A true fast action rod. I would not recommend throwing any treble hook lures on this type of rod. It just doesn't load up enough to absorb head shakes when fish jump. It does a good job at getting jig hooks to stick.
Okuma Guide Select
This rod is more parabolic, it says it's rated Mod-fast but I feel it's more of a moderate. It is rated 1-6 oz but I would not go above 4 oz on it. I use it for my treble hook lures and I feel it hits it's sweet spot in that 2-3oz range. I like it for my 9" Slammer and S-Waver 200. The grip is a split grip and normal length for a swimbait rod. I find it slightly too long when fishing out of my kayak, especially if I am trying to walk or twitch a bait like a slammer.
No matter what rod you get, consider that you are fishing in a kayak. Swimbaits are designed to catch big fish. If you set the hook on a 5, 8, 10 lber there's a chance you are going to be going to the fish more so than the fish going to you. You become part of the "give" in your line + rod system. This could potentially cause issues with hook sets if you don't accommodate. If you have a line with a lot of stretch, a parabolic rod, and a light kayak and you fish jig hook baits...I can almost gaurantee you you will run into problems. You say you want to use braid. This might help counter the give from the kayak and give you good hooksets. If you go with braid I'd look for a rod that's more moderate. The rod will be able to stay loaded with treble hook baits, and the braid will still allow you to set the hook with jig hook baits. If you are worried about casting off baits you can try a longer mono leader.
I have the cardiff 300. It is a nice size reel and has been a solid performed. Th only thing I am not thrilled with is the drag. It does not have much room for fine adjustments, which is not necessarily a problem if you plan on locking down your drag anyways.
TL;DR: If I was you I'd go with the Cardiff 300 and some type of moderate action rod if you want to go with braid.
Can't Catch Bass reply :
On 10/28/2017 at 5:20 AM, MassYak85 said:No matter what rod you get, consider that you are fishing in a kayak. Swimbaits are designed to catch big fish. If you set the hook on a 5, 8, 10 lber there's a chance you are going to be going to the fish more so than the fish going to you. You become part of the "give" in your line + rod system. This could potentially cause issues with hook sets if you don't accommodate. If you have a line with a lot of stretch, a parabolic rod, and a light kayak and you fish jig hook baits...I can almost gaurantee you you will run into problems. You say you want to use braid. This might help counter the give from the kayak and give you good hooksets. If you go with braid I'd look for a rod that's more moderate. The rod will be able to stay loaded with treble hook baits, and the braid will still allow you to set the hook with jig hook baits. If you are worried about casting off baits you can try a longer mono leader.
Honestly, I'm not sure I'll ever throw a treble hook on this setup. I hate dealing with them and the weeds. I'll definitely (and likely exclusively) be throwing hudd weedless 68's and gills though.
In that case should I be thinking fast action+braid+mono leader?
fishwizzard reply :
On 10/27/2017 at 11:54 PM, WRB said:Dobyns Fury FR 795 SB (S/H*) is ideal for your application.
TW shows you how each rod handle is measured. Swimbait rods usually have a fore grip that allows you to balance the rod with round reels like the Cardiff comfortably. The handle length includes the fore grip about 4" longer than rods without fore grips, the distance from the reel seat is equal subtracting the 4" fore grip.
Tom
* call Gary and ask if he has the split hangle(SH) or reconditioned high end model for $200 if interested.
Very interesting! I had never noticed that distinction before.
With that in mind, the Dobyns DC 795SB MT has moved up to the top of my list. It's handle is 17-1/2", compared to the More than I wanted to spend and longer then I want to deal with, but I really think the shorter handle will make it worth it. It's not really going to be too much shorter then my Irod, but I will be able to go up in power and go down in handle length a little at least.
But, if I am going to spend $250, I wonder if I could get a no-frills custom for that? Then I could get a rod with a shorter handle, shorter overall length, and and action that works wells from the bank and from a kayak.
Can't Catch Bass reply :
On 10/28/2017 at 8:07 AM, fishwizzard said:Very interesting! I had never noticed that distinction before.
With that in mind, the Dobyns DC 795SB MT has moved up to the top of my list. It's handle is 17-1/2", compared to the More than I wanted to spend and longer then I want to deal with, but I really think the shorter handle will make it worth it. It's not really going to be too much shorter then my Irod, but I will be able to go up in power and go down in handle length a little at least.
But, if I am going to spend $250, I wonder if I could get a no-frills custom for that? Then I could get a rod with a shorter handle, shorter overall length, and and action that works wells from the bank and from a kayak.
Have you looked at the Fenwick elite tech 7'9 extra heavy? That one has a shorter handle than the dobyns and looks to be well reviewed. I'm kind of looking at that one myself.
fishwizzard reply :
I had not! I have a pair of Elite Tech Smallmouth MH/F rods that I use on my yak already and really like them. I do prefer a full handle to a split, but I don't think that is a deal breaker. I will have to poke around and find some reviews. I do worry about the rating, I don't want to go too light. Right now the heaviest lure I want to throw is the 2.5oz BBZ-1 Rat, but I want a little wiggle room on the the upper end.
DINK WHISPERER reply :
I would choose almost any other rod except the mojo. Fury 795/805 or champion line, irod SB, Daiwa DX, okuma guide select or okuma b series are all really good rods. I would also go with a low profile reel over a round style. A3, lexa 300, Tatula HD 200, Lew's super duty wide or curado.
Can't Catch Bass reply :
On 10/28/2017 at 9:23 AM, DINK WHISPERER said:I would choose almost any other rod except the mojo. Fury 795/805 or champion line, irod SB, Daiwa DX, okuma guide select or okuma b series are all really good rods. I would also go with a low profile reel over a round style. A3, lexa 300, Tatula HD 200, Lew's super duty wide or curado.
Just curious, why not the mojo? I have 2 other Mojo's and I love them both. My jig rod (mjc71mhf) is my hands down favorite of all my setups and my worm rod (mjs71mf) isn't far behind.
WRB reply :
Buy what you like you are the one who is using the rod.
Tom
Can't Catch Bass reply :
On 10/28/2017 at 9:43 AM, WRB said:Buy what you like you are the one who is using the rod.
Tom
I'm trying to do that.
I'm looking at your suggestion of a 795sb s/h as well Tom. Unfortunately, dobyns is closed on Fridays and I was not able to find out if they make a split handle in that sizing. I have a 734c as well as a 735c, I'm happy with both of those. I wouldn't mind adding another dobyns rod.
DINK WHISPERER reply :
@Can't Catch Bass I agree with WRB. You seem to be set on that rod so get it. I had 4 of them and broke 2 just pulling in small fish. One had guide rings come out on a cast. I also thought they were heavy and not very well balanced. This was a couple years ago though. And all SB Dobyns only come in full handle eva as far as I know.
Can't Catch Bass reply :
On 10/28/2017 at 10:25 AM, DINK WHISPERER said:@Can't Catch Bass I agree with WRB. You seem to be set on that rod so get it. I had 4 of them and broke 2 just pulling in small fish. One had guide rings come out on a cast. I also thought they were heavy and not very well balanced. This was a couple years ago though. And all SB Dobyns only come in full handle eva as far as I know.
It has nothing to do with being set on a particular rod. I've had a good experience with St Croix rods in the past. I'm sure I'm not alone on that. I asked you a question and I appreciate your response. However, I don't feel it's just that you dismiss myself because my personal experience might have contradicted your own.
If you were trashing Dobyns you'd be hearing these same questions.
DINK WHISPERER reply :
On 10/28/2017 at 10:39 AM, Can't Catch Bass said:It has nothing to do with being set on a particular rod. I've had a good experience with St Croix rods in the past. I'm sure I'm not alone on that. I asked you a question and I appreciate your response. However, I don't feel it's just that you dismiss myself because my personal experience might have contradicted your own.
Dude it's not even that deep. You said yourself you're pretty set on that setup. Nobody is dismissing you or your experience it was my opinion. You asked a question and got responses back. Get what you want and like. I've been fishing big swimbaits for a while and tried just about every sb rod except the Loomis line.
Can't Catch Bass reply :
On 10/28/2017 at 10:46 AM, DINK WHISPERER said:You said yourself you're pretty set on that setup.
Yes I did, but that was in my original post lol.
How much information has been conveyed between now and then? You don't think my ideas could change?
I still don't even have a solid answer to a question I asked around 10 posts ago regarding what freaking action rod I should be looking at lol. Shouldnt that really be addressed before trying to determine what rod I should be looking at? I'm assuming it should be fast action, but I really don't know lol...
DINK WHISPERER reply :
Most true SB rods are geared towards treble hook baits. They're labeled fast but are somewhat moderate fast action, which is a good thing. For jig hook style baits like hudds you should get a true fast action especially on long casts. I use P-line cxx and izorline XXX for treble baits like the bull shad. Braid and fluorocarbon for jig hook baits.
Can't Catch Bass reply :
On 10/28/2017 at 11:17 AM, DINK WHISPERER said:Most true SB rods are geared towards treble hook baits. They're labeled fast but are somewhat moderate fast action, which is a good thing. For jig hook style baits like hudds you should get a true fast action especially on long casts. I use P-line cxx and izorline XXX for treble baits like the bull shad. Braid and fluorocarbon for jig hook baits.
My idea was to go with 65# braid and 20#, or maybe 30# mono leader. Just because it's that much more easier to manage, the leader would help absorb shock and wouldn't tear up the bait.
Do you have a recommendation for a true fast action rod, with a split handle that can cast a 1.5-2.5oz bait well that has a handle which would not be too intrusive while sitting in a kayak seat (less than 18")?
Stephen B reply :
As an avid angler that has fished Gloomis, St Croix, Kistler, Dobyns, Abu Garcia, Megabass; I highly recommend not bothering with the Dobyns. Basically you have a few options, but depend on your price range:
Diawa Zillion Swimbait Rod, TFO Swimbait Rod, or a custom Kistler. If it was my choices, I would contact Trey Kistler as he will do a custom built KLX. By doing this you will be able to design your rod with your handle length of choice. Also, the KLX rods are build on the NFC blanks which are incredible.
Can't Catch Bass reply :
On 10/28/2017 at 11:46 AM, Stephen B said:As an avid angler that has fished Gloomis, St Croix, Kistler, Dobyns, Abu Garcia, Megabass; I highly recommend not bothering with the Dobyns. Basically you have a few options, but depend on your price range:
Diawa Zillion Swimbait Rod, TFO Swimbait Rod, or a custom Kistler. If it was my choices, I would contact Trey Kistler as he will do a custom built KLX. By doing this you will be able to design your rod with your handle length of choice. Also, the KLX rods are build on the NFC blanks which are incredible.
I'm looking in the $100-$150 range, but I admit that's expanded to the $150 to $200 range. Give me around 2 weeks and I might be into the $200-$250 range, but I'm not there yet.
Can't Catch Bass reply :
I ended up going with the Fenwick ETB79XH. I found one on sale for $110 shipped... I wasn't planning on purchasing quite yet, but I figured I better jump on it. I'll let you all know how it works out. Once again thanks for the help.
Jim
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