Small Ratio Reels 2024
Eric J reply :
I picked up an Okuma Stratus at a ridiculous price. Really had no choice ;). It's a smaller ratio than I'm used to- 5.0:1. I figure it might be good for finesse fishing. Anyone use spinners that reel this slow? Any thoughts?
Eric J
Russ E reply :
20 years ago there were not many reels faster than that. We still caught a lot of fish.
i personally no longer own anything under 6.3 to 1.
generally the lower gear ratios are used for deep diving crankbaits. you can crank all day without wearing your wrist and hand out. I don't do a lot of deep cranking on Kansas stained lakes, so I no longer had the need for the slower ratios.
jimmyjoe reply :
Like I've said b4, old man told me that my lure was goin' twice as fast as it should. Slow down, catch more fish. It worked then and it works now. Slower retrieve ratio is one of the best ways to do that, whether you're fishing soft plastic, cranks, spoons or spinnerbaits. Smoother feel, too. jj
Paul Roberts reply :
So its a spinning reel?
Spool size will matter. I'd look at IPT (inches/turn). I find anything down near 20" is... near useless (unless maybe the rod is 8ft or longer). It has to do with keeping the line tight on fish, mostly. This is often the biggest problem with some UL spinning reels. Those little toy-sized ones are... toys.
Also, a buddy of mine loved his closed-face under-spin reel for small stream trout fishing. It was mighty slow. One day, a hot-to-trot big brown followed my spinner up from the depths of a big pool, but turned away. It was a race between my buddy and I to get our spinners back out there. I won, by a long shot. Stuff like that sticks in your mind, or your craw, depending on which reel you were using. 
Russ E reply :
My bad. I thought it was a baitcaster.
depending on the reel size a 5 to 1 spinning reel will bring in just as much line as a 6.3 to 1 baitcaster.
All but 2 of my 2000 size spinning reels are only 5.2 to 1. they bring in around 25 IPT .
my 6.3 to 1 baitcasters bring in around 26 IPT. not much of a difference.
J.Vincent reply :
On 1/3/2019 at 7:48 AM, Eric J said:I picked up an Okuma Stratus at a ridiculous price. Really had no choice ;). It's a smaller ratio than I'm used to- 5.0:1. I figure it might be good for finesse fishing. Anyone use spinners that reel this slow? Any thoughts?
Eric J
I own two of the Okuma Stratus S25 and they are 5 to 1 gearing. They are a very compact spinning reel and work well for Bitsy Bug Jigs, Shaky Heads and Drop Shots on 6ft6 Medium Fast Spinning Rods. I think they recover 25 inches of line per turn
Bluebasser86 reply :
I have some 5.0:1 spinning reels that I use for smaller crankbaits, jerkbaits, and some smaller plastics.
gilkeybr reply :
I wonder why reel manufacturers insist on using gear ratio for their publications? IPT is a much more useful piece of information.
For Comparison:
Daiwa Pixy - 6.8:1 - 24 IPT
Shimano Tranx - 5.8:1 - 30 IPT
This is an extreme example, but illustrates how gear ratio can be misleading
MN Fisher reply :
On 1/3/2019 at 9:56 PM, gilkeybr said:IPT is a much more useful piece of information.
IPT depends on two variables.
- What's the diameter of the spool?
- When was the measurement taken? Empty spool, half-full spool, full spool, or is it an average?
Gear ratio is a constant.
Eric J reply :
On 1/3/2019 at 10:11 PM, MN Fisher said:IPT depends on two variables.
- What's the diameter of the spool?
- When was the measurement taken? Empty spool, half-full spool, full spool, or is it an average?
Gear ratio is a constant.
Not to get overly technical but... While Gear Ratio is a constant the IPT will continue to change based on how full the spool is. So then, how accurate to how much line is reeled in is gear ratio?
MN Fisher reply :
On 1/3/2019 at 10:30 PM, Eric J said:So then, how accurate to how much line is reeled in is gear ratio?
It isn't. It gets even worse if you get a 3rd party spool to replace the original. If the new spool doesn't have the exact same specs as the original, the IPT will be different than the rated one.
Gear ratio will tell you how fast the spool spins on retrieve. This remains constant no matter the spec of the spool or how much line is on the spool.
IPT is constantly changing - not knowing at what point it was measured by the manufacturer, you have no idea what the actual IPT is at various spool-fill points.
If the spool is 1/2" deep, then the difference in IPT between an empty spool and a full spool is 3.14" per turn.
fishwizzard reply :
Eh, I would rather just have them prominently list the ITP for a full spool, which is usefull info to extrapolate from. Gear ratio alone doesnt give any info on how much line a reel will pick up per crank.
I also wish line manufactures would list lines by diameter and raw breaking strength, but that aint gonna happen either.
WRB reply :
Gear ratio is rated low to high, not small to large.
Shimano 1000 series spinning reels are only 5.0:1 yet rated 26" IPT. You can't compare small diameter bait casting reel spools to larger size spinning reel spools, IPT is all about circumference or the distance around the spool, spool length and spool line capacity.
Tom
Darren. reply :
1000 size Stradics are 6.0:1, FWIW....
Great answers above re: inches per turn, low-high.
WRB reply :
On 1/4/2019 at 1:11 AM, Darren. said:1000 size Stradics are 6.0:1, FWIW....
Great answers above re: inches per turn, low-high.
I believe the Sedona is still 5.0:1 RPT of 26", according to Shimano's tech info. Stratic 1000 @ 6.0:1 RPT is 31", small fast reel!
The OP can look up his Okuma reel data.
Thanks,
Tom
Team9nine reply :
On 1/3/2019 at 8:17 AM, Paul Roberts said:So its a spinning reel?
Spool size will matter. I'd look at IPT (inches/turn). I find anything down near 20" is... near useless (unless maybe the rod is 8ft or longer). It has to do with keeping the line tight on fish, mostly. This is often the biggest problem with some UL spinning reels. Those little toy-sized ones are... toys.
Also, a buddy of mine loved his closed-face under-spin reel for small stream trout fishing. It was mighty slow. One day, a hot-to-trot big brown followed my spinner up from the depths of a big pool, but turned away. It was a race between my buddy and I to get our spinners back out there. I won, by a long shot. Stuff like that sticks in your mind, or your craw, depending on which reel you were using.
This ^^
You may not realize it at first if you don't have a faster reel with higher IPT to compare to, but it makes a big difference. See what IPT is for that particular model; probably low to mid 20s. Will it work - yes. Will it be ideal - no.
Heartland reply :
On 1/3/2019 at 10:44 PM, MN Fisher said:It isn't. It gets even worse if you get a 3rd party spool to replace the original. If the new spool doesn't have the exact same specs as the original, the IPT will be different than the rated one.
Gear ratio will tell you how fast the spool spins on retrieve. This remains constant no matter the spec of the spool or how much line is on the spool.
IPT is constantly changing - not knowing at what point it was measured by the manufacturer, you have no idea what the actual IPT is at various spool-fill points.
If the spool is 1/2" deep, then the difference in IPT between an empty spool and a full spool is 3.14" per turn.
For myself I would say that it is not as important to know the exact IPT, just that if I have two reels, one a 25 IPT and one a 30 IPT, I will always know that if all things are equal the 30 will always be the faster reel. You can not assume that using gear ratio.
Paul Roberts reply :
On 1/3/2019 at 10:11 PM, MN Fisher said:IPT depends on two variables.
- What's the diameter of the spool?
- When was the measurement taken? Empty spool, half-full spool, full spool, or is it an average?
Gear ratio is a constant.
Moot point, I think. What matters is how fast we can retrieve line when we're fishing. If that matters to us, then... we should not fish with half a spool. If we do plan on having our spool half full... then maybe gear ratio is our number. Then again, I don't think we can get an IPT number from an empty spool. 
More seriously, we'd have to lose a lot of line, before it affected our IPT appreciably. By then we'd be cursing about how close we now have to get to that lunker's hidey-hole, to get our lure in there.
fishwizzard reply :
On 1/4/2019 at 4:55 AM, Paul Roberts said:
You'd have to lose a lot of line, before it affected your IPT appreciably. By then we'd be cursing about how close we now have to get to that lunker's hidey-hole, to get our lure in there.
I fish with mostly 1016 sized Daiwa spools, so like 100y/14lb line. At the end of a long bomb cast with a lure like a toad that needs a min speed to stay on top I will have to reel faster then I do as the lure gets closer to me. It’s not a huge speed increase but it’s enough to be annoying if I am doing it all day.
ITP drop off is very easy to test but I have never gotten around to doing it.
Paul Roberts reply :
On 1/4/2019 at 5:04 AM, fishwizzard said:I fish with mostly 1016 sized Daiwa spools, so like 100y/14lb line. At the end of a long bomb cast with a lure like a toad that needs a min speed to stay on top I will have to reel faster then I do as the lure gets closer to me. It’s not a huge speed increase but it’s enough to be annoying if I am doing it all day.
ITP drop off is very easy to test but I have never gotten around to doing it.
Would be interesting to know. However, it would also be pretty much academic. If it were me, I'd be putting that 14lb mono on a bigger spool. Or, as I mostly do now, go to braid.
I actually have two spinning reels I've used 14lb mono on -they are both mega-spooled: a US Reels 240, and an old (but still good as new) Quick 440N. (That old Quick will still be good as new when my great-great-grandkids get it.) I think I get somewhere near 40ipt out of that thing. I actually back-reeled Chinooks with it -comfortably. It will also skip a Cordell Spot across the surface if I get too excited burnin' it.
WRB reply :
The changing IPT as a spool empties line during a long cast is real. How much the IPT drops off depends on line capacity. Wider spools hold more line then arrow spools of the same diameter with the same diameter arbor.
Spinning reels operate with a fixed spool, the line is pulled off by the lure weight. If the line isn't close to the spinning reel spool lip the doesn't come off over the lip easily, therefore 1/2 empty or 1/2 full spinning reel spools stop the line. For this reason longer spinning spools cast better then narrow spools, increased line capacity. The other method is to increase the spool diameter, this was the US Reel design; over size diameter spools. Good design that solved 2 spinning reel problems; reduced line twist and increase capacity. As a side the IPT was increased with the larger diameter spool.
Baitcasting reels have a revolving spool, not a fixed spool, line is pulled off by spinning the rotating spool and the line slows do to the capacity being reduced; less line comming off with each rotation because the circumference is being reduced.
I measured my 100 size baitcasting reel IPT full of 12 lb FC @ 26" and after casting 50 yards @16", the gear ratio was 6.3:1. My 8:1 gear ratio size 100 was 33" full and after casting 50 yards dropped to 20".
I can't cast a 1000 or 2500 size spinning reel 50 yards using 8 lb FC or 12 lb braid, the spool is too small and the lip stops the line comming off unless the weight is heavier then I fish with. I don't believe you can cast far enough to impact the IPT severely with a fresh water bass size spinning reel.
Tom
MAN reply :
Just curious, but when you get to the point where you are worried about a possible 3-5 IPT difference between 2 reels..are you overthinking fishing? Not trying to be a smart@ss...honest question.
Paul Roberts reply :
On 1/4/2019 at 6:52 AM, MAN said:Just curious, but when you get to the point where you are worried about a possible 3-5 IPT difference between 2 reels..are you overthinking fishing? Not trying to be a smart@ss...honest question.
Yes, I'd say so. Except... when it gets down so low that it becomes impractical. My first response to the OP was simply to say... avoid a "toy" reel regardless of cost. 5:1 is AOK, provided the spool is large enough. If it's an UL or L reel with a tiny spool, I'd find out what the IPT (full) is. If its a "bass-sized" reel (~2500 up), I'd figure it will be fishable (for line diameters appropriate to a 2500 size reel).
I bought two UL reels this year. Spool diameter is critical for such reels. One I bought at a shop where I could see the spool size. The other I bought on-line and looked at IPT to be sure I wasn't getting a "toy". Again, I want 24" give or take. That I can fish with. There are plenty of little spinning reels (and most spin-cast reels) that come in under 20". That makes things darn hard to fish with, in terms of presentation, and fighting fish. Not to mention racing your buddy to that BIG brown trout!
WRB reply :
If your average cast is under 25 yards IPT is minimal. When you make longer casts 40 to 50 yards the IPT becomes and issue because you can't reel fast enough to control a big bass using the average size bass reel.
Off topic but I use 300 & 400 size baitcasting reels to recover line fast enough using big swimbaits after a strike even though retreiving the lure very slowly. The reason is 300 & 400 size reel has a larger diameter wider spool with higher line capacity that doesn't impact IPT dramatically after making a long cast. The same is true using deep diving crankbaits, you don't want to reel fast to get the lure diving then slow down as it gets closer to the boat, impossible to control the lures pace.
Tom
GeekFisher reply :
On 1/4/2019 at 7:14 AM, WRB said:If your average cast is under 25 yards IPT is minimal. When you make longer casts 40 to 50 yards the IPT becomes and issue because you can't reel fast enough to control a big bass using the average size bass reel.
Off topic but I use 300 & 400 size baitcasting reels to recover line fast enough using big swimbaits after a strike even though retreiving the lure very slowly. The reason is 300 & 400 size reel has a larger diameter wider spool with higher line capacity that doesn't impact IPT dramatically after making a long cast. The same is true using deep diving crankbaits, you don't want to reel fast to get the lure diving then slow down as it gets closer to the boat, impossible to control the lures pace.
Tom
A Little off topic but would a shallow spool mitigate those longer casts effect on ipt ? It might requires thiner line to achieve same distance though?
fishwizzard reply :
On 1/4/2019 at 6:46 AM, WRB said:I measured my 100 size baitcasting reel IPT full of 12 lb FC @ 26" and after casting 50 yards @16", the gear ratio was 6.3:1. My 8:1 gear ratio size 100 was 33" full and after casting 50 yards dropped to 20".
I don't think I cast any where near 50y with any presentation I normally throw. I did a test on one of my reels, a Daiwa sv103 with a 34mm spool.
I have the reel spooled with 40lb PP braid;
Again we run into the issue of manufactures just listing "14lb Mono" without giving diameter. Ande IFGA Mono does not come in 14lb, only 16lb and 12lb, but the 12lb is .325 mm, so we can assume that 40lb PP is a little thinner then the ideal 14lb mono.
With the spool filled up to bottom of the lip I am getting ~26" ITP, give or take 1/2" on each side as I used a fat marker to mark the line. I then pulled off line to the half-way mark Daiwa puts on their spools. I tend to fill my spools to this mark with backer and the rest with mainline. When I measured again I was getting around ~22" ITP. So not a huge difference.
In interestingly, when I mentioned noticing a slow down in retrieve speed was over the summer, when I had the same reel spooled up with 65lb Sufix 832.
Now in that case, we are in between Ande IFGA 16lb at .375mm and Ande IFGA 20lb at .425mm. I believe I spooled the Suffix to fill the entire spool and while I never spooled it on a cast, I believe that I was casting off more then half of the spool, but was honestly not paying close attention. I do have a 1016 spool filled with .40mm mono that I will run the same test on in a bit.
WRB reply :
The line I used on my baitcasting reel's was Sunline 12FC @ .29 mm / .011D and Nylon 11lb @ .27 mm/.011D round off to nearest .001. That is close to 30 lb braid.
Full spool to me is function @ 1/16" ( about the thickness of a penny) below the rim.
I also measure the distance using a steel tape measure, fairly accurate.
My average horizontal jig cast is around 40 yds, occasionally need to cast 50 yds. 7/16 oz jig with trailer is close to 5/8 oz.
Tom
fishwizzard reply :
On 1/4/2019 at 8:45 AM, WRB said:My average horizontal jig cast is around 40 yds, occasionally need to cast 50 yds. 7/16 oz jig with trailer is close to 5/8 oz.
Tom
I have a 300' tape and some tomato stakes, I am going to mark some distances in the field behind my house. I have a feeling that I am not making very long casts at all.
WRB reply :
On 1/4/2019 at 8:56 AM, fishwizzard said:I have a 300' tape and some tomato stakes, I am going to mark some distances in the field behind my house. I have a feeling that I am not making very long casts at all.
Football field is ideal, may be too cold now to make long cast!
Tom
QUAKEnSHAKE reply :
On 1/4/2019 at 7:58 AM, GeekFisher said:A Little off topic but would a shallow spool mitigate those longer casts effect on ipt ? It might requires thiner line to achieve same distance though?
Not necessarily. If the spools are the same o.d. and width just one shallower than the other and both throw the same distance say 140 feet with .010" line the IPT wont change between deep or shallow spool. Even if the max line capacity is 140 on the shallow vs 250 on the deep.
For casting reels
Ill add there may be a change in casting characterics being the shallow spool might be lighter than the deep, but IPT no change.
WRB reply :
A shallow spool has a larger diameter ardor requiring less line to fill it. The distance from the rim of the spool to the end of the line after casting is the same. The advantage of a shallow baitcasting spool is a lighter weight, no advantage with spinning reels.
The Daiwa TD SS 1500 spinning spool is shallow and long, plus tapered so the line falls off easier. Like the US Reel both designs were trying to improve the casting distance with spinning reels.
Paul Roberts reply :
On 1/4/2019 at 8:12 AM, fishwizzard said:I don't think I cast any where near 50y with any presentation I normally throw. I did a test on one of my reels, a Daiwa sv103 with a 34mm spool.
I have the reel spooled with 40lb PP braid;
Again we run into the issue of manufactures just listing "14lb Mono" without giving diameter. Ande IFGA Mono does not come in 14lb, only 16lb and 12lb, but the 12lb is .325 mm, so we can assume that 40lb PP is a little thinner then the ideal 14lb mono.
With the spool filled up to bottom of the lip I am getting ~26" ITP, give or take 1/2" on each side as I used a fat marker to mark the line. I then pulled off line to the half-way mark Daiwa puts on their spools. I tend to fill my spools to this mark with backer and the rest with mainline. When I measured again I was getting around ~22" ITP. So not a huge difference.
In interestingly, when I mentioned noticing a slow down in retrieve speed was over the summer, when I had the same reel spooled up with 65lb Sufix 832.
Now in that case, we are in between Ande IFGA 16lb at .375mm and Ande IFGA 20lb at .425mm. I believe I spooled the Suffix to fill the entire spool and while I never spooled it on a cast, I believe that I was casting off more then half of the spool, but was honestly not paying close attention. I do have a 1016 spool filled with .40mm mono that I will run the same test on in a bit.
This kind of work is the way to really know. Thanks for taking the time to share this. Another way is to know what works when you're fishing. But that can get expensive! Been there. So, when I compare reels, I look at IPT over gear ratio.
And when comparing lines, I'm looking at diameter over "break strength". Ditto on that.
Another thing, braid and monos behave differently on a cast. Not sure exactly how it all falls out though. Braid is lighter so it will cause less drag in the air. It is also softer, which makes it more frictionless than more "wiry" mono's. However braid's softness (and texture) can also be more affected by wind when there's a lot of it out there on a cast. Dunno how these factors stack up. I'm sure the distance tournament casters have this all worked out.
Team9nine reply :
On 1/5/2019 at 11:32 PM, Paul Roberts said:This kind of work is the way to really know. Thanks for taking the time to share this. Another way is to know what works when you're fishing. But that can get expensive! Been there. So, when I compare reels, I look at IPT over gear ratio.
And when comparing lines, I'm looking at diameter over "break strength". Ditto on that.
Another thing, braid and monos behave differently on a cast. Not sure exactly how it all falls out though. Braid is lighter so it will cause less drag in the air. It is also softer, which makes it more frictionless than more "wiry" mono's. However braid's softness (and texture) can also be more affected by wind when there's a lot of it out there on a cast. Dunno how these factors stack up. I'm sure the distance tournament casters have this all worked out.
Taking tournament casting out of the equation and just doing normal everyday casting, braid casts farther on spinning; sometimes much further. Since I almost never use braid on baitcasters, I can't say for sure there. Other factors come into play like revolving spools/bearings and such, so my guess is that things would be much closer in general because it's not just line and a lure involved.
Paul Roberts reply :
On 1/5/2019 at 11:53 PM, Team9nine said:Taking tournament casting out of the equation and just doing normal everyday casting, braid casts farther on spinning; sometimes much further. Since I almost never use braid on baitcasters, I can't say for sure there. Other factors come into play like revolving spools/bearings and such, so my guess is that things would be much closer in general because it's not just line and a lure involved.
That's my thinking too. Yes, braid on spinning is a huge advantage distance-wise, in large part bc, once that weight is flying, it has little weight to pull behind it.
But casting gear is different, as you mention. I do use braid on casting gear and feel I don't see much difference in distance. I have noticed that fill height can matter with braid, more so than with mono. The softness of it doesn't seem to slip out of the reel cage/line guide as smoothly as mono does. Only an issue when over-filled on some reels, which I've discovered. With braid, I'm sure to check the clearance when spooling up.
related Fishing Rods Reels Line Knots topic
previous topic
most viewed Fishing Rods Reels Line Knots topic
© 2024 - fishing.qciss.net. All Rights Reserved.