Hypothetical Experiment: Skill Vs. Equipment 2024
Globadoc reply :
Question, especially for those of you blessed enough to own rods costing greater than $150:
If you downgraded your equipment, (for example, if you had to fish with an Ugly Stik or a Berkley Cherrywood) for the season), how much do you think your fishing results would be reduced - even if you use the same techniques you use now? Do you think you would catch fewer fish? If so, how much would it decline? For conversation's sake, let's take durability out of the picture (which I agree, would impact your ability to stay on the lake).
I'm just wondering how much we depend on our equipment rather than good ol' fashioned skill.
flyfisher reply :
Equipment is as important as skill in my opinion. Now the gap isn't as large as you get into high dollar equipment but for me I am not even sure I could cast a ugly stick all day without developing carpal tunnel syndrome 
Ultimately it is a confidence thing. If you are confident in your equipment you will perform better but if I had to switch to say an ugly stick instead of my st croix and kistlers I think my catch rate would go down due to the decreased sensitivity.
BrettD reply :
If durability is of no concern I dont think it would make much of a difference to me most of my fishing is done with moving baits. The only place I can see it be a problem is when you need to feel a bite like drop shotting.
I think most people use higher end equipment because it makes fishing more enjoyable. Thats why I fish I enjoy it and using a nice rod and reel just make the experience that much better.
BrianinMD reply :
I agree with BrettD, not a lot of different while fishing moving baits. But when you get to any bait you fish where you have slack line it will hurt a lot. You need the extra sensitivity of a higher quality rod.
Now for the weekend angler out for the fun of it the choice becomes personal preference, is the higher cost worth it for a few extra fish. Tournament anglers don't want to start off at a disadvantage when money is on the line.
BassinB reply :
Well I just learned that Skeet Reese and Brent Chapman use gear that is "lower quality" than I do and they clean house. So maybe it doesn't matter as much as I once thought...
Marty reply :
QuoteQuestion, especially for those of you blessed enough to own rods costing greater than $150:
I shouldn't answer since I have no rods that cost that much, but I've caught and dragged some big ones through heavy slop while using rods and reels in the $40-60 range. Now consider that it's universally believed that that the biggest factor in fishing success is locating the fish and it stands to reason that the cost of the equipment isn't a huge factor.
Maybe a lousy analogy, but compare a Chevy to a BMW. The former will get you to where you want to go just as quickly and safely as the latter, although the latter might be more comfortable and quieter to use. But the Chevy doesn't deter you from accomplishing your basic goal.
wnybassman reply :
Some of my best fishing in the past was done on $30 rods from Walmart. I feel I could still probably scrape up some fish using them.
ec1 reply :
It comes down to confidence in your gear, and how confident you feel when you're fishing. Sensitivity comes into play, but I like to think it is far overrated. Yes, you can claim some techniques could use a feel for transmitting slack line bites... But I once read an ice fishing book that there is no such thing as a fish that can bite your bait without moving the line.
I believe your full concentration to your line is more important.
But if I'm holding an ugly stick and spending Half my time complaining about a crappy rod, sure as hell it'll make me less efficient
11justin22 reply :
direct answer yes it would decline. how much? i have no freaking idea...... somewhere from 20-40% i would venture to guess.
The Next KVD reply :
On 4/17/2013 at 7:10 AM, BassinB said:Well I just learned that Skeet Reese and Brent Chapman use gear that is "lower quality" than I do and they clean house. So maybe it doesn't matter as much as I once thought...
You should look at the line they are using. Brent is using Gamma which is pretty expensive and sensitive. Skeet is using 100% Trilene which I consider midgrade. Fluorocarbon and braid make all rod more sensitive than they are designed to be.
With that said, when I first got into fishing I was using a $30 reel from Kmart and a $20 rod from a local tackleshop. I caught a lot of fish on that thing. But I will say the more expensive equipment has made me a better angler. I can cast lighter lures farther and general stuff farther, I can feel more bites, ect.
If you can spend the money and it makes you enjoy fishing that much more or if your a tournament angler than yes it is worth every penny. I love my custom built St. Croix SCV rod blanks and Shimano Chronarchs and I personally feel disadvantaged using a combo that cost me less than $120. But I that's my level of enjoyment.
basseditor reply :
In the late 70s, I went fishing with a guy famous for catching giant brown trout on hair jigs. Actually, there were 8 of us on the trip, plus the "semi-famous" guy. (At least he was known locally.)
Eight of us (me) caught one brown in 2 days. Other guy? At least 40 up to 10 lbs. he was "sponsored" by Browning and got free rods to promote their boron rods. I never heard of sponsorships or high end rods before. I had a fiberglass rod that had served me well for throwing Mepps spinners and such. But when it came to bottom contact techniques, I was a novice.
I was guiding waterfowl hunters and soon after that one of my new clients turned out to be the Browning rep. I traded for a 6' boron casting rod. I cost more than a weekend guide trip so I had to give some cash too.
It changed my fishing ever since and I then started tournament bass fishing a few years later. I only buy high end rods now. Even my s-glass rods were over $150.
mjseverson24 reply :
I believe fishing is 90% fisherman 5% equipment and 5% luck. You can give anybody the most expensive equipment, but without the proper knowledge they will be no more successful than with the walmart stuff. I think rod & reel combos in the 120-150 range allow you to do just about any technique that you may need. the difference between a $120 combo and a $500 combo is mainly confidence. if you think you need a 500 dollar combo to catch fish by all means do that, but if you can catch fish with much less why wouldn't you.
Mitch
hooah212002 reply :
I am what you would call a "budget basser" and whenever topics come up that pertain to gear, I get to hear about guys that spend $150 on a rod or $200 on a reel and how that is the norm or how "Walmart crap" is junk that won't catch fish. Bass fisherman, IMO (since this is real talk), are pretty pompous and self righteous. A lot of you act like you can't fish unless you spend copious amounts of cash.
That said: I do understand the importance and significance of "high end" gear. I do realize there are advantages to paying a premium. However: if you need these advantages and you need $200 rods, how good of a fisherman are you? You have to realize that at least 75% of fishing comes down to YOU knowing where to look for fish.
ClackerBuzz reply :
i bet $100 Big O can catch a 10 lb slob while hand lining a jig.
Hooligan reply :
Sure you can catch fish on a cane pole, however better gear is going to give greater advantage.
I don't think, generally, that my GLX helps me catch any more fish than I would fishing a Veritas. It's lighter and more sensitive, but in most situations I am not going to feel more bites with that sensitivity. What I'm feeling is the bottom composition and hitting small obstructions. One of the primary reasons that I'm moving back to the GLX versus he NRX. The price difference isn justified.
Bluebasser86 reply :
I think how much my fishing would decline would depend a lot on what techniques I'm fishing. If I'm fishing all moving baits or treble hooked lures it probably wouldn't decline all that much. If I'm pitching a jig, fishing a T rig, dropshotting, or shakyhead fishing it's going to decline a lot more because of the lack of sensitivity. I'm talking if you go really low level (like the Ugly Stick/Cherrywood that the OP mentioned) Even with moving baits there is a pretty big difference though. I was fishing for walleye today with a Bomber Long A and a Havoc Beat Shad. I had the Bomber on a St.Croix Premier and the Beat Shad on a LTB. I was amazed at how dead the Premier felt compared to the LTB. I wouldn't have been able to feel a fish hit the crank unless it really smacked it but I could feel every rock with the LTB.
SirSnookalot reply :
The most important factor in catching fish is not the equipment, skill plays a part but being on the right body of water is the key to great fish. As a younger person fishing with my dad we killed them on Lake St Clair and Lake Erie, go to an inland lake 20 miles away and it was a struggle. Down here in Florida the fishing is just so so in the Boynton area, I go to the keys or Sebastion and the catch rate is dramatically higher using the same gear.
I no longer have to micro manage my budget for fishing gear, but I still don't feel the need to drop a bundle. I do spend a bit more for my saltwater reels, they do take more a beating, but it seems to me the ones I pay more for seem to need repair more often. Whether it's fresh or salt my sub $100 reels are as smooth, handle fish as well and don't seem to fail like their more expensive counterparts.
wnybassman reply :
On 4/17/2013 at 2:43 PM, SirSnookalot said:I do spend a bit more for my saltwater reels, they do take more a beating, but it seems to me the ones I pay more for seem to need repair more often.
I think that's what it comes down for me as well. Perhaps the biggest reason I have bought more expensive gear is getting a little more longevity out of it, not necessarily the extra sensitivity. To be honest, there are several techniques/presentations I do with both a Premier and a LTB interchangeably and I really can't tell much of a difference between the two. A couple of those techniques are dropshotting and fishing T-rigs, things most feel are quite sensitivity dependent. I only buy the higher priced equipment when decent deals come along, I would never buy it at regular price. Just can't justify the cost difference to lack of performance (for me) difference.
I find it funny when looking on the decks of boats of guys in my club that are ALWAYS near the top in every tournament, and their gear is garbage in many peoples eyes. Mixed matched low end rods, old reels, crap line, yet week after week they continue to kick most people butts.
Oldplug reply :
Exerience vs equipment. Well experience is what it is really all about. I used to fish with a guy that grew up with a fishing rod in his hands. He used to walk down on the dock and look at the water and the weather and he would say " they don't like that" meaning the conditions and he was very rarely wrong. He could feel and sense the fish because he was in tune with the nature side of it. You can talk all you want,but unless you can feel the environment your fishing in the mot expensive tackle in the world won't help you. That is experience. When some guy wins one of these big tournaments it is almost certain he is reading the conditions that give him the feel of the fish.
S Hovanec reply :
Pretty much all I do anymore is drop shot. If all I had to use was an Ugly Stick......I think I'd quit fishing and take up golf.
Jig Meister reply :
All the gear and money wont catch you much if you do not understand fish habitat and fish behavior.
I do great with my 200 dollar set ups, and love them like they were 500 dollar setups.
experiences trumps everything, then I feel that the line being used is the most important and rod, reel and bait all fall behind that.
give me time on the water and my vendetas and lews and I will be happy!
Look at it this way, all pro baseball players swing the same bats (within reason), some get paid millions, some get paid millions more then the other man. The guys who make the most money are not always going to be hitting the ball well, it still comes down to skill. Perfect analogy? No, but sort of gets the point across.
fishingman88 reply :
+1 . I have been outfished by large margins by some ole timers using Ugly Stik combos. They have put me to shame and it almost makes me put away my gear. It truly comes down to the fisherman. I guarantee you that even if KVD was using a $30 setup and I was using a $250 setup, I would be super humbled at the end of the day. Moreover, the high end gear truly just makes the experience more enjoyable. It doesn't mean you will catch more fish, but it means you won't have to worry about rough drags, etc.
On 4/17/2013 at 10:53 AM, mjseverson24 said:I believe fishing is 90% fisherman 5% equipment and 5% luck. You can give anybody the most expensive equipment, but without the proper knowledge they will be no more successful than with the walmart stuff. I think rod & reel combos in the 120-150 range allow you to do just about any technique that you may need. the difference between a $120 combo and a $500 combo is mainly confidence. if you think you need a 500 dollar combo to catch fish by all means do that, but if you can catch fish with much less why wouldn't you.
Mitch
Darren. reply :
I'll throw a slightly different take into the mix. But first, I'll agree that more sensitive (usually = expensive) rods give much better feel for bottom-contact fishing. That said...
The different take, weight. My new favorite rod is a 6'3" Avid MLXF spinning rod. Why? It is paired up with my new Lexa 2000SH spinning reel and perfectly balanced -- LIGHT tip for me which means less strain on my elbow(s) fishing for extended periods with that rod. Couple that with this being a wacky/TX/split-drop setup, the sensitivity is amazing.
Now I also own Stradics and they're paired with my Shimano Compre spinning rods. They are great combos, but not as tip-light as the Avid/Lexa combo. And honestly, for the money, I'd buy another Lexa spinning reel over a Stradic at this point. That's me.
I'll point to Pat Cullen, guy's caught a thousand 10 pounders using Ugly Stiks -- but moving baits. I'll never catch that many (okay, never say never). I haven't even scored my first double-digit bass. So it can be done on inexpensive gear with great success.
flyfisher reply :
I think the other thing being missed here is it is part of a natural progression that as you fish longer you want to upgrade gear and along with that time fishing you gain experience at the same time.
I have given my st croix rage rod to a new fisherman and he was catching more than with his ugly stick combo he had. Was that because of my teaching him or was it the gear, who knows but his confidence went up and he caught more fish.
Ultimately they both go hand in hand and it is pretty rare that a new fisherman is going to go out and drop $300+ on a combo to get into the sport. I started out a few years ago with quantum combos from bass pro then went to st croix mojos and now i am using the st croix rage rods. My catch rate on moving baits is about the same, weightless soft plastics has went up a lot due to the nicer rods and using braid and bottom contact baits has also increased. Who knows the cause of this but i am sure glad it is happening
Globadoc reply :
So a lot of you would agree that skill trumps equipment, but equipment is crucial mostly for certain techniques where feeling light bites is important - nonmoving, bottom contact fishing. So, are we all nuts for buying expensive $150-200 rods for crankbaits, spinners, etc. when a $60 rod will suffice just as well? (Then of course purchasing a more sensitive rod for the finesse stuff...)
.ghoti. reply :
I have a lot better gear now than I had twenty years ago. And I seem to do better now. I don't think the better gear has much to do with it. I have twenty years more experience to bring to the table, and that is the difference.
I do enjoy my better equipment, but I don't think it has a lot of impact on my catch. It probably does give me a small edge, but nothing extraordinary.
HeavyDluxe reply :
On 4/17/2013 at 9:32 PM, Jig Meister said:All the gear and money wont catch you much if you do not understand fish habitat and fish behavior.
...
Look at it this way, all pro baseball players swing the same bats (within reason), some get paid millions, some get paid millions more then the other man. The guys who make the most money are not always going to be hitting the ball well, it still comes down to skill. Perfect analogy? No, but sort of gets the point across.
+1. This. Like the cut of his jib, and all that.
Knowing how to read the water and the target fish (whether you call that experience or skill) is far and away more important than equipment. I think it's a sign of how highly marketed-to we are that this is even up for debate. Without the skill to find fish, determine their 'posture' (active, neutral, negative), and then decide what presentations might produce a bite, you are primarily relying on luck/coincidence to catch fish.
That's not bad, mind you, but that's what it is.
And all that 'thinking' which sets the elite fisherman apart from the scubs like me happens before they even wet a line - that is, before rod/reel/line/lure equipment ever comes into play.
Now, I'm willing to accept that a highly sensitive rod will increase hookups for particular presentations... But, I have to be honest, even there I'm skeptical that the difference is as severe as we often seem to think.
Flukeman reply :
95% of bass fishing is knowledge and location. I know some guys who win tournaments all the time with lower end gear. Humans are adaptable to what they have to use and will become proficient with it. I think if buying higher end or lower end equipment makes you enjoy the pastime more, then go for it.
Besides, were talking about a fish you can catch on a chunk of hot dog!
SissySticks reply :
I"m somewhere in between. I have some very high end rods, but most were bought on ultra-clearance. I keep my tackle for a long time, so I can afford to wait for things to go on clearance. However, I have a bunch of $50 castaway spinning rods with tennessee handles (some of which I use regularly, and some of which are loaners) and I'm convinced that I could catch all the same fish with them if I didn't have my $200 quantums and shimanos, lews and customs. I just like the expensive stuff and it enhances my enjoyment of the sport, but I don't think it enhances my catch. Check out In-Fisherman writer Ned Kehde's equipment. It's antiquated (and cheap to-boot), he fishes "slack-line" baits 100% of the time, and I can say from personal experience he catches more fish per hour than any fisherman I've ever been in a boat with, bar none, including some professional tournament anglers and LOADS of guides who used some of the most expensive equipment available.
Hyrule Bass reply :
obviously some of you have never dropshotted with an ugly stik. i have great success doing so. i'd love for people to tell me why they think they cant or why they just wont drop shot with an ugly stik. and dont give me that sensitivity bullcrap because i dont buy it. give me experience/skill over equipment anyday. i can fish for bass just fine with an ugly stik, then turn around that night using the same ugly stik and pull in nice catfish all night long. and it wont break on a hookset. personally, id rather not have to deal with returns and customer service reps and all that like many of you do when your high dollar rod snaps in two less than week after you got it. sounds like a waste of time and money, especially when i can buy an ugly stik and do the same things that $150 rod will do, and do them just as good without worrying about it breaking. yep, ill take skill
ive previously made it known here im not a fan of high dollar rods, i asked advice for a rod in the $100 range here once, all i got were suggestions that didnt match the criteria i listed or suit the reel i was putting on it, i ended up just buying another ugly stik and was totally satisfied, and glad i didnt spend a $100 on a rod. but what i will spend on is reels, but there is a limit there too. do i need to spend a lot on reels? no. ive had great days using a push button shakespeare reel i paid 20 bucks for the combo at walmart. most all my PBs come on that rod and reel too. ive caught and landed stripers on it as well and the gears didnt get torn all out. why am i sharing this? i know it sounds like a rambling rant/rave, but its to prove my point and show why i would take skill and experience over equipment any day. theres nothing wrong with owning nice things or high end things, and maybe the owner can justify it, but there are just certain things i cannot justify spending on whether i have the money or not...
Sodus Bay Scooter reply :
I think the biggest factor is presentation. Equipment can make or break presentation. And equipment also becomes important when you're trying to get that fish in your hands.
That being said, if you can present said bait with a cheaper setup as effective as an expensive one then you've answered your question.
hatrix reply :
I don't think it matters very much in reality on what you use. I have wrecked some fish using like $40-50 spinning combos from places like wal-mart and stuff. While at the same time the people I am fishing with are using combos using 4-5x the cost of what I'm using. In the end I think it comes down to experience and time on the water. The advantage of having a nice rod is being able to tell what your lure is bumping into and you get a little more in tune with that bait.
I think experience is like 95% of it and gear only plays a small factor. You can have the most sensitive rod in the world and rip a bait on braided line out of the weeds while a fish come from behind and knocks even more slack in your line. You will probably never feel that bite. You just have to know.
Felix77 reply :
I wouldn't consider myself experienced enough to comment on this with one exception. Sensitivity is a big factor in finesse fishing especially with with lighter lures. I have a $50 setup and a $200 setup and when fishing a shakey head I can feel a whole lot more with the $200 setup.
Boy this sounds a lot like the old "Is a $400 driver really going to make you a better golfer" debate.
Very interesting feedback from you all.
Sodus Bay Scooter reply :
On 4/18/2013 at 4:42 AM, Felix77 said:I wouldn't consider myself experienced enough to comment on this with one exception. Sensitivity is a big factor in finesse fishing especially with with lighter lures. I have a $50 setup and a $200 setup and when fishing a shakey head I can feel a whole lot more with the $200 setup.
Boy this sounds a lot like the old "Is a $400 driver really going to make you a better golfer" debate.
Very interesting feedback from you all.
If I pay $400 for a driver it better make me better! Lol
BradGuenette reply :
It's fairly simply, fish with what you can afford. Sure I don't need Dobyns Extremes & Loomis GLX's, but are they a pleasure to fish, and I wouldn't want to use anything else. I by no means have a ton of extra disposable income to spend on fishing gear, but I save for everything put money aside monthly when you have enough to go buy those more expensive items rod/reels do so. I saved for just over a year to buy my full line of Extremes.
HeavyDluxe reply :
Just to be clear, anyone categorically stating that "better" equipment doesn't help you catch more fish is being ridiculous. By way of obvious example, using sharper and more well constructed fish hooks is obviously going to lead to "more effective" hooksets and probably to more fish landed if all other things are equal.
However, I think there's room to debate how much "better" a better hook really is... If I buy Cap'n McFishstick hooks off the shelf at Walmart, I'm betting there's a clear and marked difference between those and some Mustad or Gammie hooks. The problem is that, by nature, fishing in the real world means that every bite/hookset is likely a little different. So, it's really hard to objectively and quantifiably compare some of these products.
But, IMNSHO, the more important fact is that I have to get the fish to strike in the first place before the sharpness of the hook is even an issue. And, broadly speaking, I think you can present baits to fish in a way that entices a strike with equipment at all price levels. Are they equal? No. But I suspect most are adequate.
otulp78 reply :
In general, experience is superior to equipment, but that doesn't diminish the importance of equipment. High end equipment will ultimately help you catch more fish compared to low end equipment. Of course, there's diminishing returns so you have to ask yourself if its worth it.
To answer the original poster's question, I suspect it would turn out something like this:
Suppose you caught 100 fish over the summer (Using round number for the sake of argument) using a stella/nrx combo. If you would have used the following combos instead, you would have caught approximately:
stella/nrx: 100
stradic/avid: 97
sahara/mojo: 90
walmart spiderman pole: 35
A lot of the people who think that high end equipment doesn't matter usually make comments like "I can outfish my friend who uses high end gear with my low end gear" or "I know someone who wins tournaments with low end gear against others with high end gear". If you're thinking this, then you're not asking the right question. The question you should be asking is "would you be able to outfish yourself, if you used low end gear and the other you used high end gear?" Imagine you using the spiderman fishing pole from walmart competing against another you using a stella/nrx combo. Who do you think wins?
hooah212002 reply :
On 4/18/2013 at 7:08 AM, otulp78 said:Who do you think wins?
The comparison you've made is terrible at best. Why would you compare a childrens fishing pole to high end bass fishing gear? first of all, a spiderman pole is only 3 feet long.
This post is exactly the sort of thinking I addressed in my first post in this thread. Why do you guys associate "Walmart stuff" with ony crappy gear? Do you realize they sell Black Max combos? They have the new Quantum EXO's as well. They also sell Power Pro and Sufix. Also Gamakatsu hooks. So this idea of Walmart only selling crap,.. is a crap idea.
You ought to compare an actual budget set up. One that someone would actually buy for bass fishing. Like a Black Max combo that is $60. Give me that and all other things being equal, you have no distinct advantage.
Welcome to the fray, by the way.
wnybassman reply :
I'd like to think I could catch 37 or 38 fish on the Spidey pole. lol
otulp78 reply :
On 4/18/2013 at 7:18 AM, hooah212002 said:Why would you compare a childrens fishing pole to high end bass fishing gear?
Why do you guys associate "Walmart stuff" with ony crappy gear?
Give me that and all other things being equal, you have no distinct advantage.
Sorry, I didn't mean to imply that Walmart only sells crappy gear. I only used it as a reference in case someone didn't know what I was referring to. I buy fishing stuff at Walmart too.
Also it shouldn't be you against me. It should be you against yourself. Are you saying that Hooah212002 with a black max combo will catch the same amount of fish as Hooah212002 with an Revo MGXtreme/NRX combo over the course of 5 years?
hooah212002 reply :
On 4/18/2013 at 7:48 AM, otulp78 said:Also it shouldn't be you against me. It should be you against yourself. Are you saying that Hooah212002 with a black max combo will catch the same amount of fish as Hooah212002 with an Revo MGXtreme/NRX combo over the course of 5 years?
That is an inaccurate metric. You are putting ALL stock in your gear. You are essentially saying that it is the gear that makes the fisherman. You are saying "if you spend more money, you will be a better fisherman". That is simply not the case. Also, I remain unconvinced that your proposed combo would by itself cause me to catch more fish than a Black Max (all other factors being equal).
"I'm not catching fish today. Better go to Bass Pro and buy that $300 reel so I can catch a few"
Now, would I prefer more expensive name brand gear if for no other reason than being shallow? yes. A million times yes. Do I also realize that more expensive normally (but not always) equates to better quality? Yes, yes I do. But to unequivocally state that more money equals more fish is borderline flatout...wrong. If you've got some evidence that says otherwise, I am all ears. We've already got personal testimony in this thread alone that disagrees with you.
Oldplug reply :
I am one of those old ugly stik guys. I have owned them since the first year they were made. I do not need a highly sensitive rod to feel. I can feel very well though my stiks. That is something else that is only learned through experience. I just feel a lot of his high priced stuff is being pushed on people.
I want to relate something funny happened to me concerning ugly stiks. The first year they were made they gave you a baseball cap with ugly stik rods printed on it. Well we were in a restaurant and with my manners being what they are I left my hat on. I noticed some people at another table giving me dirty looks. Next thing I know the manager of the restaurant shows up and tells me there was no sexual references allowed in the restaurant. I told him that it was a fishing rod and he was skeptical and ask me totally it off. I did only because my wife did not want me to challenge it .
iabass8 reply :
bats fly left when they leave a cave
otulp78 reply :
Hooah212002,
You are totally misunderstanding what I am saying. Let me give you 2 scenarios to clarify my point.
Scenario #1
You have more skill, knowledge and experience than me. You fish with a $60 combo and I fish with a $600 combo. Everything else being equal over a 1 year period.
Your conclusion: You will outfish me.
My conclusion: I agree 100% with you.
Scenario #2
We have the exact same skill, knowledge and experience. You fish with a $600 combo and I fish with a $60 combo. Everything else being equal over a 1 year period.
Your conclusion: We will catch the same amount of fish.
My conclusion: I disagree. You will catch more fish than me by a small percent.
Hope this makes sense. What's my proof? Simple. If gear does not impact the number of fish you catch, then everyone would by the cheapest gear possible. Why go for a $60 combo when you can catch the same amount of fish for $30?
SirSnookalot reply :
There are many positive aspects to any fishing forum, but negatives as well. It's easy to get "programmed" into buying this brand or that brand and the fishermen using the more expensive gear are having more fun. Catching more and or larger fish comes down to 2 main factors and that's knowing how to do it and where to do it at. Debates over the "best" are really nothing but self justification for buying a certain item. IMO if one wants to get the most out of BR, learn the techniques, how to read the environment, the hot fishing areas and the species running at that time, the lines, rods, reels, hooks and all that will take care of itself.
jerzeeD reply :
I see it this way.... A good Auto mechanic can fix most problems with a limited set of husky tools, but with 20k in Snap on tools he can fix cars with less chance of tool failure, greater comfort of his hands/wrists, and maybe the job is easier based on tool design. However, A pianist will never be capable of quick and proper car repairs no matter what tools are at his disposal. Same with fishing, concentrate on learning and upgrade gear as you get more proficient in using different techniques.
hooah212002 reply :
On 4/18/2013 at 1:03 PM, otulp78 said:What's my proof? Simple. If gear does not impact the number of fish you catch, then everyone would by the cheapest gear possible. Why go for a $60 combo when you can catch the same amount of fish for $30?
Why would people buy the most expensive gear? Easy: this is a hobby people enjoy and when people enjoy a hobby, they like to have nice toys to enjoy that hobby with. I have already admitted that at some point on the price scale there is higher quality (*higher price equates to higher quality). I have already ceded the point that the ultra cheap/budget gear is likely to not be worth the effort since you will likely have to replace it often due to breakage (note that I am talking about the $20 Shakespeare baitcasters and the like even though I, personally, have no problem fishing them). Ok, I have yet to actually say that second one, but I think I implied it.
Is the difference going to be grand if you use a cane pole with a piece of yarn and I use a $600 something or other? YES.
Is the difference going to be there at all if I use a budget rod/reel and you use a high end-look how much money I have-rod/reel? I remain utterly unconvinced. You could, however, provide better argument than "it costs more, so it MUST catch more fish". You've yet to do anything more than assert that price ALONE directly equates to more fish.
JoePhish reply :
Skill and knowledge will take you a lot further than owning expensive gear.
I've felt this way my whole life because of a family story.
When my father was "courting" my mother he was invited to go fishing with my mom's dad. Now it wasn't bass fishing and it was on a party boat but fishing never the less.
My grandfather was an old salt in the fullest sense of the word. My dad on the otherhand, was more of a land lubber.
Dad wanted to impress so he went out and bought the latest and greatest gear out there. When he met up with my granfather at the boat all Grand Dad had was a hand line. My grandfather proceeded to outfish my father and every other person on the boat with that hand line.
I really wish he lived longer because I would have loved to go fishing with the man. Instead, I think I inherited his fishing genes.
Unfortunately as a result I was the kid down at the local pond with a cane pole. I still outfished my peers. (No bass in the pond. Just panfish, Bullheads and goldfish (gasp).
To this day I'm more of a bankg for the buck type of guy when it comes to fishing gear.
PS - My personal best was on an ugly stick.
trailer reply :
In this experiment would we be able to use a Zebco 33 Classic or Revo Winch on the Ugly Stick?
SudburyBasser reply :
On 4/17/2013 at 5:48 AM, BrettD said:I think most people use higher end equipment because it makes fishing more enjoyable. Thats why I fish I enjoy it and using a nice rod and reel just make the experience that much better.
Ditto, couldn't have said it better myself.
Globadoc reply :
On 4/19/2013 at 4:01 AM, trailer said:In this experiment would we be able to use a Zebco 33 Classic or Revo Winch on the Ugly Stick?
To stay within the spirit of the experiment, you have to use the Zebco 33.
Globadoc reply :
On 4/18/2013 at 9:20 PM, JoePhish said:Skill and knowledge will take you a lot further than owning expensive gear.
I've felt this way my whole life because of a family story.
When my father was "courting" my mother he was invited to go fishing with my mom's dad. Now it wasn't bass fishing and it was on a party boat but fishing never the less.
My grandfather was an old salt in the fullest sense of the word. My dad on the otherhand, was more of a land lubber.
Dad wanted to impress so he went out and bought the latest and greatest gear out there. When he met up with my granfather at the boat all Grand Dad had was a hand line. My grandfather proceeded to outfish my father and every other person on the boat with that hand line.
I really wish he lived longer because I would have loved to go fishing with the man. Instead, I think I inherited his fishing genes.
Unfortunately as a result I was the kid down at the local pond with a cane pole. I still outfished my peers. (No bass in the pond. Just panfish, Bullheads and goldfish (gasp).
To this day I'm more of a bankg for the buck type of guy when it comes to fishing gear.
PS - My personal best was on an ugly stick.
Funny story that I can identify with. I have been fishing several times with my father-in-law (God rest his soul) and his bent 9 foot bamboo cane pole with the yarn and old hook. No matter what equipment my son and I took with us, he ALWAYS caught the largest fish of the day. ALWAYS. The old man could really get it done.
Sam reply :
No, not really.
The more sensitive equipment can give you an advantage but overall I have done well with BPS Extreme rods.
It is your technique, bait selection and understanding of how a bass thinks that separates the masters from the pretenders.
My fishing buddy always bought cheap rods and reels and threw them away when they broke. He is an excellent fisherman and will outfish just about everyone using the inexpensive stuff.
Crookedneck reply :
There is a time and a place for all types of gear.
First you have to fish where the fish are. Doesn't matter what gear you have, if you are fishing in a mud puddle in your drive way, no gear is going to catch fish if they aren't there.
Some techniqes gear may be less important. Others gear can make a huge difference.
I have found that finesse techniques is where the biggest difference is noticable. And that difference is multiplied with weather, water current, water depth and bottom make up.
Hooligan reply :
#1 reason I wouldn't fish an ugly stick- weight. #2 it simply isn't as sensitive as even lower end graphite. I will guarantee you that you miss fish, you cannot, and I mean 100% cannot feel a lift bite on the drop on an ugly stick. The physics of the rod make it next to impossible.
You may feel that you're successful with it, and that's fine, but declaring that it is sufficient for all presentations is simply ridiculous.
Skill has its limitations, and you cannot replace those lost senses. A progressive taper rod like the ugly stick cannot account for so, so many things. You cannot feel the transition from one bottom type to another. You cannot feel the light tick of hanging on a stem of grass. You cannot feel the light push of a spot moving your jig to you. Skill alone cannot tell you those things, either.
Is it necessary to spend $450 on a rod to feel those those things? No. Is it necessary to have a adequate feel and transmission in a rod to be able to feel them? Yes.
If the Ugly Stick is so sensitive and so adequate, why does not a single angler on any major circuit fish them? Even by comparison to other modern rods they lack the most essential qualities to be deemed even a workable bass rod.
So you're happy fishing them, fine. But to claim that an ugly stick will do everything a $150 to will do, and do it better is asinine. The laws of physics alone deny that claim.
In limiting your ability to delineate structure and other items by fishing sub par rods that are incapable of transmitting those changes you limit your ability to increase in skill.
You might be fine with moving baits on an ugly stick, but I will guarantee you you're missing fish on them when it comes to bottom contact techniques. That, or you have super human senses and reaction times.
derekxec reply :
i only use custom built rods now (because i build them myself) and mid/high end reels right now but if you take durability out of it there is still a lot of difference to me...i have used low end stuff and i can tell you that most high end stuff is a lot lighter and stronger and also tailored to the kind of fishing you are doing
when i was using the low end stuff i would be wore out at the end of the day just from the weight of the rods casting them 12 or so hours a day and the higher end stuff is a lot more sensitive
but if you put in durability the high end stuff kills the low end for example ive had a shimano trinidad since 2000 or 2001 ($420 which isnt even the top end) but ive used it in saltwater maybe 4 times a week since i bought it and have never rinsed it off or cleaned it, oiled it or replaced anything on it and it feels brand new still (besides a bunch of scratches on the outside haha running down the beach after it before the ocean/fish takes it)
JEC reply :
IMO skill is more important than equipment would I catch less fish with downgraded equipment? sure I would because a lot of the bites I get I would never even feel due to sensitivity of the rods but if u took KVD and gave him an ugly stick and a zebco he would still out fish me no question
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