Spawn "ethics" 2024
Preytorien reply :
So here in Indiana, mother nature has unleashed a nice bought of cold fury upon us, and it's hard to imagine anyone but the most die-hard guys being anywhere near water right now.
That said, I'm already looking forward to the spring, the thaw, and fishing. Pre-spawn will be here, then spawn.
What are your thoughts on catching bedding bass? I used to think it was a great thing, but then last year after I caught one, I noticed immediately bluegill rushing in to eat the eggs, then I felt a bit guilty. Those are the next generation of bass, if the bluegill eat them all, my waters won't be self sustaining. Besides, that bass was just defending its kids when I caught it, like we'd all do.
What are your thoughts? Catch it, or give the kids a chance?
Shane J reply :
I don't fish for bedding fish. I will stay outside areas of bedding activity, catching the ones that haven't gone up yet. Staying in those same areas clear through the spawn, and into post spawn.
Darren. reply :
Consider also the fact that there are probably hundreds of bedding bass that you cannot see that'll remain on their nests protecting thousands of spawnlings.
This has been discussed on the forums a number of times, and the pendulum swings both ways. I for one will fish spawning bass, but I'll be careful to CPR (Catch, Photograph, Release) ASAP.
flyfisher reply :
http://www.dgif.virginia.gov/fishing/waterbodies/reports/Largemouth%20Study%20Update%20Jan%2008.pdf
here is an article with a study done on a very popular big bass lake here in VA.
A-Jay reply :
This topic routinely elicits a decent number of responses detailing opposing view points.
As long as an angler is abiding by state / local regulations, I feel it's a matter of personal preference.
Some view this as a matter of ethics and conduct themselves accordingly; I'm on this side of the line.
Others follow the Letter of the Law and I'm good with that as well.
Practicing anything else is usually not only illegal but some seriously Bad Juju.
A-Jay
Preytorien reply :
These are all great answers, and fall in line with my own preference. But that's also a good article.
I'll admit I did some more digging and found (like that article states) that fishermen don't make as big of an impact as thought, but that I just use caution and get the fish back in the water pretty quickly. If it's a particularly heavy pressured water, or small pond, I may just let the bedding bass defend in peace. Otherwise I'll just practice caution.
I didn't find a whole lot of forum conversations about it, but then again I searched "spawn".....maybe I should use "bedding"
Darren. reply :
On 12/9/2013 at 10:53 PM, PSN81 said:These are all great answers, and fall in line with my own preference. But that's also a good article.
I'll admit I did some more digging and found (like that article states) that fishermen don't make as big of an impact as thought, but that I just use caution and get the fish back in the water pretty quickly. If it's a particularly heavy pressured water, or small pond, I may just let the bedding bass defend in peace. Otherwise I'll just practice caution.
I didn't find a whole lot of forum conversations about it, but then again I searched "spawn".....maybe I should use "bedding"
Whether this matters or not, and it is just my experience, bedding bass are not a guaranteed catch. Sometimes they're impossible to entice with a succulent worm or jig, or whatever.
Preytorien reply :
On 12/9/2013 at 10:58 PM, DarrenM said:Whether this matters or not, and it is just my experience, bedding bass are not a guaranteed catch. Sometimes they're impossible to entice with a succulent worm or jig, or whatever.
Oh believe me I know. It's pretty rough when you've got a 4+ pounder in front of you and you're not even getting a look! Ha!
ww2farmer reply :
The way I see it, the jerks make me work hard for them 11 months out of the year, the few weeks they expose themselves, I will take advantage of it. Smallmouth tend to be stupid easy to catch off a bed, so I don't get carried away with it. One day... Have my fun, and move on. Largemouth.... I rarely target them on beds specifically... But I do fish shallow that time of year, and if one on a bed is caught.... So be it
MarkH024 reply :
This is exactly why a number of northern states implement a bass season. To give them a chance to be protected as they spawn. Often, the spawn carries out of that time frame and other times it doesn't. I think that it is more of an impact on the northern states where ice can speed up or slow down the spawn seasons and the fact that bass aren't as heavily populated as some southern waters.
J Francho reply :
Biologists up here have told us that 75% of the fish aren't spawning at any given time, but are shallow. The larger females aren't guarding beds, and usually cruising the shallows. They can be spooky, and difficult, but these are the fish I target. I will stick a bed fish if it's pretty big, or if it's a slow day. They aren't always as easy as people make it seem, and sometimes they are. December through June is catch and immediate release for black bass, so any fish are immediately returned. It seems to me that if fishing pressure was an issue, I'd think the fishing would suffer, but it hasn't.
Dwight Hottle reply :
On 12/9/2013 at 11:10 PM, MarkH024 said:This is exactly why a number of northern states implement a bass season. To give them a chance to be protected as they spawn. Often, the spawn carries out of that time frame and other times it doesn't. I think that it is more of an impact on the northern states where ice can speed up or slow down the spawn seasons and the fact that bass aren't as heavily populated as some southern waters.
Along with what Mark has stated the state of PA forbids any tournaments during the trophy season which corresponds with potential spawning times. Obviously they feel that the 10% of the fisherman that catch 90% of the fish will not be doing it during a tournament format in PA trophy waters.
bighed reply :
Here in TX we don't have a problem with fisherman harming the spawn by catching and releasing bedding fish. I've done it off and on for many years at Fork which may be the most well know bed fishing lake around. That said, I've caught nothing over 8 pounds from beds. I've seen a few bigger but they usually don't hang around the bed long leaving the smaller males to tend the nest. I'm convinced that if a guy could push himself away from the lure of catching lots of 2-7 pound fish he would increase his odds greatly of catching that monster sow hiding near by.
Raul reply :
There´s no point in you feeling guilty, mathematically speaking 95 % of the eggs laid are not going to become even fingerlings, about half of them are not fertilized, that leaves you with only 50% of eggs to incubate, about half of those will not hatch, others will be eaten by predators like bluegills, from those hatched a good percentage of the fry is not going to reach fingerling size and from those a good ammount will be eaten by their own kind.
If those numbers don´t make you feel better well, you can always stop fishing for spawing fish.
Nitrofreak reply :
I find it much more intriguing to start early and follow these fish on their way to spawn , I would much rather find the actively feeding fish rather than spend time trying to coax a bite , eh , it gives me a better understanding of migration routes that I can later use for post spawn , I must say how very exciting it is to see a big ol' sow on her nest though ,
As for ethics I guess , I'm in with AJ on this one .
AK-Jax86 reply :
I'm here in FL and we are known for 10lbers. I am still waiting to LAND mine BUT I want to do it before spawn. Don't get me wrong when I get mine during spawn I will be very excited about it but I would feel more accomplished if I were able to get her pre spawn, time is running out.
One of if not the biggest bass I ever caught, I STILL DON'T COUNT HER THOUGH (didnt have a scale back then either), was when I was in middle school back in NJ. Was walking with my buddy to our spot had to go through a bunch of woods. Before we get to the woods there is a part of the lake that has a cove and we see this huge bass just sitting there. He threw something she didn't budge I threw out a creme worm and she inhaled it I basically picked her up out the water it seemed. Was literally 5 feet off shore I felt like I cheated lol.
MarkH024 reply :
On 12/10/2013 at 3:19 AM, AK-Jax86 said:Was literally 5 feet off shore I felt like I cheated lol.
5 feet from shore is no different than 5 feet from your boat. A catch is a catch, congrats! Post that 10lber when she hits!
boostr reply :
On 12/9/2013 at 10:24 PM, flyfisher said:http://www.dgif.virginia.gov/fishing/waterbodies/reports/Largemouth%20Study%20Update%20Jan%2008.pdf
here is an article with a study done on a very popular big bass lake here in VA.
Great article, thanks
slonezp reply :
On 12/9/2013 at 11:10 PM, MarkH024 said:This is exactly why a number of northern states implement a bass season. To give them a chance to be protected as they spawn. Often, the spawn carries out of that time frame and other times it doesn't. I think that it is more of an impact on the northern states where ice can speed up or slow down the spawn seasons and the fact that bass aren't as heavily populated as some southern waters.
Wisconsin has gone one further with the Green Bay/Sturgeon Bay smallie fishery. Season opener is May4th like the rest of the state. It's C&R thru the middle of June, and the season on Washington Island doesn't open until July 1. If it wasn't for introducing off limits, size limits, and the goby invasion it wouldn't be the fishery it is today.
My opinion on the OP is exactly in line with A Jay
MarkH024 reply :
On 12/10/2013 at 4:46 AM, slonezp said:Wisconsin has gone one further with the Green Bay/Sturgeon Bay smallie fishery. Season opener is May4th like the rest of the state. It's C&R thru the middle of June, and the season on Washington Island doesn't open until July 1. If it wasn't for introducing off limits, size limits, and the goby invasion it wouldn't be the fishery it is today.
My opinion on the OP is exactly in line with A Jay
They also have the barbless only rule above Highway 10? (northern zone) through June. Bass fishing up there is really great anyway because most of the locals are targeting other species for the most part. Eye's mainly, Pike, Ski, perch. Rarely do I ever talk to locals that are specifically fishing for bass. Maybe just an odd occurrence for me. Experience the same conversations when you head up there?
slonezp reply :
On 12/10/2013 at 4:52 AM, MarkH024 said:They also have the barbless only rule above Highway 10? (northern zone) through June. Bass fishing up there is really great anyway because most of the locals are targeting other species for the most part. Eye's mainly, Pike, Ski, perch. Rarely do I ever talk to locals that are specifically fishing for bass. Maybe just an odd occurrence for me. Experience the same conversations when you head up there?
The locals that are shorebound seem to be more of the buckethead type. The guys who have boats are exactly what you described. Eyes, perch, and trout/salmon. It's such a vast fishery, it really doesn't get crowded either. Biggest problem with fishing DC is the weather. I know the DNR has been doing a lot of management with the musky population, numbers are down, but they've been getting some real trophies
hoosierbass07 reply :
Since I don't live in one of the southern warm states, and I'm finding bass season is over in the winter time, I'm going to take full advantage of catching bass during the spawn. If that caused a problem I assume indiana would have laws dealing with it. I buy my license, I catch and release, I fish.
alberto-1 reply :
I dont have a problem at all catching bedding bass. Just another way to fish as far as Im concerned.
RoLo reply :
Fish egg mortality can reach 30% in one day. To compensate for
high mortality rates, Mother Nature provides a generous oversupply of roe.
In fact, if 50% of the fish eggs actually survived, your lake would be in trouble.
Moreover, the fish and game commission studies every waterbody at great length
to form a blueprint for the fishing seasons, daily limits and slot limits.
When a cow bass is locked on a bed, she's dialed into the role of reproduction
and is not interested in food. She is also tough to infuriate, because the role
of protectorate belongs to the buck. In short, it's difficult and time-consuming
to coerce a bedding cow. It's pretty safe to say that the lion's share of trophy bass
taken during the spawning season are cow bass in the pre-spawn or post-spawn stage.
Roger
WRB reply :
Bed fishing is the number 1 reason Florida will never produce a world record bass, no closed sanctuary water and the use of live shiner fishing during the spawn. Giant bass are most venerable on beds during the spawn, 99% of these bass are caught during the pre spawn to spawning period everywhere. C&R works only if the bass is handled properly and that doesn't happen often when it's a near record or PB size bass.
Does bed fishing harm a fishery? It can on trophy bass lakes.
Tom
tomustang reply :
I catch and eat predators trying to ambush the bed.
Sometimes the best part of a beding bass is watching them pummel much larger fish to keep them out of the bed
Bluebasser86 reply :
Not many of our lakes are even clear enough to see bedding fish in the spring. I've done it a couple times in tournaments on Table Rock and other clear water lakes but it's often easier to target fish that haven't moved up yet or have already finished spawning. In very few instances can I remember a spawning bass being the slam dunk easy catch that they're so often reported to be. More often than not, I'll end up spending 10-30 minutes minutes working a single fish before I get it to bite, and sometimes it may not bite at all. I try to avoid doing it if possible though.
KyakR reply :
On 12/10/2013 at 12:46 PM, WRB said:Bed fishing is the number 1 reason Florida will never produce a world record bass, no closed sanctuary water and the use of live shiner fishing during the spawn. Giant bass are most venerable on beds during the spawn, 99% of these bass are caught during the pre spawn to spawning period everywhere. C&R works only if the bass is handled properly and that doesn't happen often when it's a near record or PB size bass.
Does bed fishing harm a fishery? It can on trophy bass lakes.
Tom
It's true, I think, that fishing the spawn might not really impact the overall health of a lake. But I also think there's a reason big bass get big: they're smart, whether through genetics, experience ( this is also a great topic!) etc. I did try fishing for bedding bass some years ago, but I decided it just wasn't worth it. It felt like fighting a champion with arms tied in back and me with a bow. Instead I greatly enjoy watching them!
Catt reply :
WRB, please explain to me how catching a bass off a nest stops it from growing?
There is plenty of research that supports both sides but the most compelling is on the side of it does not effect the spawn.
J Francho reply :
I think his point is that large females are suffer greater mortality/harvest when fished during the spawn. I don't think he's arguing that bed fishing affects the spawn, but that it diminishes the number of healthy trophy fish in the lake.
A-Jay reply :
On 12/10/2013 at 11:58 PM, J Francho said:I think his point is that large females are suffer greater mortality/harvest when fished during the spawn. I don't think he's arguing that bed fishing affects the spawn, but that it diminishes the number of healthy trophy fish in the lake.
X2 ~
It's been mentioned a couple of times in this thread how during this phase many anglers feel that the largest fish become more "vulnerable".
Imagine if you will, what if these fish spawned at a depth or in a local that was the same as where they spend the rest of the year. Would the number of these fish caught be less ?
My contention would be yes, most definitely. And I'm not saying whether I know for sure how this affects reproduction rates or fish mortality, but if they're not caught at all, it's hard to think there would be any harm done.
A-Jay
Catt reply :
It is assumed!
That the female caught will die
That this female would have been a trophy
Yes the odds go up but the percentage is still small when compaired to the number of females that do not die or will never be of trophy.
J Francho reply :
Well, certainly - an 8 lb. released in to the lake stands a much better chance than one released into Crisco. 
Catt reply :
There are few experts more capable of unlocking the mysteries involved with the spawning ritual & debunking the myths than Ken Cook.
The following is from an article by Tim Tucker, Get A Lock On The Spawn.
Conventional knowledge indicates that the male bass builds the nest, fans it out, & guards it (zealously). Generally, a good male that is aggressive & active will attract more than one female to his nest & spawn with each of them. Along with that, an active female will spawn a number of times & in most cases, in a number of different males' nest. The male sits in one spot & waits for more females to come by. I think that is sort of a hedge (on the part of the female) against an infertile male spoiling the hatch of a good fertile female. So she spreads her eggs around & he spreads his fertility around. That ensures a higher success rate for that spawn.
It is this sporadic purging of eggs & the ability to spawn with different males on serveral nest that keeps the annual spring bedding season from being severly impacted by large tournaments. Texas Parks & Wildlife Department biologist Clarence Bowling says studies have shown that a female (when handled properly) will simply locate a bed & a available male in the area where she is released & complete spawning
boostr reply :
Aaaaaand que the 70s XXX music
RoLo reply :
On 12/11/2013 at 6:10 AM, Catt said:There are few experts more capable of unlocking the mysteries involved with the spawning ritual & debunking the myths than Ken Cook.
The following is from an article by Tim Tucker, Get A Lock On The Spawn.
Conventional knowledge indicates that the male bass builds the nest, fans it out, & guards it (zealously). Generally, a good male that is aggressive & active will attract more than one female to his nest & spawn with each of them. Along with that, an active female will spawn a number of times & in most cases, in a number of different males' nest. The male sits in one spot & waits for more females to come by. I think that is sort of a hedge (on the part of the female) against an infertile male spoiling the hatch of a good fertile female. So she spreads her eggs around & he spreads his fertility around. That ensures a higher success rate for that spawn.
It is this sporadic purging of eggs & the ability to spawn with different males on serveral nest that keeps the annual spring bedding season from being severly impacted by large tournaments. Texas Parks & Wildlife Department biologist Clarence Bowling says studies have shown that a female (when handled properly) will simply locate a bed & a available male in the area where she is released & complete spawning
Lake Kissimmee, Lake Okeechobee and Lake Tohopekaliga (Lake Toho) have always enjoyed a year-round open season
allowing artificial lures and natural bait. Nevertheless, in 2001 Lake Toho set and still holds the all-time B.A.S.S. stringer record,
heavier than any one-day B.A.S.S. stringer ever boated in California or Texas. More importantly, Lake Kissimmee
and Lake Okeechobee are stupendous trophy factories that are both producing more double-digit bass today
than they did in the so-called 'good old days'. In 2012, Ish Monroe won the 4-day Elite on the Big 'O' with 108-5.
In spite of being strictly a catch-&-release fishery, the same cannot be said of the Stick Marsh.
Roger
CWB reply :
In smaller clear water natural lakes it can have an effect. You can cruise the bank and see just about every bed made. Bad thing is they are pretty hard to catch. I've seen guys mark a bed with a stick then come back and toss a live bait in it and pull out both the male and female. Then they move on to the next bed. A limit of big females are always kept and a stringer picture taken at the ramp. Fish then thrown into a cooler. Turns my stomach. I know... It's perfectly legal but...
RoLo reply :
>> In smaller clear water natural lakes it can have an effect. You can cruise the bank and see just about every bed made.
Yes, you'll see lots of bed sites and you'll catch lots of bucks, but angler catch-rates for 'cow bass' on the bed are embarrassingly low.
>> Bad thing is they are pretty hard to catch.
Well actually, that's the good thing.
Though my wife and I practice C & R, we no longer sight-fish. We didn't stop sight-fishing because we're so noble,
but realized that we can boat those same cows far more effectively during the pre-spawn and post-spawn seasons.
Roger
FishinDaddy reply :
1. My adht will not allow me to sight fish for bedding fish. I do fish shallow in the spring just like I do in the summer, fall and winter.
2. With the frequent cold front and ever changing weather conditions during the spawn season, the likely hood of a hard spawn with good weather on a tournament weekend is not good.
3. If the FWC closed fishing during the spawn we could only fish from June to November.
Tournaments on Toho and Kissimmee have taken 5 lb averages to even sniff the money over the last few years. I don't think there is any shortage of monster fish.
Catt reply :
Double digit bass caught off nest: 0
Double digit bass caught during pre-spawn: 8
Double digit bass caught the rest of the year: 17
Don't bed fish either!
Texas bassman reply :
How bout catching pigs in the bluegill spawn? Just as fun
WRB reply :
I was discussing trophy size female bass being caught, put into a livewell and mishandled or over stressed and the bass either dies or looses the eggs for the years spawn.On 12/10/2013 at 11:45 PM, Catt said:WRB, please explain to me how catching a bass off a nest stops it from growing?
There is plenty of research that supports both sides but the most compelling is on the side of it does not effect the spawn.
Understanding the difference between a lake that has a stable, sustainable adult bass population verses a lake with marginal bass populations is important when discussing affects of over harvesting big female bass.
Smaller trophy bass lakes need a few spawning sanctuary areas off limits to fishing to sustain a good big bass population. Larger lakes or lakes with light fishing pressure that have spawning areas that see a minimum of bass harvest during the spawn are not affected by bed fishing.
Tom
RoLo reply :
On 12/11/2013 at 11:35 AM, WRB said:I was discussing trophy size female bass being caught, put into a livewell and mishandled or over stressed and the bass either dies or looses the eggs for the years spawn.
Understanding the difference between a lake that has a stable, sustainable adult bass population verses a lake with marginal bass populations is important when discussing affects of over harvesting big female bass.
Smaller trophy bass lakes need a few spawning sanctuary areas off limits to fishing to sustain a good big bass population. Larger lakes or lakes with light fishing pressure that have spawning areas that see a minimum of bass harvest during the spawn are not affected by bed fishing.
Tom
It's possible, but I've never heard that stressing the female can be lethal to the roe (nature usually favors the health of the embyro over the mother)
On the other hand, it's well-known that cow bass develop more roe than they need and more than they'll deposit in one spawning cycle.
This is what spawns the rumors we hear every year about ripe bass caught in midsummer (simply undeposited roe).
It goes without saying, lakes with inadequate bedding flats are more vulnerable to overharvest then lakes with a wealth of sand substrate
and wind-protected shallows. It's been said that 10% of the anglers catch 90% of the fish, but it's not likely that 10 percent
would target a lake with a marginal bass population.
Roger
Catt reply :
On 12/10/2013 at 12:46 PM, WRB said:Bed fishing is the number 1 reason Florida will never produce a world record bass, no closed sanctuary water and the use of live shiner fishing during the spawn. Giant bass are most venerable on beds during the spawn, 99% of these bass are caught during the pre spawn to spawning period everywhere. C&R works only if the bass is handled properly and that doesn't happen often when it's a near record or PB size bass.
Does bed fishing harm a fishery? It can on trophy bass lakes.
Tom
Florida is incapable of producing a world record bass simply because they allow bed fishing?
WRB reply :
The weekend angler that catches their personal best bass will more than likely keep it, few actually release them. The weekend tournament bass club angler never releases a big bass until after it has been weighed in.
Bragging rights creates an atmosphere of showing off the big bass to friends and photographing the bass several times. Big female bass kept in a livewell for several hours have low percentage of survival, for sake of argument more than 30% do not survive. The problem is very low population of big bass exist in every bass waterway, compared to the general bass population.
Successful spawning recruitment is dependant more on stable water levels and weather during the egg incubation period than from egg eating predators like carp, salamanders, bluegill, green sunfish, crappie, crayfish, chubs, minnows, etc. Over harvesting the general population of mid size adult female bass would be rare and these are the bass that sustain a fishery.
Tom
WRB reply :
Bed fishing with live shiners is a big part of the Florida bass guide business, the bed fishing pressure is intense.On 12/11/2013 at 1:24 PM, Catt said:Florida is incapable of producing a world record bass simply because they allow bed fishing?
Tom
Bankbeater reply :
Is this the same for heavily fished lakes that have a lot of pressure from anglers? I don't necessarily target bedding bass, but if I find a one I will throw a jig at it. I have seen many bass that will ignore the bait but will continue to chase off bluegill and other fish that come close to it.
SENKOSAM reply :
I suppose it could depend on the water. If smaller bass are the average size caught in large numbers, then a few ruined nests may help over the long run. More important is the population of egg eating fish and any species that eats bass. Even if you legally kept a male guarding a nest, it may not make a difference if there is an overpopulation of sunfish and white perch or tiger musky. Future populations of bass are already threatened without any angler affect.
I don't ever target bedding bass much less keep bass because of my deep respect for the species. Just me.
Mainebass1984 reply :
Very interesting to hear all the different OPINIONS.
Personally I don't fish for largemouth on beds. I think its easier to catch the fish that are about to spawn or have just moved off beds. I do enjoy smallmouth bed fishing. It is the only time I really sight fish. When I go smallmouth bed fishing I am usually taking my mom, dad, niece or a friend that fishes a couple times a year. They have a blast watching fish hit their lure and being able to catch significant numbers of fish.
RoLo reply :
On 12/11/2013 at 1:41 PM, WRB said:Bed fishing with live shiners is a big part of the Florida bass guide business, the bed fishing pressure is intense.
Tom
I'll try again.
The Big K and Big O have always enjoyed a year-round bass season, and have always allowed live bait.
In spite of that fact, both waters are producing more trophy-class bass today than any time in memory.
It's a mistake to compare specimens in their native habitat with non-native transplants, because a species
is most prolific within its natural range, where pruning a renewable resource lends to robust growth.
Florida-strain bass are indigenous to Florida, a subspecies provided by Big Mama to endure the rigors
of perennially high water temperatures. Although California has similarly high water temperatures,
Florida-strain bass are not indigenous to California (you can't fool Mother Nature, only for awhile).
Biologists call it 'waning genetic vigor'. Maintaining a non-native species typically requires TLC
and nursemaiding that's not needed within its natural range.
Spotted bass provide another example of same.
Lewis Smith Lake, Alabama held the world-record Spotted Bass, a 8-lb 15-oz brute.
Smith Lake gifted Lake Perris, California with spotted bass transplants, and California subsequently broke
the native spotted bass record. Smith Lake today is still an outstanding fish factory for spotted bass,
and largemouth bass. Sadly, due to waning genetic vigor, you would be hard pressed today
to catch a single spotted bass of any size from Lake Perris, California.
Roger
WRB reply :
Actually the lake Perris Sotted bass came from Friant Dam, Merced river in CA that were gifted from Alabama back in 1903. The spotted bass population collasped due in part to extreme fishing pressure, introduction of red ear sunfish and competing Florida largemouth bass population, that today is doing very well, 18 lber caught last spring. Florida LMB have been in CA over 50 years, spotted bass and NLMB over100 years, no bass are native west of the Rocky Mountains.On 12/12/2013 at 4:02 AM, RoLo said:I'll try again.
The Big K and Big O have always enjoyed a year-round bass season, and have always allowed live bait.
In spite of that fact, both waters are producing more trophy-class bass today than any time in memory.
It's a mistake to compare specimens in their native habitat to non-native transplants,
because a species is most prolific within its natural range.
Florida-strain bass are indigenous to Florida, a subspecies provided by Big Mama to endure the rigors
of perennially high water temperatures. Although California has similarly high water temperatures,
Florida-strain bass are not indigenous to California (you can't fool Mother Nature, only for awhile).
Biologists call it 'waning genetic vigor'. Maintaining a non-native species typically requires TLC
and nursemaiding, which is not necessary within its natural range.
Spotted bass provide another example of same.
Lewis Smith Lake, Alabama held the world-record for Spotted Bass at 8-lb 15-oz.
Smith Lake gifted Lake Perris, California with spotted bass transplants, and California subsequently broke
the native spotted bass record. Lewis Smith today is still an outstanding fish factory for both
spotted bass and largemouth bass. However, due to waning genetic vigor, you'd be hard pressed today
to catch a single spotted bass of any size from Lake Perris, California.
Roger
CA's tiny deep structured trophy bass lakes have zero bass population management outside of fishing regulations state wide for 5 bass limits with 12" minimum length. A few lakes have slot and 3 bass limits based on local requests from fishing organizations, need to lobby our fishery people to reduce fishing pressure.
Keep in mind the initial FLMB came from Cypress Gardens FL back in 1959, all other FLMB planted in CA lakes came from those initial transplanted bass.
Nearly every lake that received the FLMB from Upper Otay in San Diego had a robust population of northern strain largemouth bass prior to introducing the Florida strain. The NLMB and FLMB integrate quickly and this impacts the gene pool, not loss of pure vigor, it's loss of pure genes.
The bass in CA have the option of going into deep water in our drinking water storage reservoirs where water temps tend to be near 70 degrees for over 9 months, this factor lengthens the FLMB life spand to nearly 15 years, longer growing period than in their native Florida waters.
deaknh03 reply :
Whenever I picture a bed fisher, I see my pregnant wife being harassed. Needless to say, I do not do it.
CWB reply :
If you notice I mentioned live bait was used. There are a couple guys I see doing this on a regular basis. Mark the bed, come back to it, and throw a crawler, leech, shiner or crawdad into it and sit and wait. These guys just seem to want to get a picture at the end of the day. I've tried sight fishing a couple times but as pointed out, the bigguns are tough to catch in gin clear water and I just don't have the patience. A couple years back there was a 6+ nesting right off my dock. Tried flipping a few baits in there and she didn't even move. Caught a 3" bluegill and tossed it in there and she attacked it with a vengeance. She didn't spit it out right away either. I tugged slowly for a while without setting the hook and finally she spit it out. Couldn't force myself to set the hook.On 12/11/2013 at 8:22 AM, RoLo said:>> In smaller clear water natural lakes it can have an effect. You can cruise the bank and see just about every bed made.
Yes, you'll see lots of bed sites and you'll catch lots of bucks, but angler catch-rates for 'cow bass' on the bed are embarrassingly low.
>> Bad thing is they are pretty hard to catch.
Well actually, that's the good thing.
Though my wife and I practice C & R, we no longer sight-fish. We didn't stop sight-fishing because we're so noble,
but realized that we can boat those same cows far more effectively during the pre-spawn and post-spawn
Roger
FishinDaddy reply :
On 12/11/2013 at 1:41 PM, WRB said:Bed fishing with live shiners is a big part of the Florida bass guide business, the bed fishing pressure is intense.
Tom
It's tough to fish with shiners in 2 feet of water, which is where most "visible" beds are in Central Florida due to the staining in our lakes. I have caught more large bass in probable bed locations in 4-6 ft of water in small open pockets in the Kissimmee grass, also hard to to shiner fish.
Where I see most shiner fishing is on the outside lines of vegetation. I believe they are catching pre and post spawn fish in these locations.
While I don't like the fact that trophy hunting vacationers usually keep the DD bass, the revenue from non resident licenses accounted for more than 2.8 Billion of the fisheries revenue for 2012/2013 so I will deal with it.
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