Looking Closely At Hook Points...... 2024
Crow Horse reply :
This is my first attempt at photographing hook points under a 50 power microscope (Nikon SMZ645). I thought it would be interesting.....
These are 5/0 wide gap worm hooks......Gamakatsu, Owner, Trokar, VMC
Angry John reply :
Good stuff man. Are you taking requests??? Love a shot of an owner st-41 to compare to the trokars.
Crow Horse reply :
These are the only hooks I have. I'd be glad to take pics of any hook point but I'd need the hook (obviously). If there is interest, send me one hook with information about it and I'll snap the pics, and return the hook.....
papajoe222 reply :
Now what you need are pics of those same hooks after considerable use. I have a feeling those would just show to you and us, that sharpening or replacing hooks is a sound practice (if you post them).
riverbasser reply :
Pretty cool, thanks for sharing
Crow Horse reply :
For fear of embarrassing myself, this hook I used the last 2 trips out. Although beat up visually, it still felt sharp to the touch although not as sharp as it should be. Footnote - I crush the barbs to facillitate catch & release....
Crow Horse reply :
Another.....
lo n slo reply :
nice pics. i’ve always like using the “thumbnail stick” test for hook sharpness.
BassWhole! reply :
Please oh please dear God send them some warm days...
Darren. reply :
Neat stuff 
NYWayfarer reply :
That Trokar hook looks like a sword. Nice pics.
Crow Horse reply :
Here I used an Eze-Lap hook sharpener to sharpen the hook point. It passed the finger nail test. I'm going to experiment with finer grits and see how that looks...
Lendiesel22 reply :
Pretty cool man
bkohlman reply :
Love seeing this, I hope you continue and look at other brands too, I would like to see how Berkley Fusion hooks look!
NYWayfarer reply :
On 1/26/2018 at 10:37 PM, bkohlman said:Love seeing this, I hope you continue and look at other brands too, I would like to see how Berkley Fusion hooks look!
Second vote for this. I am liking the Berkley Fusion hooks. I like the low price and quality seems to be decent.
Crow Horse reply :
I'll look for thr Berkley Fusion hooks. My original intent was to present in picture form the various types of hook points but I've found myself being drawn in a slightly different direction. I'll be looking into various types of hook sharpeners and the results that they produce. Admittedly, I'm OCD when it comes to any of my interests but I've learned (regarding fishing) that it's one's attention to detail that often.that dictates whether you land the fish of a lifetime or drop it.
I'm waiting for several types of hook sharpeners to arrive and see how well they work. I'm really excited about the Razors Edge hook sharpening system. It's a "bench" type of sharpener so it wouldn't be taken out on the water but it uses the same method that is employed to sharpen surgical needles. I wish there was a method of testing sharpness that would yield quantifiable results for easy comparison. So far I haven't found one.
I'll still be snapping pics of different hooks as I come across them.......
WIGuide reply :
Cool stuff! I looked at some a long time back with my childhood toy microscope and it was interesting looking at some close up. I had checked out some cheap brand that I was hoping were decent and looking at the hook points really close like that opened my eyes when I compared to some Owners I had. It was night and day difference.
Crow Horse reply :
I'm learning a great deal with this endevour and having a lot of fun as well.......
The microscope I'm using is a Nikon SMZ645 and as I understand it from instruction manual, it's 8-50x total magnification. The microscope was previously used by an aviation manufacturer to inspect parts. The real tricky part is to get the camera (Canon A1300) I'm using in the proper position AND hold it steady......
Crow Horse reply :
VMC Heavy Duty Wide Gap 5/0
WRB reply :
Take picture of a new needle for comparison.
Tom
PS, it's blowing 30-50 mph today.
Crow Horse reply :
Getting hold of a new hypodermic needle might be tough. I'll have to ask my vet if he can part with one....
riverbasser reply :
Is it just me or is that VMC the sharpest point of them all?
Crow Horse reply :
Yes, the VMC hook looks to have the finer hook point and the finish is visually better than the others.
KayakFish107 reply :
Wow, some really interesting pictures here! I wonder if I could get some hooks into the bio labs here on campus and check em out!
WRB reply :
On 1/29/2018 at 5:47 AM, Crow Horse said:Getting hold of a new hypodermic needle might be tough. I'll have to ask my vet if he can part with one....
Sewing needle, hypodermic are hollow.
Tom
Crow Horse reply :
On 1/30/2018 at 5:40 AM, WRB said:Sewing needle, hypodermic are hollow.
Machine or hand? I've found that there is a wide disparity in needle sharpness, especially with the cheapies. Hypo's, although hollow, will have a much sharper/finer point.
WRB reply :
On 1/30/2018 at 6:11 AM, Crow Horse said:Machine or hand? I've found that there is a wide disparity in needle sharpness, especially with the cheapies. Hypo's, although hollow, will have a much sharper/finer point.
Hypo are a hollow tube cut off at an angle knife edge. Pick the sharpest needle you know of it's intended as a base line for "needle" point hooks.
Tom
Crow Horse reply :
I'm thinking that a suture needle would be a better baseline than sewing needles.....
Crow Horse reply :
I ordered some suture needles. Being that they are designed to pierce tissue, I'm figuring that they'll be a good benchmark. When they arrive I'll snap some pics.
Crow Horse reply :
The Razors Edge Hook Sharpener arrived today and I'm pretty stoked about it. It's intended to be "bench" mounted but I had to try it out without properly mounting it. I also got their dvd explaining the technique and concept behind the sharpener and it makes sense although a little "dated".
Basically, you triangulate the hook point but it's more than just that. You create a "shovel" edge on the inside of the hook point which "forces" the hook to dig in. And dig it does....
Here's my first attempt using their system. A used Gamakatsu EWG 5/0 hook......
Angry John reply :
Seems like a triangle like the trokar.
Crow Horse reply :
What is REALLY cool is the test for sharpness. Take your sharpened hook, tie on a short piece of line or leader and attach a weight to the opposite end. Then, with your thumb upside down and vertical, place the hook into your thumbnail lightly then release. If sharp, it will dig into the nail and hold even with the weight. Very cool!
Here's a pic of a taper point suture (surgical) needle......
Crow Horse reply :
Sharpness test......not too shabby....
MickD reply :
On 1/29/2018 at 5:47 AM, Crow Horse said:Getting hold of a new hypodermic needle might be tough. I'll have to ask my vet if he can part with one....
They can be purchased at pharmacies, or at least they were a couple years ago. Very low price, as I remember.
BASS302 reply :
Are these all at the same scale? It looks like all of the hooks are sharper than the taper point suture (surgical) needle. The next time I need surgery, I'll bring some hooks they can use to sew up the cut.
Crow Horse reply :
I think I magnified it more but I don't know how much. As I use the microscope more hopefully I'll become familiar with it.
I'll be checking the hooks that are pictured (new ones) to see how they fare in the sharpness test. I'm thinking that the Trokar might be the only one that might pass, but the proof will be in the pudding.....
Crow Horse reply :
I tested all the hooks that I have pictured with the "sharpness" test. Gamakatsu, Owner, Trokar and VMC. The only one that passed was the Trokar and that was "conditional". Even the Trokar didn't match the sharpness of the used and sharpened Gamakatsu with the Razor Edge sharpening system. The Gammi just wanted to dig into my thumbnail. The Trokar didn't "dig" in as easily.
I'll photograph and test more hooks as I come across them.....
Crow Horse reply :
BassNJake reply :
On 2/3/2018 at 7:40 AM, Crow Horse said:The Razors Edge Hook Sharpener arrived today and I'm pretty stoked about it. It's intended to be "bench" mounted but I had to try it out without properly mounting it. I also got their dvd explaining the technique and concept behind the sharpener and it makes sense although a little "dated".
Basically, you triangulate the hook point but it's more than just that. You create a "shovel" edge on the inside of the hook point which "forces" the hook to dig in. And dig it does....
Here's my first attempt using their system. A used Gamakatsu EWG 5/0 hook......
This is pretty impressive to me.
I'm going to take a look at that Razors Edge system.
Crow Horse reply :
I'm very pleased with the results.......
Berkley Fusion hooks will arrive soon for pictures.....
All Day Fishing reply :
it looked to me like VMC had the sharpest hook, is it just me? which would you say is the sharpest? I've always used Gamakatsu, hmmm.
Crow Horse reply :
The VMC hook definitely had a finer finish and visually appeared to have the sharpest hook point. However, I'm finding that appearance doesn't equal sharpness.
Out of the package as is, the Trokar did the best but it didn't equal the sharpness of a "sharpened" hook......
Crow Horse reply :
Berkley Fusion 5/0 EWG
Raul reply :
On 1/25/2018 at 9:09 PM, reason said:Please oh please dear God send them some warm days...
Define warm ....
ooooops, sorry, wrong side of the Mason-Dixon line .....
Crow Horse reply :
Just out of curiosity, I sent an email to Gamakatsu and asked them what the irregularities were on the hook point. Below is my inquiry.....
Greetings, I've been using Gamakatsu EWG Worm Hooks Offset Shank (5/0) (58315-25) with success for the past 3 years. I recently began investigating hook sharpness as it's extremely important to fishing success. Using a Nikon SMZ645 microscope I looked at the hook points and discovered many irregularities on the hook point. Can you explain what these irregularities are? Thanks.....
Attached are pictures taken through the microscope....
No response and I doubt that I'll get one. It's been almost 2 weeks since I sent my question....
I'm not calling out Gamakatsu as I suspect the other manufacturers will probably have the same "non response"........
Crow Horse reply :
Photographing hooks under the microscope has been an interesting endevour. It highlights visually what I already knew but seeing them closely emphasizes an important fact. New hooks right out of the package are "sharp" but not nearly as sharp as they could or should be. I'll be spending more time sharpening my hooks and I firmly believe that it will be time well spent.......
If I come across any more hooks of interest, I'll snap some pics.......
RPreeb reply :
For a brand that seems to be often overlooked (or at least doesn't show up on this forum nearly as regularly as a few others), that Berkley looks pretty good.
Crow Horse reply :
On 2/25/2018 at 6:32 AM, RPreeb said:For a brand that seems to be often overlooked (or at least doesn't show up on this forum nearly as regularly as a few others), that Berkley looks pretty good.
I agree. I was really impressed with the finish. I haven't given it the thumbnail test but will shortly.
RPreeb reply :
Your photos made me curious, so I thought I'd have a go at it. Mine is taken with a Canon 60D with 100mm L IS macro lens, then processed and cropped in Adobe Lightroom. Light source is a handheld LED tac flashlight. This is a weighted Owner Twist Lock 4.0:
Crow Horse reply :
On 2/25/2018 at 6:53 AM, RPreeb said:Your photos made me curious, so I thought I'd have a go at it. Mine is taken with a Canon 60D with 100mm L IS macro lens, then processed and cropped in Adobe Lightroom. Light source is a handheld LED tac flashlight. This is a weighted Owner Twist Lock 4.0:
Awesome pic!!! Yours is a LOT clearer than the one's I took. Beautiful!!
RPreeb reply :
On 2/25/2018 at 7:08 AM, Crow Horse said:Awesome pic!!! Yours is a LOT clearer than the one's I took. Beautiful!!
I would never even have had the idea if you hadn't started it. When I get some time to mess around, I'll set up my tripod and do it right. I took 5 shots this time, and the one I posted is the only one that is in focus. I'm going to try some of my treble baits... poppers and jerks, etc.
The other thing that might be interesting is to examine some hooks before and after they've hooked a few fish, and see what damage that does.
Crow Horse reply :
On 1/24/2018 at 7:14 AM, Angry John said:Good stuff man. Are you taking requests??? Love a shot of an owner st-41 to compare to the trokars.
I just took a look at the Owner ST-41 treble online and it appears that it has their version of a "shovel cutting edge" similar to what the Razor Edge sharpener produces. Interesting......
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