If Bass Are Colorblind To Blue, Why Is There No High Vis Blue Line? 2024
TorqueConverter reply :
I'm trying Cajun Line Red Cast this season as a pitching line. It's a nice co-polymer with a red tint that offers increased visibility above the water over a low vis green color and looses it's red color becoming a low vis grey under the water. Cajun Line is a nice concept but misses the mark. It's too dark a red color making it far less visible for line watching as I'd like. The depth were the line will lose it's red color varies bases on depth, light and water clarity.
If bass do not have blue cones in their retina and are colorblind to blue, then wouldn't a light blue, translucent, line be ideal? It would allow for high visibility above the water for line watching yet be a translucent low vis grey to the fish at all times at any depth.
Jar11591 reply :
Berkley makes a hi-vis blue monofilament. I used it once accidentally, and it's very hi-vis and very blue.
Alonerankin2 reply :
I've been using a clear/blue fluorescent line for 30 years.... Lots and lots of big fish... Try P-line CX
Premium it's a co-poly... I like it from say 10 to 20 pound... Lighter than that breaks a little too easy for me... Sure makes line watching easier! Change pretty often...(line) and you're good to go!
MCS reply :
ohero braid
http://oherofishing.com/pages/adrena-line
Preytorien reply :
On 4/30/2014 at 5:06 PM, Alonerankin2 said:I've been using a clear/blue fluorescent line for 30 years.... Lots and lots of big fish... Try P-line CX
Premium it's a co-poly... I like it from say 10 to 20 pound... Lighter than that breaks a little too easy for me... Sure makes line watching easier! Change pretty often...(line) and you're good to go!
I agree with this. I have used CX Prem for several years now and it's pretty darn visible above water. I use 10lb on a 2500 size spinning reel and it works great. Just make sure to use KVD since it tends to spin up pretty easy.
WIGuide reply :
Both Stren an Berkley offer blue lines.
tritondriver reply :
mccoy also has a clear/blue..made in the USA..
Todd2 reply :
On 4/30/2014 at 8:34 PM, tritondriver said:mccoy also has a clear/blue..made in the USA..
This is all I use. 10 lb for spinning, 15 for baitcasters.
robster80 reply :
ive got some mccoy extra clear but wanting to give the clear blue fluorescent a shot. may pick some up.
roadwarrior reply :
What makes you think bass are colorblind?
http://www.bassresource.com/bass-fishing-forums/topic/75803-are-bass-color-blind/
mjseverson24 reply :
OP i dont think you are quite understanding how colors get filtered out by water, and what happens to them when they do... two of the most successful colors for bass fishing across the country are red and blue, especially a black and blue jig... to think that bass do not notice or see these colors seems kind of foolish... they do or will change to a certain shade of grey, but for the bass now that shade effectively is the color blue or the color red... if you are looking for a line that does offer superior invisibility then floro is the best option (and there is sound science to back it up) especially in moderately stained water to clear water... in dark water braid in what ever color will work just fine... if you want hi vis line that will make ine watching easier then go with whatever line you can see the best...
Mitch
frogflogger reply :
Sure caught a lot of bass on blue worms.
bflp3 reply :
I don't think OP means bass are color blind per say, but that they don't see blue very well, which is true. Even though blue light travels the furthest underwater, bass eyes can't detect blues and purples very well, due to their structure.
bigbill reply :
I been told when I asked why does the rapala f7 blue original floater work so good when it's blue? I was told that under certain conditions that blue turns to brown. Maybe the blue line does too?
Electric blue worms and senkos are hot here. When other colors don't work blue is my go to color.
Brian Needham reply :
who said bass are color blind to blue?
Catt reply :
According to the U.S. Navy the color blue can be seen at a deeper depth than any color...well atleast by humans.
baluga reply :
Power Pro S8S has blue braids.
Brian Needham reply :
On 5/1/2014 at 1:47 AM, Catt said:According to the U.S. Navy the color blue can be seen at a deeper depth than any color...well atleast by humans.
that is the color charts I have alwasy seen.
bigbill reply :
The basses eyes aren't like our eyes. There seeing different colors is limited.
If you read Dr. LOREN HILL experiments if it's still online the bass are limited as to what colors they can see at times. It's only a certain color or multiple colors.
Quote, Bill Dance if the bass could see all the colors all of the time there wouldn't be a minnow left in the body of water.
This makes me think the bass can't see the color of my crank at times but it can feel the vibration, hear the rattle and smell my bass scent. This is why I throw different colors in my ritual of baits.
WRB reply :
There is so much misinformation about how animals see colors, bass included.
Exactly how fish like bass see underwater is still not completely known, however the science and research is getting better. Ultra violet and infra red spectrums are beginning to be accepted colors that bass can see at very low light conditions.
The thought bass can't see blue or red is ridiculous.
Blue is very good soft plastic color, especially translucent blue neon. When bass go very deep in the winter, 50-75 feet, blue neon, cinnamon blue neon are very effective 3" reaper and 5" finesse worm colors. The human eye would need a spot light at 50' depth to see any color!
Black with blue flakes is a very popular night worm color combination followed by black with red flake. Again we need light at night to see any color, bass often have a preference for a specific color at night.
Tom
bflp3 reply :
Where did you see that bass can see ultra violet? According to the book "Knowing Bass", which is base on data from Berkeley's research center, bass see reds and greens the best, don't see blues very well, and have a lot of trouble seeing anything in higher frequencies.On 5/1/2014 at 3:35 AM, WRB said:There is so much misinformation about how animals see colors, bass included.
Exactly how fish like bass see underwater is still not completely known, however the science and research is getting better. Ultra violet and infra red spectrums are beginning to be accepted colors that bass can see at very low light conditions.
The thought bass can't see blue or red is ridiculous.
Blue is very good soft plastic color, especially translucent blue neon. When bass go very deep in the winter, 50-75 feet, blue neon, cinnamon blue neon are very effective 3" reaper and 5" finesse worm colors. The human eye would need a spot light at 50' depth to see any color!
Black with blue flakes is a very popular night worm color combination followed by black with red flake. Again we need light at night to see any color, bass often have a preference for a specific color at night.
Tom
I don't think a certain lure color working is any indication of the bass's ability to see it.
Brian Needham reply :
On 5/1/2014 at 7:08 AM, bflp3 said:I don't think a certain lure color working is any indication of the bass's ability to see it.
it is when you switch colors and they start eating it, IMO
we have all had days where color mattered
WRB reply :
When everything else is equal, profile, action, speed etc., etc., and a specific color is the only difference, color matters. Slight variation in soft plastics colors can make a big difference, some pros will buy up specific batches of worms believing that batch out fishes the current production.
A 3"reaper being split shot basically dead stick slow has very little action or profile however bass find it and target specific colors, if you don't the right color no strikes, right color game on in deep structured lakes with clear water.
UV lures, try web searching; Tightlines UV lures for example.
Keith Jones works for Berkley and his data is biased towards Berkley products. Good book but not the last word on bass vision.
Tom
TorqueConverter reply :
On 4/30/2014 at 9:30 PM, mjseverson24 said:OP i dont think you are quite understanding how colors get filtered out by water, and what happens to them when they do... two of the most successful colors for bass fishing across the country are red and blue, especially a black and blue jig... to think that bass do not notice or see these colors seems kind of foolish... they do or will change to a certain shade of grey, but for the bass now that shade effectively is the color blue or the color red... if you are looking for a line that does offer superior invisibility then floro is the best option (and there is sound science to back it up) especially in moderately stained water to clear water... in dark water braid in what ever color will work just fine... if you want hi vis line that will make ine watching easier then go with whatever line you can see the best...
Mitch
On 5/1/2014 at 12:07 AM, Brian Needham said:who said bass are color blind to blue?
This quote form Dr. Keith Jones in response to the ability of the bass to see UV. I have tendency to trust biology over beliefs when it come to bass sight.
The bass retina contains only two types of color cones: a red and a green. They do not possess a blue cone, and certainly not a UV cone. Moreover, assuming bass follow the pattern of other centrarchids, their ocular media (the fluid in their eyes) strongly absorb light with wavelengths shorter than 450 nm, meaning that very little UV light would ever reach their retina anyway. So, no, bass do not see UV light.
If bass do not have a blue cone in their retinas then they are certainly colorblind to blue.
bflp3 reply :
Well of course a company that sells UV lures is going to tell you how much bass love UV, that's the gimic they are trying to push.
You guys missed what I was trying to convey about color. I'm not saying color doesn't matter, I was trying to say just because a color is successful doesn't mean the bass can see that specific color. Perhaps they actively didn't like the colors you were previously using, or perhaps they liked the grey that the blue lure looked like.
Things with low success rates like fishing breed anecdotal based superstitions, its just human nature. I have no doubt that you guys have had great success with blue lures, I have myself as well. That doesn't negate that bass have limited blue vision.
mjseverson24 reply :
On 5/1/2014 at 9:14 AM, TorqueConverter said:This quote form Dr. Keith Jones in response to the ability of the bass to see UV. I have tendency to trust biology over beliefs when it come to bass sight.
The bass retina contains only two types of color cones: a red and a green. They do not possess a blue cone, and certainly not a UV cone. Moreover, assuming bass follow the pattern of other centrarchids, their ocular media (the fluid in their eyes) strongly absorb light with wavelengths shorter than 450 nm, meaning that very little UV light would ever reach their retina anyway. So, no, bass do not see UV light.
If bass do not have a blue cone in their retinas then they are certainly colorblind to blue.
I am not sure who Dr. Keith Jones is, but he is probably not as smart as he thinks he is... there is a huge flaw in his line of reasoning on this one... Bass have different eyes than humans, but they also have different brains. dr jones is assuming that there is only one way to perceive blue visually, and that is to have the exact same eye structure as humans... while we do "know" that the way humans have the ability to see different colors is through the rod and cone configurations in our eyes, to assume that there is only one type of eye structure that can detect certain colors is just stupid... the only thing we know is this---> We know the spectrum of colors that humans are able to see, because we can look at things and report what we see... Dr. Jones may in fact be correct with his statement, but the true answer should be we don't know for sure but we believe based on our limited understanding of this subject that bass can best see colors in this region, and have a very difficult time seeing the others... this statement leaves room to be incorrect, and any decent scientist does not make a statement of fact based on a theory, it is just that, a theory... I think the physical evidence that bass seem to prefer certain colors outside their so called spectrum under certain conditions, suggests that they can distinctly distinguish these colors, even if they do not see them the same way you or I do...
Mitch
Hooligan reply :
On 5/1/2014 at 9:14 AM, TorqueConverter said:This quote form Dr. Keith Jones in response to the ability of the bass to see UV. I have tendency to trust biology over beliefs when it come to bass sight.
The bass retina contains only two types of color cones: a red and a green. They do not possess a blue cone, and certainly not a UV cone. Moreover, assuming bass follow the pattern of other centrarchids, their ocular media (the fluid in their eyes) strongly absorb light with wavelengths shorter than 450 nm, meaning that very little UV light would ever reach their retina anyway. So, no, bass do not see UV light.
If bass do not have a blue cone in their retinas then they are certainly colorblind to blue.
Keith is a great guy, and extremely well thought of. He's every bit as smart as he thinks he is, by the weight he carries in fisheries biology and research.
Here's the catch, though. What he's saying is very true. Bass do not see true blues. They lack the blue receptors. They don't see UV because of the wavelength. What he went on to say in that paper, if it is the same one I think that you're referencing is that the reason blues and purples are so successful under a large variety of conditions is that they are primary offset colors. They change in hue under water and, as a result, have a tendency to be more recognizable in profile. They may not see the color on the whole, if you will, but they can see the large difference between the color of your blue jig and the surrounding water/cover. UV baits work in much the same fashion, as it is understood at this point. It isn't really the UV color, but the lack of continuity between the bait and surrounding area, creating a very visible profile. That's how Doc explained it to me when I asked the very question. It isn't so much that they're blind to it, but more the effect that it changes it to what is assumed to be a deep brown with great differentiation.
Quoting Bill Dance under any circumstance regarding color is pretty funny. His evidence is anecdotal at best, given he's been one of the most vociferous people I've ever heard in the industry preaching about how color has to be right. Considering that bass can well see baitfish, the reason they can't eat them all is a matter of cover and structure, not color...
TorqueConverter reply :
On 5/1/2014 at 1:08 PM, Hooligan said:Keith is a great guy, and extremely well thought of. He's every bit as smart as he thinks he is, by the weight he carries in fisheries biology and research.
Here's the catch, though. What he's saying is very true. Bass do not see true blues. They lack the blue receptors. They don't see UV because of the wavelength. What he went on to say in that paper, if it is the same one I think that you're referencing is that the reason blues and purples are so successful under a large variety of conditions is that they are primary offset colors. They change in hue under water and, as a result, have a tendency to be more recognizable in profile. They may not see the color on the whole, if you will, but they can see the large difference between the color of your blue jig and the surrounding water/cover. UV baits work in much the same fashion, as it is understood at this point. It isn't really the UV color, but the lack of continuity between the bait and surrounding area, creating a very visible profile. That's how Doc explained it to me when I asked the very question. It isn't so much that they're blind to it, but more the effect that it changes it to what is assumed to be a deep brown with great differentiation.
Quoting Bill Dance under any circumstance regarding color is pretty funny. His evidence is anecdotal at best, given he's been one of the most vociferous people I've ever heard in the industry preaching about how color has to be right. Considering that bass can well see baitfish, the reason they can't eat them all is a matter of cover and structure, not color...
I pulled that tidbit from an article about UV containing quotes from people on all sides of the UV argument. If you have the full paper from Dr. Jones, please share. I'd love to read it. It was the remark about the absence of blue cones in the quote that caught my attention.
You're a bit over my head at the moment, but does blues and purples (red + blue) having color changing properties mean that they are shades of grey or in the case of purple, shades of red mixed with shades of grey? "color changing properties" is a bit confusing as it implies blue turns to red or something. Also, I hear it being tossed around that bass see red better than humans. If true does this imply that the red receptors in the eyes are disproportionate in either size or quantity to the yellow receptors?
Neat stuff either way. IMO way to much of what we think bass are capable of are is based on anecdotal evidence collected in the field by lay persons. I'd like to see biology's take on the ability to see colors, precisely which colors and how much of each.
:EDIT: I just read the quote from Dr. Jones again. In the quote he clearly states a green receptor. Green is a product of yellow and blue. If the animal is colorblind to blue, then greens are shades of yellow. How can a green receptor exist and not a blue? I would think it would be impossible to see green without the ability to see both yellow and blue but then again, I'm not colorblind.
J Francho reply :
I'm colorblind blue. I still see blue as "blue." One eye is worse than the other. I just can't discriminate hue always, especially when it cones to teal or blue-green and turquoise. What this has to do with bass vision, I don't know. But I can still match my socks to my pants. Lol.
MarkH024 reply :
http://www.overstockbait.com/Power-Pro-Super-Slick-p/31100300150a.htm
^^^ If that's not hi-vis blue I don't know what is.
Either way, I've caught enough fish in ultra clear water with braid to know it's not a deal breaker. I absolutely believe in ultra clear water a smaller diameter/less visible line is or can be helpful but not a must. At the end of the day, if you plop a bait in front of a fish, it's going to zone in on that bait and decide if it wants to eat or not. Line color and visibility is on the bottom of the totem pole for importance when I fish as I find other factors to be much more important.
WRB reply :
Both Gene Gilliland and Keith Jones are well known biologist in the bass fishing community because they publish articles in Bassmaster and quoted a lot, this doesn't mean they are well respected with their peers.
We as bass anglers read what is published and take from it what fits our experience on the water.
Marlin were long thought to be color blind based on color receptors missing in their eye. Research by biologist discovered that marlin have good color vision confirming what anglers experience when using a wide variety of colors in lures. What Australian biologist discovered was marlin see what they described as blue shift allowing the predator to clearly distinguish a wide range of colors of baitfish the billfish feed on.
The primary colors; red, yellow, green make up the base the human eye and brain see as a color spectrum. Applying the same science to fish living and evolving underwater to human vision may lead to false assumptions.
Tom
*Hootie reply :
On 5/1/2014 at 7:42 PM, J Francho said:But I can still match my socks to my pants. Lol.
Me too but why do people laugh at me when I wear my Argyle pants.
Hootie
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