Daiwa Diehard Might Have To Make A Change 2024
jtesch reply :
As a Daiwa reel "diehard" I was really disappointed after reading the Tackle tour breakdown of the new Zillion. It's a Tatula with a different spool and some body work. Come on Daiwa your better than that. Might have to venture into Shimano land. Any thoughts out there???
Cgrinder reply :
You could try a Met and a Conquest. Below that I would just buy more OG Zillions.
fishballer06 reply :
Can't say I've used the new Zillion TWS, but the Metanium is truly one amazing reel.
tomustang reply :
Why stick with one brand anyway. Many options out there to just wait for one brand to come out a with a new product
bootytrain reply :
Reel brands are like women... I can't just commit to one. I just got my first Lews.
Alonerankin2 reply :
I dropped Daiwa in 08, not because they are bad reels, because the QC stank.. 40% of my brand new purchase's were defective.. I just got fed up with it, I use Shimano with great results, I still like Daiwa though, probably always will..
0119 reply :
Why would that make you change brands. They just now finally are doing what shimano has always done, but no one notices. A citica is a curado is a chronarch. Just a bearing count difference. Why abandon one brand for doing what all do.
kickerfish1 reply :
There are always the tried and true classic Daiwa reels. Pixies, TDZ, Steeze, Alphas, etc. Plenty of them to be found online still. You don't have to buy new Daiwa reels to keep yourself in the Daiwa camp. I fish mostly Daiwa and Shimano reels from years past to the present.
If you decide to switch to Shimano try a few reels first before going all in. I would fish them for a good while too.
a1712 reply :
On 3/25/2015 at 1:13 AM, Alonerankin2 said:I dropped Daiwa in 08, not because they are bad reels, because the QC stank.. 40% of my brand new purchase's were defective.. I just got fed up with it, I use Shimano with great results, I still like Daiwa though, probably always will..
That's about the same time frame I went through 3 new Diawa's in a weeks span, most not making it through the first day. I've had a hard time buying their products anymore. Really dissapointing to have $200-$300 reels go down after a few hour fishing. Brian.
Hogsticker reply :
Go Daiwa JDM!
bass1980 reply :
Every brand has their ups and downs. Shimano was on a downward path 4 years ago. The last 2 years and including this past few months Shimano is on fire. It's good that people are complaining about Daiwa. It'll only push them to make better product.
Fishes in trees reply :
If you want to buy some new reels, any justification you need to purchase them is ok by me. The difference between Diawa addicts and Shimano addicts is kind of like the difference between Lutherans and Methodists, i.e. there isn't a whole lot of difference and what difference there are are mostly cosmetic.
As a Shimano guy ( Most of my reels are Shimano, not ALL) I'd point out that you can't make a fair comparison by buying just one Shimano, you will need to purchase at least half a dozen for a fair comparison.
I'm glad I could help.
.ghoti. reply :
For several years people have been complaining about Daiwa releasing "just another Zillion variant". How many times have you read that online? Well, they responded. Just not like we all hoped.
What I really hoped was they would emulate Shimano, and break the barrier between JDM and USDM.
Hey Daiwa, start selling us the same stuff you sell in Japan. Are we not worthy?
Delaware Valley Tackle reply :
For you guys with defective Daiwas, what are you experiencing? I haven't seen any major influx in the shop. I'm curious.
bootytrain reply :
On 3/25/2015 at 2:00 AM, .ghoti. said:For several years people have been complaining about Daiwa releasing "just another Zillion variant". How many times have you read that online? Well, they responded. Just not like we all hoped.
What I really hoped was they would emulate Shimano, and break the barrier between JDM and USDM.
Hey Daiwa, start selling us the same stuff you sell in Japan. Are we not worthy?
They tried, the Z200(watered down version of the Z2020) failed. Not because it was a bad reel, but probably because they made the mistake of pricing it the same as the Calais DC. It should have been $450-500 tops. The Sol(US version of the Alphas) was axed a long time ago. Have no idea why. T3s are apparently gone but still available in Japan. Pixies have been axed across the board probably due to the SS Airs.
Jrob78 reply :
I've sold off all my non Daiwa/Shimano reels and now stick with the big 2. Both companies make great products and I love having both in my arsenal but I'm a Daiwa fan at heart.
jhoffman reply :
On 3/25/2015 at 2:13 AM, Delaware Valley Tackle said:For you guys with defective Daiwas, what are you experiencing? I haven't seen any major influx in the shop. I'm curious.
I broke the reel foot off a lexa on a hookset. I grenaded a mag brake system on another $100 daiwa. I think they make great upper priced reels but the lower price points are just not enough for the average guy. Most people cant swallow breaking a $100 reel in a couple weeks time.
rippin-lips reply :
You are the first I've ever heard that from. I had 2 Lexa's and 2 Exceler Exe's. All 4 have been sold off and are still in use. I fished them for over a year and pretty regularly at that. A call to Daiwa and they would have replaced them for you. Probably at no cost to except maybe shipping.
tomustang reply :
If they followed shimanos path I hope they don't add $100 to the price for their imported jdms!
SenkoGuru reply :
On 3/25/2015 at 1:33 AM, 119 said:Why would that make you change brands. They just now finally are doing what shimano has always done, but no one notices. A citica is a curado is a chronarch. Just a bearing count difference. Why abandon one brand for doing what all do.
100% correct
SenkoGuru reply :
On 3/25/2015 at 2:56 AM, jhoffman said:I broke the reel foot off a lexa on a hookset. I grenaded a mag brake system on another $100 daiwa. I think they make great upper priced reels but the lower price points are just not enough for the average guy. Most people cant swallow breaking a $100 reel in a couple weeks time.
This is the first I've heard of something like this too but all reel companies can have a defective reel from time to time. Daiwa has top tier CS though and they would have fixed that for you in a heart beat. Both Shimano and Diawa are top notch reels.
WRB reply :
Shimano hasn't made a design change for a very long time, the Core was the last and the best change, in low profile designs. Shimano recycled or morph reels from higher end to mid range with cosmetic changes.
Don't see everyone doing handsprings over the Curado 1 series.
Daiwa is all in with TW series technology and higher speed gear ratios, everyone is trying to catch up!
Change is a risk, can't make everyone happy.
If you try a Shimano, go with a Core MG7 series.
I use both Daiwa and Shimano and both have their strengths, very few weaknesses. Bought 3 Daiwa Tatula R 100XS about 18 months ago and haven't had any issues with them.
Tom
jhoffman reply :
You guys are absolutely right, I shouldve called when it happened, I chose not too for whatever reason. Likely because they werent super expensive reels. Most of these companies are good in CS if you call them. Honestly, its been a long time since ive had bad CS from any company. If you call them, tell them the truth usually problems get resolved reel (see what i did there) fast!
thehooligan reply :
Shimano & Daiwa both make great reels but they also let duds slip in here and there.
I try to keep a shimano only lineup but megabass and some older daiwa platforms always intrigue me.
I will agree though that the 2015 shimano lineup is on fire compared to daiwas offerings...
bootytrain reply :
Catch up? They've been passed awhile back lolOn 3/25/2015 at 4:09 AM, WRB said:Shimano hasn't made a design change for a very long time, the Core was the last and the best change, in low profile designs. Shimano recycled or morph reels from higher end to mid range with cosmetic changes.
Don't see everyone doing handsprings over the Curado 1 series.
Daiwa is all in with TW series technology and higher speed gear ratios, everyone is trying to catch up!
Change is a risk, can't make everyone happy.
If you try a Shimano, go with a Core MG7 series.
I use both Daiwa and Shimano and both have their strengths, very few weaknesses. Bought 3 Daiwa Tatula R 100XS about 18 months ago and haven't had any issues with them.
Tom
jtesch reply :
I think my problem with what they have done to the new Zillion is that Diawa has taken a true icon of a reel and turned it into an upgraded version of a lesser reel. I'm not saying the new Zillion is a bad reel or that the Tatula is a bad starting point. In my eyes the Zillion was the perfect top of the line '"every mans" reel. Expensive, but not crazy. Direct bloodlines to the Z. Sort of a jumping off point to the next level of enthusiast reels. I own reels from several other company's including the big S but Daiwa has always been my favorite. This feels so much like Shimanos blunder with their reels a few years ago. I may indeed have to go JDM Daiwa, Alphas SV or SS SV would be fun. I'm probably just getting older and more resistant to change but I think the Zillion deserves to be its "own" reel and not a " version" of another
FishTank reply :
I have the older zillion and it is good workhorse reel. I have had one issue and that is the breaks are inconsistent. They work sometimes but not others with no real reason as to why. I never have this issue with any of the shimano reels I have. When I saw the new zillion was coming out, I too saw the trend of re-masking a reel with the same design and calling it something else. My thought on this is, almost every reel company does this now. This trend happens a lot of things>computers, cars, cell phones, etc.
If you want to go over to shimano, it comes down to personal preference I guess. If I had to pick a reel to bring you over, it would be the Chronarch. I have nothing but good things to say about this line of reels. It casts well, smooth retrieve and tons of fish handling power.
jtesch reply :
Ok, I'm still not done on this. Right now the Daiwa US market go's from the Zillion TWS to the next level up being the Steez???? Unless I'm missing something. Chronarch--you win
jtesch reply :
I think another casualty of the new Zillion is the 100 Z Gigas spool. Tackle trap say they are no longer being made. A real blow too guys like me who tune Zillions and Fuegos
Jeff H reply :
On 3/25/2015 at 7:31 AM, jtesch said:I think another casualty of the new Zillion is the 100 Z Gigas spool. Tackle trap say they are no longer being made. A real blow too guys like me who tune Zillions and Fuegos
Oy! Really? I guess then I'm glad bought those last 2 when I did. But....the Fuego still functions VERY well with the stock spool and will always be a reel worth having!
And...for what it's worth I'd rather buy old TD-Z's and Fuego's than new Tatula's
SenkoGuru reply :
On 3/25/2015 at 6:37 AM, jtesch said:I think my problem with what they have done to the new Zillion is that Diawa has taken a true icon of a reel and turned it into an upgraded version of a lesser reel. I'm not saying the new Zillion is a bad reel or that the Tatula is a bad starting point. In my eyes the Zillion was the perfect top of the line '"every mans" reel. Expensive, but not crazy. Direct bloodlines to the Z. Sort of a jumping off point to the next level of enthusiast reels. I own reels from several other company's including the big S but Daiwa has always been my favorite. This feels so much like Shimanos blunder with their reels a few years ago. I may indeed have to go JDM Daiwa, Alphas SV or SS SV would be fun. I'm probably just getting older and more resistant to change but I think the Zillion deserves to be its "own" reel and not a " version" of another
I must say that I agree with this very much and I believe it to be well said but I'll also add I am a Daiwa fan.
jtesch reply :
. Oh, so would I and there seems to be a big supply of Z's from Japan on the Bay lately in the 100 range. Considering the spool runs $80 how can you loseOn 3/25/2015 at 9:51 AM, Jeff H said:Oy! Really? I guess then I'm glad bought those last 2 when I did. But....the Fuego still functions VERY well with the stock spool and will always be a reel worth having!
And...for what it's worth I'd rather buy old TD-Z's and Fuego's than new Tatula's
black94gt50 reply :
I don't see a problem with the new zillion being based on the tatula. I'd go as far as say the tatula is the best reel I've ever bought in the price range you can get them at. It's a strong reel with a great braking system. I Don't see a problem with a upgraded feel on the same platform as the tatula.
rippin-lips reply :
The argument is its not an upgrade at all. It's a Tatula with different cosmetics and a $200 price increase. I do agree with it being one heck of a reel for $85-100 though. Super solid buy!
Ozark_Basser reply :
On 3/25/2015 at 12:54 AM, bootytrain said:Reel brands are like women... I can't just commit to one. I just got my first Lews.
But isn't Lew a dude? Haha! Couldn't resist. I've only had one Lew's. It was pretty nice for the price. It was the $100 one they first came out with when they started making reels again. I haven't tried any newer models.
black94gt50 reply :
On 3/25/2015 at 11:36 AM, rippin-lips said:The argument is its not an upgrade at all. It's a Tatula with different cosmetics and a $200 price increase. I do agree with it being one heck of a reel for $85-100 though. Super solid buy!
Gotcha, didn't read the tackle tour review yet. Thought the zillion sounded good from tackle warehouse specs.
Well if the zillion is not an upgrade at all then, yea that a pricey tatula, lol
Hogsticker reply :
I think if Daiwa were to bring over the imports as Shimano did they would be on more equal playing fields. The Zillion is without doubt a bust, yet the Tatula is quite possibly the best poor man's reel ever produced. The Chronarch is a great reel, the Curado is so so. Besides that you have to pay to play. If Daiwa introduces a US version of the Alphas SV it should make a lot of folks happy.
jtesch reply :
The Tatula is without a doubt a great reel for the money. I just look back at a 20 year run that started with the Z , a true legendary reel that branched off to the Zillion and Fuego in the 100 size and the Steez in the 103/105 size and have to wonder what Daiwa was thinking
.ghoti. reply :
The reel missing from Daiwa's US lineup is the SS SV. I have one, and will no doubt have more. I'm with Jeff H; I'd rather have another Z or Fuego than a Tatula.
bass1980 reply :
I just think it's not Daiwa time to explode yet. When it was Shimano times they released the Antares, Metanium, chronarch ci4, curado i, and Aldebaran all within 2 years. All went to a newer frame design. It's like auto manufacturers. They seems to do a lineup change all together.
With Daiwa I believe in a year or 2 they will come out with something similar. However it seems like their current line up has too many gaps. If they want people to buy their JDM products from japan they're taking a huge loss due to the low Yen taking away sales from their USDM brand. Daiwa better hurry before Abu comes back with a Revo gen 4 lol.
Jrob78 reply :
On 3/25/2015 at 9:51 PM, .ghoti. said:The reel missing from Daiwa's US lineup is the SS SV. I have one, and will no doubt have more. I'm with Jeff H; I'd rather have another Z or Fuego than a Tatula.
I agree with you. The SS SV would fill a gap in the Daiwa US line up and give people a non TWS mid tier option.
jtesch reply :
Totally agree, I think the T3 Balistic and T3 1016 were meant to fill that void but failed
rawjuice reply :
Me personally, I dont stick with one brand, although it looks cool and all when you have all the same rods/reels lined up on your rack or boat, I am not a biased person and just go with what interests me at the time. But to each his own!
bass1980 reply :
On 3/26/2015 at 12:17 AM, jtesch said:Totally agree, I think the T3 Balistic and T3 1016 were meant to fill that void but failed
I'm still waiting for that Daiwa aluminum 3D braking reel, and No its not the Tatula. I just don't know why Daiwa won't take the beSt out of the T3 and leave the other junk out. I'll be all for a new steez with TWS and 3D!
reason162 reply :
It is rather disappointing that the Zillion is just a cosmetic upgrade from the Tatula, but my main gripe with the whole line is the T-Wing gimmick. I fish saltwater mainly and I like the big gears and power of the Tatulas...but the T Wing is just one too many moving parts to fail. The entire worm gear post has to turn, and after 1 season the thumb bar is already much stiffer to depress than it was when new. Drifting from a boat where you're constantly letting out/retrieving a few inches of line to keep bottom contact, can be extremely annoying to have a creaky thumb bar. Also, vertical jigging: when you reengage the reel from free spool to set the hook on a fish, the line doesn't necessarily settle in the groove of the T wing level wind right away, and often line will pop into the groove under tension...which I don't like one bit.
All this for a feature that as far as I can tell, is completely unnecessary on a 100-200 sized baitcaster with such a narrow spool to begin with.
J Francho reply :
I love the "moving parts" argument. It already moved!. All it does is twist backward when the spool is disengaged. I wonder if there were this many complaints when they moved from a lever on the frame to a thumbar? Or when they went to disengaging levelwinds - that extra idler gear will get you! Aside from some claims of worn out T-wing guides - of which not one picture of proof has been provided - they have the same track record as any other reels on the market. Some guys post negatively about them, others love them. As for the guts on the Daiwas...those are the same basic design on a cheap Procaster from 15 years ago to the last JDM Steez everyone loves. The newest reels vary only in the T-wing models. Think I'm kidding or exagerrating? open one up. Same goes for EVERY OTHER brand of reel. Much of the percieved quality has to do with frame components' material, fit and finish, and construction, as well as the gear set. There's huge differences in quality of frames, gears, and sideplates, but for the most part, the rest of the guts are the same old stuff.
bootytrain reply :
On 3/26/2015 at 2:04 AM, bass1980 said:I'm still waiting for that Daiwa aluminum 3D braking reel, and No its not the Tatula. I just don't know why Daiwa won't take the beSt out of the T3 and leave the other junk out. I'll be all for a new steez with TWS and 3D!
Z2020
Jeff H reply :
I don't necessarily dislike my Tatula's as mine worked great last season but, I'd just rather use/buy a Fuego or TD-Z. I prefer free floating spool design but I resent (now) having to pay $300 to have that. It is for that reason alone I won't own a TWS Zillion. I had thought I might get one at one point but then I realized I can get some really nice, used Daiwa reels for a lot less than that.
Jrob78 reply :
Don't forget you can get a 2015 Alphas to your door for $200. It would make sense for them to bring that reel over here too.
bass1980 reply :
Z2020 isn't for everyone and less applications. It's just too bulky and I believe it's discontinued as well. I don't know why they got rid of their best braking system. Did cost to much to make? Hard to believe that.
bootytrain reply :
On 3/26/2015 at 5:56 AM, bass1980 said:Z2020 isn't for everyone and less applications. It's just too bulky and I believe it's discontinued as well. I don't know why they got rid of their best braking system. Did cost to much to make? Hard to believe that.
Its still available in Japan. 3D should not be expensive to make as it wasn't really very complicated. Its just an adjustment to move the outer magnet ring closer or farther to the inductor.
reason162 reply :
On 3/26/2015 at 2:42 AM, J Francho said:I love the "moving parts" argument. It already moved!. All it does is twist backward when the spool is disengaged. I wonder if there were this many complaints when they moved from a lever on the frame to a thumbar? Or when they went to disengaging levelwinds - that extra idler gear will get you! Aside from some claims of worn out T-wing guides - of which not one picture of proof has been provided - they have the same track record as any other reels on the market. Some guys post negatively about them, others love them. As for the guts on the Daiwas...those are the same basic design on a cheap Procaster from 15 years ago to the last JDM Steez everyone loves. The newest reels vary only in the T-wing models. Think I'm kidding or exagerrating? open one up. Same goes for EVERY OTHER brand of reel. Much of the percieved quality has to do with frame components' material, fit and finish, and construction, as well as the gear set. There's huge differences in quality of frames, gears, and sideplates, but for the most part, the rest of the guts are the same old stuff.
The tone of your response points to an ongoing discourse re TWS I wasn't aware of. After spending some time on google and various other fishing forums, I am now better informed, so thank you. Just took out the spool on my Tatula R and looked at the back of the T wing: 2 grooves appear. After cleaning the area with rubbing alcohol on a qtip, they seem to be merely residue from new pp super slick, thank god. Fact remains that there is no discernible reason why the back of the T Wing needs to rub against the line upon retrieve. You said there's "not one picture of proof" on the TWS wearing out; if you're speaking of the grooving issue, there are dozens and dozens of examples provided in forums.
Anyway, I agree with the rest of your post, and I do think my Tatula R is a quality reel. I don't like the TWS for reasons already mentioned. I wish I can buy the reel w/o the TWS tbh.
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