Abu BlackMax3 Shallow lightweight spools. 2024
Iceni reply :
Hello people from over the pond!
I've currently got an Abu BlackMax3 on a Shimano Yasei 5-12g.
I've been casting a lot with soft plastics at about 5-8g (3/16 - 5/16) but I was wondering if I could lower that with some after-market parts. I have a feeling it's the spool weight that is limiting me as the rod is still loading and wanting to throw a lighter lure, The spool weight is resisting it. My brake and spool settings are 5 from min of 27 on the brakes, and the spool is set with just the side play removed - so very light.
There are - On some Chinese websites - Shallow, Lightweight (9g), spools for the MAX3 series of reels.
If I drop one into my reel and put in some nice bearings is it going to lower my cast weight?
The current spool is about 18g with bearing + 145 meters of braid.
The Chinese one is 9g with bearings + 50 meters of braid.
Has anyone actually tried and used one of these spools and did they work as intended? I'm not wanting to break the laws of physics, but it would be nice to cast a slightly lower weight like a 3g (1/8) un-weighted lure 25-30 feet.
Bass_Fishing_Socal reply :
Welcome to BR!
Yes you can with those shallow light weight spool. How low?, it is also depends on your rod rating and how light of your line.
WRB reply :
Black Max 3 reel is a lower end price @ $55 USD, changing to a light weight spool may not change the casting performance and be a waste of money IMO.
You maybe be better off with cleaning and using high performance oils.
Tom
kayaking_kev reply :
Depends on the rod a lot also, but yeah it will help on the reel side. I believe REEL TEST on youtube used the same spool on a Revo and did some test with it and really liked it, but he used a UL BFS rod I believe.
Iceni reply :
Great TYVM.
I should have said it's for UK canal fishing lol!
Distance is pretty much fixed because of that, You have 100% access down one side of the canal via a tow-path, so you are always casting less that 10 meters.
On 1/10/2020 at 2:16 PM, Bass_Fishing_Socal said:Yes you can with those shallow light weight spool. How low?, it is also depends on your rod rating and how light of your line.
Line here is pretty light, unless we fish for monsters 8-10lb is overkill. The only time that changes is if you fish snaggy rivers and you need to bully a fish out. Light gear isn't totally lost on me, but for baitcasting it is. A very light waggler/stick float with a 14ft waggler/trotting rod casting only a single maggot isn't uncommon here. You might only be adding 1AA (0.8g) to some of the lightest, You would probably fish with <2lb fluro hooklengths. That is pretty common to see for a river fisherman targeting Trout and Grayling, and on still-waters Roach, Rudd, and Tench.
On 1/10/2020 at 2:37 PM, WRB said:Black Max 3 reel is a lower end price @ $55 USD, changing to a light weight spool may not change the casting performance and be a waste of money IMO.
For the price of the spool $7 it's worth the gamble, I do plan on a better reel. I have been looking at the Scorpion DC 101, but that'll have to be imported. Unlike the USA we have an absolutely abysmal range of bait casting gear, and the chances of buying it from a local shop are almost none existent. If I wanted spinning gear, baitrunners or fly reels every shop has those!
On 1/10/2020 at 2:54 PM, kayaking_kev said:I believe REEL TEST on youtube used the same spool on a Revo and did some test with it and really liked it, but he used a UL BFS rod I believe.
I'll try dig through the reviews and find that. I have watched a lot of his video's.
Found not only the RevoX, but at 10 mins into the video he sticks it into a blackmax3!
Looks to do exactly what I want.
Bass_Fishing_Socal reply :
On 1/10/2020 at 7:03 PM, Iceni said:
Line here is pretty light, unless we fish for monsters 8-10lb is overkill. The only time that changes is if you fish snaggy rivers and you need to bully a fish out. Light gear isn't totally lost on me, but for baitcasting it is. A very light waggler/stick float with a 14ft waggler/trotting rod casting only a single maggot isn't uncommon here. You might only be adding 1AA (0.8g) to some of the lightest, You would probably fish with <2lb fluro hooklengths. That is pretty common to see for a river fisherman targeting Trout and Grayling, and on still-waters Roach, Rudd, and Tench.
10lb braid or 2lb mono is about right. If you get the rod that load at 3g lure, you can expect 30ft easily.
Lucky craft snacky with 8lb Sufix 832z
if you are looking for better reel that is still in production, I recommend Daiwa Alphas platform. In the light weight department magnetic brake is the way to go especially those Magfoece Z.
kayaking_kev reply :
Let me know if you try it, I was thinking about doing it for the pro max and hydro dipping it.
Iceni reply :
On 1/10/2020 at 9:47 PM, kayaking_kev said:Let me know if you try it, I was thinking about doing it for the pro max and hydro dipping it.
Already pulled the trigger 
Just need to wait now to see if it ships, then it's the long wait for the boat!
On 1/10/2020 at 9:17 PM, Bass_Fishing_Socal said:I recommend Daiwa Alphas platform
I'll have a look into them. I'm not going crazy on reel prices so if it's out there I'll be looking at something cheaper. If this low weight spool works I may well end up looking at what I can modify to fit my location and needs. I wasn't expecting there to be an actual review of one of those spools in action, And having seen it, if it works it might actually be enough for me.
I'm only targeting European Zander and Perch, and most of the work we do reflects the fact those fish are not huge. The average perch is a few oz to perhaps 1.5lb with an expectational fish been 2lb+ And Z's range from a few oz to about 8lb with an exceptional fish been a double, But Z's are poor fighters, having a lazy run, and doing more head-shaking than anything, Once they get the initial run done with they pretty much just pop up and roll about.
It's the pike that'll give me grief. Using lighter tackle for doubles isn't a problem. Playing a fish out even if it takes time is far more fun than just hauling it in
Bass_Fishing_Socal reply :
On 1/10/2020 at 10:00 PM, Iceni said:Already pulled the trigger
I'll have a look into them. I'm not going crazy on reel prices so if it's out there I'll be looking at something cheaper. If this low weight spool works I may well end up looking at what I can modify to fit my location and needs. I wasn't expecting there to be an actual review of one of those spools in action, And having seen it, if it works it might actually be enough
Good luck man, if you need more info head to TT forum for UltraLight Fishing. There are plenty of info there. I feel better when we are talking about other species than bass when using UltraLight. I use those target crappie and bluegill, even my equipment can handle any size bass just fine but I still prefer not to use it for bass.
new2BC4bass reply :
I love the Alphas platform and the Pixy. You can pick up a used Pixy at decent prices these days. 3g is very doable with them. A cheaper reel that probably can do it is the Tsurinoay from aliexpress. There are some video reviews of the reel.
10 meters? Are you sure you need a rod and reel? Cane pole should work fine. 
Iceni reply :
On 1/10/2020 at 10:51 PM, new2BC4bass said:10 meters? Are you sure you need a rod and reel? Cane pole should work fine.
Don't joke, my go to pond equipment is a pole 13.5M carp pole.
Fishing is a different animal out here. I've had many double figure carp on the pole.
You joke about the distance but the particular canal I'm targeting is actually 10m wide for 75miles!
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Oxford_Canal
J Francho reply :
For what you're fishing for, why isn't a spinning setup acceptable? It seems like you're trying to get water from a rock, extracting the kind of performance from gear that wasn't designed for this. Why not take the path of least resistance, and use gear more suited to ultralight fishing? Maybe @Tim Kelly has some insight, since he's on your side of the pond.
Iceni reply :
On 1/10/2020 at 11:31 PM, J Francho said:For what you're fishing for, why isn't a spinning setup acceptable?
Cast frequency and storage mainly.
Bait-casters are faster to cast, don't need the bail arm constantly flipping, And don't un-spool when you split a rod to store in the car. It's the un-spooling that's the issue, If you have to split the rod unless you can keep the line tight with a spinning reel you are limited. Yes you can line clip but that has it's own issues with light lines and damage. The bait-caster solves issue of a reel that can be stored and ready to go at the same time. All of my spinning reels are stored off rods in reel bags, with the line clipped in for very good reason.
I got my initial bait-casting set-up as a test.
Blackmax3, and a Shimano spinning rod. After a few outings the bait-casting reel proved to be worthwhile, It stores well, and casts well, so I got a better rod. Now I'm at that stage where I want to go a little lighter and dig into what a cheap reel can do. Once that's all done I'll move up to a big boy set-up
It would have been pointless to have jumped in with a £200 reel and £150 rod, to find it didn't do what I wanted. I did consider a closed face reel as well, but again it's the un-spooling that's the issue. A knock in storage and you have a birds nest and lost time.
The final goal is to be able to get an hours fishing in after work through the spring summer and autumn. I work next to the canal, so I wanted something that could actually live in the car.
J Francho reply :
I don't know. I use three piece centrepin rigs (11 to 15') for float fishing, with pretty light line, and I don't have any of the issues you outlined. I hook up to a hook keeper, break the rod down, and fold it to avoid damaging the line, and Velcro strap the pieces before putting it in a rod sock. The reel has it's own neoprene case. Pretty simple.
Have at it, I guess. It seems like way more trouble than it's worth.
Iceni reply :
On 1/11/2020 at 12:00 AM, J Francho said:I use three piece centrepin rigs (11 to 15') for float fishing
Nothing at all wrong with that, I have a lovley 2pcs 14ft float rod that would be a dream with a centrepin. Storing it in a small car for long periods probably wouldn't be very good for either the rod or reel.
Currently my storage system is a rod tube, with a square slot removed. It's about 1.2M long and stores the rod broken in 2, reel still on, lure and hooks still on. All I have to do is slide it out, and put the rod back together and I can fish.
Your system sounds pretty good, you probably have a decent sized car. Or don't worry about it been seen. I live in a city centre, so I have to keep it in a tiny boot in a European hatchback!
https://parkers-images.bauersecure.com/gallery-image/pagefiles/200411/boot-load-space/1752x1168/dsc05150.jpg
Tim Kelly reply :
You can use baitcasting gear if you like for canals. I have spent time and money getting equipped to do it and enjoy it, but it's an affectation, there's no real practical reason to do it. Yes, you can make the next cast quicker and there's a nice flow to it, but unless you're going to spend enough money to do it well it's going to be a struggle and much less versatile than a spinning outfit. With spinning gear you can get away with throwing things much lighter than the ideal casting weight, but BFS casting gear tends to have quite tight weight ranges where it performs well, so you have a slightly more restricted range of presentations you can try. Often on canals you have to downsize appreciably to get bites when it's tough, which can make it awkward it you only have your BFS rod.
I don't really understand the broken down rod thing. I've never noticed it make any difference whether it's spinning or casting
new2BC4bass reply :
On 1/11/2020 at 12:22 AM, Iceni said:Nothing at all wrong with that, I have a lovley 2pcs 14ft float rod that would be a dream with a centrepin. Storing it in a small car for long periods probably wouldn't be very good for either the rod or reel.
Currently my storage system is a rod tube, with a square slot removed. It's about 1.2M long and stores the rod broken in 2, reel still on, lure and hooks still on. All I have to do is slide it out, and put the rod back together and I can fish.
Your system sounds pretty good, you probably have a decent sized car. Or don't worry about it been seen. I live in a city centre, so I have to keep it in a tiny boot in a European hatchback!
https://parkers-images.bauersecure.com/gallery-image/pagefiles/200411/boot-load-space/1752x1168/dsc05150.jpg
Excellent picture with sharp focus and a very good depth of field.
garroyo130 reply :
On 1/10/2020 at 2:37 PM, WRB said:You maybe be better off with cleaning and using high performance oils.
Definitely agree here. Due to budget restrictions I used a graphite framed reel for a while and found that the limiting factor was the fact that the spool lips rode on graphite. What I found made the most difference in increasing casting distance was a good cleaning, flushing of the spool bearings and oiling with TSI321, and polishing (removing paint more) of the graphite frame with a polishing bit on a Dremel.
Tolerances will ultimately prove to be a limiting factor in what you can do with the reel.
Iceni reply :
On 1/11/2020 at 1:29 AM, garroyo130 said:Definitely agree here. Due to budget restrictions I used a graphite framed reel for a while and found that the limiting factor was the fact that the spool lips rode on graphite. What I found made the most difference in increasing casting distance was a good cleaning, flushing of the spool bearings and oiling with TSI321, and polishing (removing paint more) of the graphite frame with a polishing bit on a Dremel.
Tolerances will ultimately prove to be a limiting factor in what you can do with the reel.
I'll have a look at that, I don't think the spool is binding anywhere. I'll see if I have a dab of engineers blue in the shed and just touch the spool lips with it. Should know in a few turns if we have an issue with binding. It certainly doesn't feel like it when you move the spool about but that doesn't mean it's not pulling forwards in the bearing seats on the cast.
I've got a decent proxxon rotary tool so if there is a problem retouching won't be an issue.
I've gone and ordered the correct hybrid bearings as well for the spool. Got 2 sets for both the original and the new spool.
On 1/11/2020 at 12:28 AM, Tim Kelly said:You can use baitcasting gear if you like for canals. I have spent time and money getting equipped to do it and enjoy it, but it's an affectation, there's no real practical reason to do it. Yes, you can make the next cast quicker and there's a nice flow to it, but unless you're going to spend enough money to do it well it's going to be a struggle and much less versatile than a spinning outfit. With spinning gear you can get away with throwing things much lighter than the ideal casting weight, but BFS casting gear tends to have quite tight weight ranges where it performs well, so you have a slightly more restricted range of presentations you can try. Often on canals you have to downsize appreciably to get bites when it's tough, which can make it awkward it you only have your BFS rod.
I've always been a little tackle shy when it come to spending money! I'm more than happy to compromise if I still get fish. I full understand what you mean about the investment and that low end reels/rods can be more frustration than it's worth. I actually have faith in the little Blackmax3.
I'm not struggling to using it, I can cast perfectly fine without backlashes and the rod is more than I need. I'm in no way a competition angler. I did that for a few years and it got out of hand very quickly with gear.
I'm not stood on the tow-path picking out wind knots and backlashes. You shouldn't worry if you think the tackle is holding me back, it isn't, I just want to see how far I can push it before I actually need to spend big money.
On 1/11/2020 at 12:28 AM, Tim Kelly said:I don't really understand the broken down rod thing. I've never noticed it make any difference whether it's spinning or casting
I can guarantee if a bail arm can be opened, it'll happen in the boot of my car. Kids and a wife make sure things in there get disturbed. I'm happy with my own reasons for going with the bait-caster setup, so you don't need to question it.
Tim Kelly reply :
On 1/11/2020 at 2:03 AM, Iceni said:I'll have a look at that, I don't think the spool is binding anywhere. I'll see if I have a dab of engineers blue in the shed and just touch the spool lips with it. Should know in a few turns if we have an issue with binding. It certainly doesn't feel like it when you move the spool about but that doesn't mean it's not pulling forwards in the bearing seats on the cast.
I've got a decent proxxon rotary tool so if there is a problem retouching won't be an issue.
I've gone and ordered the correct hybrid bearings as well for the spool. Got 2 sets for both the original and the new spool.
I've always been a little tackle shy when it come to spending money! I'm more than happy to compromise if I still get fish. I full understand what you mean about the investment and that low end reels/rods can be more frustration than it's worth. I actually have faith in the little Blackmax3.
I'm not struggling to using it, I can cast perfectly fine without backlashes and the rod is more than I need. I'm in no way a competition angler. I did that for a few years and it got out of hand very quickly with gear.
I'm not stood on the tow-path picking out wind knots and backlashes. You shouldn't worry if you think the tackle is holding me back, it isn't, I just want to see how far I can push it before I actually need to spend big money.
I can guarantee if a bail arm can be opened, it'll happen in the boot of my car. Kids and a wife make sure things in there get disturbed. I'm happy with my own reasons for going with the bait-caster setup, so you don't need to question it.
Pretty sure they'll manage to trip the thumb bar release on a baitcaster just as easily.
Iceni reply :
On 1/11/2020 at 2:08 AM, Tim Kelly said:Pretty sure they'll manage to trip the thumb bar release on a baitcaster just as easily.
Probably, It never ceases to amaze me what damage SWMBO can do when she's on one!
Tim Kelly reply :
Bless 'em. ????
It depends how light you want to cast how easy it is. Down to 3/16 is not at all difficult, below 1/8 you need to start really specialising. A Rays spool in a tatula will do very well down to 3/16 for very little money.
Iceni reply :
On 1/11/2020 at 2:15 AM, Tim Kelly said:It depends how light you want to cast how easy it is. Down to 3/16 is not at all difficult, below 1/8 you need to start really specialising. A Rays spool in a tatula will do very well down to 3/16 for very little money.
I think 3g will be as low as I feel I need to go.
I can run the Kopyto 1" shads on a 2g jig head and still be about 3g with a snap swivel. AGM have me covered there.
1" should be about as small as I need to go, Perch are greedy and I'm not targeting trout.
Most of my fishing has been done with 2-4" shads and grubs. And I recently picked up some of the Missile Baits Ned bombs, Those have been doing well on a 2g mushroom but I would like to lower that to make them a touch more floaty on the drop.
That's the main reason for wanting a little lighter cast weight btw, I've been getting hit on the drop a fair bit, and figured slowing the fall and actually working that part of the cast better might lead to more fish overall.
Tim Kelly reply :
Putting a skirt on the bait, or a bait with more appendages slows the drop too, with the same weight head. Sometimes it's the speed of fall that the fish key in on though, so falling slower may not improve things. All fun stuff to experiment with though.
WRB reply :
Easy to remedy keeping the line rigged on the rod, taking the rod part and storing in a compact car. The problem with the spinning reel bail opening spilling line is resolved by using a C shape clip on the spooled line availble for most reels or simply use a rubber band.
The issue using a low end Chinese made Black Max reel is the quality of the gears, bearing and manufacturing tolerances. You can put race horse saddle on plow horse and it's still a plow horse. Remember rods cast lures reel hold line.
Decades back with Ambassador reels we used tooth paste to pack gears and run then smooth using a drill motor to spin the hande polishing the gears and main shaft bearing, clean with acetone and lightly lubricate the shaft bearing with BreakFree oil and gear Garcia grease.
The legacy (pre 2000) ABU 2500C made in Sweden can be tuned to cast 1/8 oz lure 30 yards with ease using a moderate fast medium power rod. Today it's easier to tune reels but at the end of the day a Black Max is still a Black Max made in China.
Tim Kelly is a BR member in UK, good contact. Tackle Warehouse may ship to UK?
Tom
Iceni reply :
On 1/11/2020 at 2:51 AM, Tim Kelly said:Putting a skirt on the bait, or a bait with more appendages slows the drop too, with the same weight head. Sometimes it's the speed of fall that the fish key in on though, so falling slower may not improve things. All fun stuff to experiment with though.
I'd actually considered some of the closed cell foam fly material. Cut into strips and passed through the baits, then tied back with a bit of mackerel elastic. I figured the bait size increase wouldn't be beneficial but have yet to play about with it.
It might be I can do something just with the just foam and fly tie a 3g jig head. Perhaps adding a few strands of thin holographic ribbon.
I need to get the reel singing or in the bin first tho
Bass_Fishing_Socal reply :
To slow down the fall you will need to find plastic that float, paddle tail type, or bulk body. I’m not sure what you have there, Zman SwimZ 2.5” (cut to 2”), trout slayer craw also help a lot slowing down and Charlie brewer slider is float and have paddle tail. I also add trout worm (float) to some of my tube.
Iceni reply :
I have a pack of brewers slider grubs 1.5" but they don't float. Tested them without weight in a bucket. I actually tested all my lures to see if any of them are floating. It's why I ended up with the Missile Baits Ned bombs (because none of them did).
The Ned bomb also had a little tail that I thought would do more in the water than the standard TRD stick.
The Z-man stuff is available so I'll have a look at building a lure collection with that brand in the future. It was one of the recommended brands on the UK lure forum. I only posted this on here because I knew if any forum was going to know about these spools it would be this one!
BaitFinesse reply :
On 1/10/2020 at 9:42 AM, Iceni said:Hello people from over the pond!
I've currently got an Abu BlackMax3 on a Shimano Yasei 5-12g.
I've been casting a lot with soft plastics at about 5-8g (3/16 - 5/16) but I was wondering if I could lower that with some after-market parts. I have a feeling it's the spool weight that is limiting me as the rod is still loading and wanting to throw a lighter lure, The spool weight is resisting it. My brake and spool settings are 5 from min of 27 on the brakes, and the spool is set with just the side play removed - so very light.
There are - On some Chinese websites - Shallow, Lightweight (9g), spools for the MAX3 series of reels.
If I drop one into my reel and put in some nice bearings is it going to lower my cast weight?
The current spool is about 18g with bearing + 145 meters of braid.
The Chinese one is 9g with bearings + 50 meters of braid.
Has anyone actually tried and used one of these spools and did they work as intended? I'm not wanting to break the laws of physics, but it would be nice to cast a slightly lower weight like a 3g (1/8) un-weighted lure 25-30 feet.
Yes. I have one in a BM3 with Ray's Studio DIY micro ceramic bearings. I have it on a Kuying Teton 662L which is basically an UL and it can cast lighter weights than the rod can load. I've cast as light as 1/32 oz beetle spin without the spin portion. The reel handled it like a champ. Stock bearings on both the spool and BM3 are pretty gummed up stock and do not free spin. A flush of stock bearings at the minimum is needed. Replacing them is best.
On 1/11/2020 at 12:00 AM, J Francho said:I don't know. I use three piece centrepin rigs (11 to 15') for float fishing, with pretty light line, and I don't have any of the issues you outlined. I hook up to a hook keeper, break the rod down, and fold it to avoid damaging the line, and Velcro strap the pieces before putting it in a rod sock. The reel has it's own neoprene case. Pretty simple.
Have at it, I guess. It seems like way more trouble than it's worth.
Spinning reels present their own share of problem. #1 being line twist. UL capable baitcast reels are thing now and exist at all price points including dirt cheap. I've used a number of them and they are WAY less hassle than having to deal with a cheap spinning reel.
BaitFinesse reply :
The stock drag on my BM3 is also really sticky. I use 10# Nanofil but there it now way I would trust that drag to a 4# mono. Removing and lapping the drag disk may solve the issue. Something to consider.
Also take line capacity and the baits you intent to throw into consideration. The real shallow BFS spools are meant for UL baits. The spool in my BM3 for example will cast all the 10# Nanofil off it with a 1/8 oz beetle spin. I use no backer with the line taped to the spool. It will cast that to the tape. For 1/8 oz total weight I would prefer the deeper Long Cast Ray's Studio DIY spools for Tatula/Fuego or a used Pixy.
Iceni reply :
I'd probably only consider lapping internal parts when I finally get an upgrade reel.
Lapping isn't out of the question. I already own a selection of lapping plates and diamond pastes from 5 micron to 0.25 micron (my other hobby is straight razors). That will require a lot of other research when the time comes, and I know it has a very good chance of killing the reel if done incorrectly.
For the minute the drag is pretty good. I've not used heavy line or had the drag wound on - preferring a thumb lift wind rather than just letting the reel do the work.
I could run the spool bearings a little with pure silicone oil and a felt cone on the rotary tool. New bearings CB ABEC7 have been ordered and I got enough for both spools so I probably won't be doing this. At $7 a set I didn't think it was worth messing about with the stock ones.
NOC 1 reply :
As you see, there are quite a few people who just don't see finesse baitcasting as being worth while. Their advise is always the same...don't do it, just use the spinning gear. Perhaps that is good advise in some ways, but I would listen to the folks who didn't take that advise and instead use finesse baitcasting all the time if you have already decided to do it.
In my case I just don't like the hassle of throwing the bail all the time so regardless of how others feel about that, I prefer throwing light stuff with a bait-caster. That said, The lightweight spool will make a huge improvement over an 18 gm spool weighed down with 145 m of line.
It doesn't matter if you have a cheap reel with rough gears etc. You do not use anything on the reel except the spool and bearings once you cast. If your stock spool doesn't have issues like spool flanges rubbing and etc. neither will the lighter spool.
I have a gaggle of Daiwa PX 68-R reels that I run the light spools on. Some of them have $100+ specialty spools and one has a Ray's studio Chinese spool. They all perform about the same and I would expect that your Black Max will perform similarly. At that point any issue you have will probably be because your rod won't load such lightweight baits, but I'd bet that with the new spool your rig will be able to cast 3gm baits the 10 meter that you require on the rod you have.
If at some point you feel the need for some fancy new gear, In my opinion the best bait-casters being made for finesse fishing are the Shimano Aldebaran 50, Daiwa SS Air ( rated for throwing 1.5 gm out of the box) Daiwa Alpha Air, or Daiwa SS Air Stream and Alpha Air Stream, the Stream models designed for throwing trout weight baits. There may be other Shimano reels as well, but I am a Daiwa guy, so I know those best.
Tim Kelly reply :
I tend to agree, though there's a big difference between being able to cast a light lure and being able to cast it accurately. Years ago I had a stock morrum which I could cast light lures with and thought I was doing OK until I bought an Avail spool for it and realized the huge difference it makes being able to easily cast a bait accurately.
NOC 1 reply :
On 1/12/2020 at 1:57 AM, Tim Kelly said:I tend to agree, though there's a big difference between being able to cast a light lure and being able to cast it accurately. Years ago I had a stock morrum which I could cast light lures with and thought I was doing OK until I bought an Avail spool for it and realized the huge difference it makes being able to easily cast a bait accurately.
Avail makes a great spool IMO. Most of the aftermarket spools I have are ZPI and they too make a nice reel significanlty nicer.
I agree 100% that the quality of the cast is just as important.
I often have guys telling me that their Curado K or Tatula can cast light lures just as well as is needed and that my custom spooled PX68's are a waste of money. Only someone lacking experience with proper finesse bait-casters would say such a thing.
Bass_Fishing_Socal reply :
On 1/12/2020 at 1:41 AM, NOC 1 said:As you see, there are quite a few people who just don't see finesse baitcasting as being worth while. Their advise is always the same...don't do it, just use the spinning gear. Perhaps that is good advise in some ways, but I would listen to the folks who didn't take that advise and instead use finesse baitcasting all the time if you have already decided to do it.
In my case I just don't like the hassle of throwing the bail all the time so regardless of how others feel about that, I prefer throwing light stuff with a bait-caster. That said, The lightweight spool will make a huge improvement over an 18 gm spool weighed down with 145 m of line.
It doesn't matter if you have a cheap reel with rough gears etc. You do not use anything on the reel except the spool and bearings once you cast. If your stock spool doesn't have issues like spool flanges rubbing and etc. neither will the lighter spool.
I have a gaggle of Daiwa PX 68-R reels that I run the light spools on. Some of them have $100+ specialty spools and one has a Ray's studio Chinese spool. They all perform about the same and I would expect that your Black Max will perform similarly. At that point any issue you have will probably be because your rod won't load such lightweight baits, but I'd bet that with the new spool your rig will be able to cast 3gm baits the 10 meter that you require on the rod you have.
If at some point you feel the need for some fancy new gear, In my opinion the best bait-casters being made for finesse fishing are the Shimano Aldebaran 50, Daiwa SS Air ( rated for throwing 1.5 gm out of the box) Daiwa Alpha Air, or Daiwa SS Air Stream and Alpha Air Stream, the Stream models designed for throwing trout weight baits. There may be other Shimano reels as well, but I am a Daiwa guy, so I know those best.
Thank you, but this is a “BASS” forum after all. Not all ppl have opened mind like at TT.
WRB reply :
I have owned and used bait casting reels over 60 years and the easiest to cast light weight lures was my 2nd reel Ibought in 1955; Langley Target 340 with 10 lb Ashaway braid line on a Connolin tubular 5'6" glass rod. The 340 was a very early free spool reel without a level wind, drilled light weight aluminum that held 50 yards .010D line.
I could cast a baby Bass Oreno (1/8 oz) 50 yards.
The right reel on the right rod casting accurately is easy with practice.
My average cast with 7/16 jig over the last 30 years is 40 yards accurately within about 1'.
I would tune the reel by cleaning and proper adjustments before putting any money in Black Max.
Tom
BaitFinesse reply :
On 1/12/2020 at 3:17 AM, WRB said:I have owned and used bait casting reels over 60 years and the easiest to cast light weight lures was my 2nd reel Ibought in 1955; Langley Target 340 with 10 lb Ashaway braid line on a Connolin tubular 5'6" glass rod. The 340 was a very early free spool reel without a level wind, drilled light weight aluminum that held 50 yards .010D line.
I could cast a baby Bass Oreno (1/8 oz) 50 yards.
The right reel on the right rod casting accurately is easy with practice.
My average cast with 7/16 jig over the last 30 years is 40 yards accurately within about 1'.
I would tune the reel by cleaning and proper adjustments before putting any money in Black Max.
Tom
I may have to pick one of those up as a wall hangar. Sounds neat.
NOC 1 reply :
On 1/12/2020 at 2:42 AM, Bass_Fishing_Socal said:Thank you, but this is a “BASS” forum after all. Not all ppl have opened mind like at TT.
Hmm..I've caught many LMB on flies..does that count?
Bass_Fishing_Socal reply :
I really wanna here those who claim spinning cast light lure better to confirm the distance. Today I went out with both spinning and casting. Both rod are about the length power and action, and I can confirm my casting can cast 1/8oz tiny trap as far as spinning and some even further. Now ppl will say you will have to use light line. Yes I have 4 lb Fins windtamer on my spinning but 10lb superslick on my casting, go figures.
I might not good at side arm casting on spinning so accuracy is casting win hand down.
fishwizzard reply :
Using the same line and comparable rods I can absolutely cast a drop shot rig further on a casting combo vs a spinning one.
But with a Ned or other “small jighead/plastic” presentations a spinning combo gives me better distance most of the time.
Bass_Fishing_Socal reply :
On 1/17/2020 at 11:17 PM, fishwizzard said:Using the same line and comparable rods I can absolutely cast a drop shot rig further on a casting combo vs a spinning one.
But with a Ned or other “small jighead/plastic” presentations a spinning combo gives me better distance most of the time.
Are we talking the same power/action and length rod in my case L 6’6 and L6’7? reel legalis LT1000 VS daiwa alphas with shallow spoon.
fishwizzard reply :
On 1/17/2020 at 11:40 PM, Bass_Fishing_Socal said:Are we talking the same power/action and length rod in my case L 6’6 and L6’7? reel legalis LT1000 VS daiwa alphas with shallow spoon.
For the DS it was a 6'11' M/F spinning vs a 6'7" ML/XF casting, both MB rods with the same rating. The spinning reel is a 2500 Ci4+ and the casting an Alphas Finesse Custom. Both 7lb Sniper.
The Ned rig tests are less equal, but none my lighter BFS rods cast as freely as my finesse spinning rods with sub 1/4oz presentations.
Iceni reply :
All the parts have arrived.
Spool has dropped into the body with absolutely no issues, New bearings are in. And it's a totally different reel. It feels 100% faster and the spool just spins for ages!
I'll know more on Saturday when I get to thrown a few lures but for the minute I think I have a winner.
Bass_Fishing_Socal reply :
Take it easy on a few first cast, you cannot just whip it like you used to. Set brake pretty high and come down once you get a hang of it(I have my about half on pixy) don’t use too light of a lure or too heavy, shallow spool doesn’t like heavy lure.
redmeansdistortion reply :
On 1/11/2020 at 12:22 AM, Iceni said:I live in a city centre, so I have to keep it in a tiny boot in a European hatchback!
I feel your pain. I drive a Fiesta ST, but I can fit my 9'6", 10'6", and 11' steelhead rods in the back when I fold the back seats down. They're all 2 piece for what it's worth. Not many subcompacts in these parts. I'm often the smallest car on the road where I live.
BaitFinesse reply :
On 1/25/2020 at 2:23 AM, redmeansdistortion said:I feel your pain. I drive a Fiesta ST, but I can fit my 9'6", 10'6", and 11' steelhead rods in the back when I fold the back seats down. They're all 2 piece for what it's worth. Not many subcompacts in these parts. I'm often the smallest car on the road where I live.
I want a Fiesta ST so bad and I live in the midwest and drive flat open roads. I can't even appreciate one properly but I want it.
Iceni reply :
Right just got back from a couple of hours casting.
Well I don't think casting weight is an issue any more!
Put on a size 4 2g jig head and a relax kopyto 1" (0.8g). No snaps or swivels. So 2.8g total weight. Just a hair over 3/32, using cheap 6 strand Rovex Viros braid (10lb 0.16)
First cast with the brakes on half way it landed on the far bank -- 15m ish.
Spent the next few hours dialling it in. The reel casts fantastically and I reckon I can go even lower on the cast weight without a problem! It suffers from some backlash if the brakes go much lower than 1/3 on, So I think I have a fair bit of overhead to play with for going lower.
Casting down the canal I was getting about 20m distance on a mid powered cast without any problems at all, 25m needed significantly more force and was backlashing about 1 in 4 casts.
Edit: those distances are incorrect! Just measured on google maps. What I thought was 20m is actually 30m (100ft), and the longer backlashing casts were almost at 40m (130ft).
The parts I've used all came off Aliexpress. And all fitted perfectly together with the BMAX3.
The spool is branded "Billings ABU BMAX3" and came with an aluminium spool case.
The bearings were supplied by "GCH bearings".
Bass_Fishing_Socal reply :
Congrats.
wow 130’ that more than 40 yds, I can’t even do that with my Alphas Air I might have to look into Abu.
Iceni reply :
On 1/26/2020 at 1:40 AM, Bass_Fishing_Socal said:wow 130’ that more than 40 yds, I can’t even do that with my Alphas Air I might have to look into Abu.
To get it that distance the chuck wasn't pretty. Full shoulder arm rotation, at full arm extension. Absolutely no control, and quite a loopy trajectory. It's not a fish-able distance for the set-up. 25-30m was pretty comfortable and I could throw that distance for a few hours without an issue.
The 10m I actually wanted is very very easy. Absolutely no effort. I did have to add some spool tension to control those casts as it was running away on touchdown.
I did change 3 bearings not the standard 2. That might be having an effect.
Spool tension bearing, Mag brake bearing, Spool bearing. All with dry hybrid ceramics.
The "The Reel Test" video he's chucking those distances with only 1 bearing swapped and the spool.
BaitFinesse reply :
I run mine with no spool tension and just stop the spool on splash down with my thumb. I am usually a little under half on the mag dial.
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