AAARRGG! Connection knot! 2024

5/0 reply :

I’ve be practicing the Alberto knot every day. I got so I could tie it decently and it had a pretty low profile.

So I tie a leader of 12# Yozuri Hybrid to 30# PP and went out to practice casting. The knot was clanging the rod guides so much that at first I thought it was my reel making the noise. It was also sticking in the guides causing backlash. The knot was placed between my reel and the first guide when the bait was held at reel level.

So I shortened the leader to about four feet. The knot then stuck at the last guide when I tried to let out some line to practice pitching.

What the hell am I doing wrong! I’m so mad I could smoke a pickle!

Darren. reply :

Does your rod have micro guides?

And YZH at #12 is a decent diameter (i.e., large), so could be

adding to the issue.

Try Shin's knot, it's a bit smaller profile. And get ready for the

FG boys to chime in...

Khoa Vu reply :

I myself also prefer the Shin's Lazy Alberto knot over both Albright and Alberto knots. Micro guides will definitely hinder the ability for the knot to pass through properly. Another thing is how you cut the tag end off. Try cutting the tag end of mono/flouro at an angle so it "slides" through the guide. If you cut it square, the edge of the line will catch more often than not.

5/0 reply :

It’s an old bait casting rod, G Loomis MBR 784. The Alberto was tied with 7 wraps up and 7 back.

I even put a dab of super glue on the knot ends.

waymont reply :

On 8/1/2019 at 5:31 AM, 5/0 said:

It’s an old bait casting rod, G Loomis MBR 784. The Alberto was tied with 7 wraps up and 7 back.

I even put a dab of super glue on the knot ends.

Was your superglue dab big enough to make a little clump? Could have been that causing your issue.

I'm an FG knot guy chiming in. haha

Jig Man reply :

When you put the super glue on lick your finger and thumb to wet them then roll the glued knot between them. That will make it smaller.

5/0 reply :

Does the Shinn knot end the same as Alberto with braid coming out the loop in the same direction?

Are 10 wraps enough for bait casting?

hwright38 reply :

Make sure you're cutting your leader tag end very short. I you leave too much out it will catch like crazy. Tackle Advisors has a good video showing how you can cut it pretty much as short as your cutters will allow.

SmugOne reply :

I’ve never had an issue even with larger diameter line. I do 10 wraps and cut the tag ends as close as possible, and I don’t use super glue. I do not have any micro guides on any of my rods either though.

Shin’s knot looks pretty good. Can anyone with experience with it speak to the pros and cons? Very curious to know if the knot strength is comparable to the Alberto.

BassWhole! reply :

No glue, and clip the leader tag flush with the braid wraps.

FishingGeekTX reply :

Why use a leader for freshwater fishing, is it for pike for pike or something?

Do you often hang lures so bad you have to cut long lines? If not, I wouldn't mess with a leader. Even if I did, I'm not sure I'd mess with a leader.

Darren. reply :

On 8/1/2019 at 9:02 AM, SmugOne said:

Shin’s knot looks pretty good. Can anyone with experience with it speak to the pros and cons? Very curious to know if the knot strength is comparable to the Alberto.

I've been using it for a while now, no real cons found at this point.

Has held up to a lot of fish, snags, etc. Has held up extremely well.

Quite happy with it thus far.

redux reply :

Just learn to tie the FG and use a Rizzuto finish knot. It is a smaller and smoother knot that will not be an issue in your guides. All the other leader knots have a tag from the leader that will catch in your guides on the way out. Once you are proficient with the FG it does not take a long time to tie even on the water.

Why use a leader? Braid floats and inhibits the fall of light baits and weightless plastics. Not good. Flouro sinks and allows the baits to work more naturally. Good.

Also, braid will cut into wood the same way it cuts into vegetation. That creates noise as the braid saws into the wood and leads to you getting hung up when the braid cuts deep enough. Not good. Flouro hugs the wood so it does not cut into it and does not make noise as it moves across the wood. Good.

VinnyR reply :

I know a lot of guys refuse to use the FG knot but this is exactly where it excels. If the problem is that the knot is too bulky, use a knot where the leader isn't folded over and inherently thicker than the FG knot. I use Alberto for my 6-8# leader but FG for the thicker fluoro.

Yeah it takes a little longer to tie but it's not something you're gonna be retying throughout the day in most cases. If it is, it takes an extra minute or two (once you get it down) but it's well worth it IMHO. Maybe the shins knot will work better for you but I don't know why it would if it's gonna have the same bulk (but hey I've been wrong before)

LionHeart reply :

FG knot, period.

Happybeerbuzz reply :

It’s so pretty...

5/0 reply :

Thanks for the responses! As stated, the FG guys showed up!

So I tried it a couple times today but couldn’t keep the braid taught enough. The overhands to seal the knot were not cinching down to the end of the knot.

Any ideas on how I can improve these?

Smalls reply :

On 8/1/2019 at 10:55 AM, 5/0 said:

Thanks for the responses! As stated, the FG guys showed up!

So I tried it a couple times today but couldn’t keep the braid taught enough. The overhands to seal the knot were not cinching down to the end of the knot.

Any ideas on how I can improve these?

Put the leader on the floor and step on it with enough to do your knot.

WRB reply :

Why use braid with a leader? No leader or no braid problem solved.

Tom

VinnyR reply :

I'd say just lean your rod against something and hold the line in your teeth, it doesn't have to be completely taught. Or if you're at home, let out a few feet and dangle the reel over the side of a table. Keep pulling the leader tight after each time it over/under the braid.

For the overhand knots I'm not really sure. I always make my braid knots really wet. Other than that just make sure as you cinch it down it's lining up just outside of your loops. I think it's just practice makes perfect

LionHeart reply :

On 8/1/2019 at 10:55 AM, 5/0 said:

Thanks for the responses! As stated, the FG guys showed up!

So I tried it a couple times today but couldn’t keep the braid taught enough. The overhands to seal the knot were not cinching down to the end of the knot.

Any ideas on how I can improve these?

I'm not going to be able to describe the process of how to tie an FG knot in any way that would be useful to you. When I was learning to tie it, I watched just about every video there is on YouTube. "SaltStrong" has a really good one.

The one thing that everyone seems to leave out is that once you finish with all of your wraps and tie the first half hitch to lock them in place, you really need to cinch the knot down hard. I use a couple of wooden dowels for this. You can't just give the knot a good tug, and expect it to hold. You need to pull as hard as you can without snapping your leader line.

As for the finishing knot, I used the rizzuto finish for a while (and it is pretty good), but what I have come to prefer is alternating half hitches. After cinching the FG wraps HARD, I tie 4 alternating half hitches around the braid main line and the tag of my leader, then clip the tag of my leader. Then I tie 4 more alternating half hitches around just the braid. Done. This knot will be extremely strong and will not have to be retied for a very long time. I tie it at home and it can take me between 5-10 minutes per rod (what?), but once it's done, it will be done for a long time. The only reason I retie is if my leader gets too short or starts to look discolored from UV and I begin to doubt the integrity of the leader line itself.

The FG can be a pain to learn how to tie properly, but once you get it you wont want to use anything else.

On 8/1/2019 at 10:46 AM, Happybeerbuzz said:

It’s so pretty...

That looks awesome!

Timberwolf530 reply :

"I’m so mad I could smoke a pickle!" - First of all, if I were you, I would work on a different phrase for describing how angry you are. Second. I use the Alberto exclusively for leader attachment because the FG is just too hard to do in the boat. I never have any problems with it getting stuck, even with micro guides, unless I don't trim the leader tag down far enough. I've started to use fingernail clippers for this because I find I just cannot get close enough with scissors.

bwjay reply :

I use the Double Uni with 40lb Sufix832 and Super8SlickV2 along with 14lb Sniper and I have no issues with it hanging up on micro guides or on the line guide of the reel. I trim the tag ends very close to the knot. I can't speak for what's going on with your Alberto knot but it's supposed to be a smaller knot than the Double Uni. If the Double Uni can have no issues with micro guides, then I suspect you are doing something incorrectly, but what, I can't say.

fin reply :

One thing that’s never really made clear in Alberto instructions is how to tighten it up. Once you finish the wraps and run the tag back through the loop, pull on the tag to tighten a little, then pull on the braid to tighten a little, then put your thumbnail at the base of the wrap end and push the wraps back toward the loop end. Then tighten by pulling the braid again. The knot should end up about 1/8” long and be as tight and symmetrical as that picture of the FG knot, but not near as long.

You can mess up by pushing the wrap too far before tightening.

Mikeltee reply :

Just run straight braid or a leader just long enough to cast effectively and not enter the tip top. You won't be able to solve this issue. It will always hit your guides no matter what you tie. With some lines and knots, this can be minimized but it's still going to happen. I gave up on leaders as soon as I got a rod good enough to see that it makes a drastic change in the rods performance and casting a 3' leader outside the guides is just silly imo. If you are in ultra clear water just run flouro. If you are worried about diminished sensitivity in doing so, get a better rod.

5/0 reply :

Thanks everyone! I have been able to tie the Alberto the best. So I’ll go with that for now. Trimming the leader with fingernail clippers has helped.

I also have practiced the Shinn knot and that works well too. The only question I have regarding this knot is when he says “you put the line through here”. Does it finish like the Alberto?

Darren. reply :

On 8/3/2019 at 3:53 AM, 5/0 said:

Thanks everyone! I have been able to tie the Alberto the best. So I’ll go with that for now. Trimming the leader with fingernail clippers has helped.

I also have practiced the Shinn knot and that works well too. The only question I have regarding this knot is when he says “you put the line through here”. Does it finish like the Alberto?

Basically, yes.

Another tip for when you pull the knot (any) tight is to tug it until

the braid discolors a little bit. That's the cinching down and tightening

of the braid into the line. I've found doing it this way needs no add

of glue like some do. After this I trim the tag ends.

NHBull reply :

If you need to tie a leader and alberto is big, go to the PR. It requires a tool, but unlike the off shore techniques, it only requires an inch of wraps. When I have time, I use it.

On the water it's FG. The key to both is to mushroom the tag end of the FC or mono. Berkley make a hot wire that makes it much easier than a match......Take a breath, it gets easier

Sam reply :

Do you really need a leader? Here is some food for thought and I know the guys will chime in and tell me I am crazy. So here it goes!

Bass are attracted to your bait because of smell, vibration, and light or solid color schemes. The line does not matter. Bass will attack your bait if they are hungry or aggravated no matter what line you are using.

A pro showed me a number of interesting things a few years ago and one is fishing with braid tied directly to your hook for fishing plastics. I was amazed at how he fished the baits shaky head, drop shot, and Texas rigged with no leader. He clobbered them. He outfished me while I was using fluorocarbon.

He then told me that if you are going to use a leader, no matter what line test or type of line you are using, put a dab of fast drying glue on the knot. This will keep the knot together. Some guys have more confidence in using a leader and he suggested the glue trick be used.

As for what knot to use? Doesn't matter as long as you put a drop of glue on it. An old granny knot will work as long as you put glue over it. So tie the knot you have confidence or one that goes through your line guides.

Just food for thought. Your comments, please.

JediAmoeba reply :

On 8/3/2019 at 5:01 AM, Sam said:

Do you really need a leader? Here is some food for thought and I know the guys will chime in and tell me I am crazy. So here it goes!

Bass are attracted to your bait because of smell, vibration, and light or solid color schemes. The line does not matter. Bass will attack your bait if they are hungry or aggravated no matter what line you are using.

A pro showed me a number of interesting things a few years ago and one is fishing with braid tied directly to your hook for fishing plastics. I was amazed at how he fished the baits shaky head, drop shot, and Texas rigged with no leader. He clobbered them. He outfished me while I was using fluorocarbon.

He then told me that if you are going to use a leader, no matter what line test or type of line you are using, put a dab of fast drying glue on the knot. This will keep the knot together. Some guys have more confidence in using a leader and he suggested the glue trick be used.

As for what knot to use? Doesn't matter as long as you put a drop of glue on it. An old granny knot will work as long as you put glue over it. So tie the knot you have confidence or one that goes through your line guides.

Just food for thought. Your comments, please.

I always use a blood knot and put a dab of superglue on it. I had the Alberto knot and the Albright knot fail one too many times on me. The blood knot has not failed me yet

redux reply :

I agree that bass don't normally care about your line from a visual stand point. However, your line affects your bait's action in the water and braid can affect the action negatively. There are other nit-picky reason, but the main one is that it affects the action of the bait and that is enough for me.

You need a decent amount of consistent, even tension on your braid to ensure the initial plaiting is laid down well. Your first half hitch has to be cinched down hard to work (as mentioned earlier). I also should do another 3 alternating half hitches before the heavy pulling to fully seat the plait before cutting the leader off. You really really, really need to pull hard to seat the plait. Pull evenly and watch the braid as you do. It will slowly darken before starting to look kind of clear. You want the entire plait to change color before you work on finishing the rest of the knot.

Something I have not heard anyone mention is burning the bit of leader that's sticking out. You need to wet the entire knot so the wetness absorbs any heat form burning. Use the clear part of the flame just above the metal guard on your lighter because it does not flicker like the rest of the flame and it is also not super hot. You want to control the flame so the leader melts slowly and forms a mushroom cap just above the 4 half hitches. If you do not get it down to even with the knot carefully add a couple half hitches over the exposed tag to fill in that gap. Otherwise that excess leader will create a heavy hing that will catch you guides and cause other line issues.

Finish off with another 4-5 alternating half hitches then you can do a Rizzuto. Before you clip the braid tie a single overhand knot and work it down as close to the knot as you can then clip off the braid. If you don't want to do a Rizzuto you should still do the overhand knot. After all that burn the last bit of braid like before.

I know this is a lot of stuff but it helps your FG stay straight and hold together longer. Given time all the Rizzuto and the half hitches can work loose and compromise your knot.

Yes. On the water all of the finishing steps are way too much to do properly and in the moment you're not likely to want to take the time to do even a basic FG. In this situation I do an Alberto so I can get back at it quickly. Likely I'm going to learn the Shinn because that looks pretty d**n fast and strong.

WRB reply :

If you can't tie a knot under fishing conditions in the wind or poor weather where you fish the knot is worthless.

If you must super glue a knot to make hold you tied it wrong.

Retying your your line should be done as needed whenever you have damaged your or pulled on the line over 50% of it's lb test to unsnag a lure.

Tom

Fried Lemons reply :

If you are deadset on braid to leader the FG knot is well worth learning. I've used it to connect braids from 10-80lbs and once I got the hang of tying the knot it has never failed me. Contrary to what a lot of people seem to believe it is not that hard to tie with some practice. You use one hand to keep tension in the braid. Use your other hand and your foot to keep tension on the leader. I do this all the time on the water in adverse conditions and it never takes me longer than 2 minutes.

FLAGATOR49 reply :

Try Fieders FG knot, make sure to tighten both main lines hard after the first half hitch

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AAARRGG! Connection knot! 2024

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