Are lures made for people not fish? 2024
DanielG reply :
This became longer than I expected risking no one reading it....!
I've been reading a lot about color and fishing lures. Color, depth, water clarity. Accordingly it seems that fish only hone in on two colors, Green and red.
Studies have been done to train bass to attack colors. It seems that they attack green and red 80% and 75% of the time respectively. They don't attack other colors much because they don't see them well. Studies of the rods and cones find that fish are dichromatic. They only see green and red colors. If they attack other colors, they are probably attacking them as various shades of grey depending on depth, water quality, and light available. They are much less noticeable to bass so fewer hits.
This is an article that explains that. Pretty interesting.
So, the perch bait I made that has the dark green to light green back and sides, red accents on the belly might be good coloring as it is easily seen. The shad I made that has a black back going down to silver then white belly might be shiny in the sunlight but just look black, grey, and white at any depth, even if I had made it blue and yellow, and is less easily seen or noticed.
It might explain why a yellow perch might be colors that bass can see. They hang out mostly in weeds so the bass look into the weeds and see a bunch of green, thus the perch would be camouflaged? The open water fish are often other colors or shades of black/white to make them less visible to the green/red sighted bass.
Pickerel, a greenish colored fish is lurking for prey in weeds; again camouflaged is good here.
I read an article about when the sexy shad of the colors bass see came out. It caught a lot of fish and became all the rage. Tackle makers started producing several versions of the same bait with the same color pattern but with a variety of colors. Fishermen picked the stores clean thinking they were the new miracle lure while only one color scheme probably was.
So, I'm thinking, ya, still bright in sunlight at shallow or clear water depths, and color for deeper water, but is it that sticking with greens and reds is the best way to go no matter what the depth? Red isn't that good at depth but it is the color that bass see. Yellow is visible at moderate depth but if bass can't see yellow, does it matter the lure is yellow? Maybe green would have been better.
Let me summarize with this example:
Yellow can be visible at shallow or pretty deep but bass see only light grey to dark grey depending on depth so it's often missed by the fish.
Green can be seen as color, shallow or pretty deep and bass see lighter to darker green depending on depth and are more often seen by the fish.
So, why not use green (and red even though it needs a lot of light to be seen, like near the surface)?
According to this, a green (perch like) bait should be better seen at any depth. A reddish bait should be better seen at shallow depths than other colors. All other colors will be grays and less visible no matter what depth. Not less 'strikable' if seen but just less visible to be noticed for a strike.
This would sure limit the number of colors I'd need to buy to paint my baits. Then again, even though the bass wouldn't give a care, they do look much better to me. Thus, are bait colors made mostly for people, and are we buying them for us and not realizing that our love of a pretty lure is causing fewer bites?
I dunno....
Munkin reply :
Is there a Cliff Notes version?
Fish do not buy lures fishermen do so from a sales perspective lures only have to catch fishermen.
Allen
Angry John reply :
The lure no but the 64 million different color options yes. May need 2-3 colors of the same lure max.
DanielG reply :
On 12/7/2019 at 3:25 AM, Munkin said:Is there a Cliff Notes version?
Fish do not buy lures fishermen do so from a sales perspective lures only have to catch fishermen.
Allen
Ha! sure.
Bass only see green and red. They'll strike at other colors but not much as they don't often notice them and see only grays.
So.... Why do we bother with all the colors? Maybe it's just for us. The fish don't really care, in fact using colors other than red and green probably cause fewer bits.
TnRiver46 reply :
I sure catch a lot of bass on white swimbaits. I also cut up a lot of fish with their bellies full of shad that are neither red nor green. I think they can see more
Bird reply :
I'd say that research is more based on theory.
Timed tested colors by actual fisherman would be of more interest to me.
I admit, I don't stray far from but a very few colors and white has been a primary color for decades, especially SM.
Sweet Tater Pie reply :
With the whole buying/selling different colors thing, a color being shiny/reflective would probably change something, but that is very interesting that they only really see two colors. Makes me wonder why I have so many colors of different lures.
A-Jay reply :
On 12/7/2019 at 3:09 AM, DanielG said:This became longer than I expected risking no one reading it....!
I've been reading a lot about color and fishing lures. Color, depth, water clarity. Accordingly it seems that fish only hone in on two colors, Green and red.
Studies have been done to train bass to attack colors. It seems that they attack green and red 80% and 75% of the time respectively. They don't attack other colors much because they don't see them well. Studies of the rods and cones find that fish are dichromatic. They only see green and red colors. If they attack other colors, they are probably attacking them as various shades of grey depending on depth, water quality, and light available. They are much less noticeable to bass so fewer hits.
This is an article that explains that. Pretty interesting.
So, the perch bait I made that has the dark green to light green back and sides, red accents on the belly might be good coloring as it is easily seen. The shad I made that has a black back going down to silver then white belly might be shiny in the sunlight but just look black, grey, and white at any depth, even if I had made it blue and yellow, and is less easily seen or noticed.
It might explain why a yellow perch might be colors that bass can see. They hang out mostly in weeds so the bass look into the weeds and see a bunch of green, thus the perch would be camouflaged? The open water fish are often other colors or shades of black/white to make them less visible to the green/red sighted bass.
Pickerel, a greenish colored fish is lurking for prey in weeds; again camouflaged is good here.
I read an article about when the sexy shad of the colors bass see came out. It caught a lot of fish and became all the rage. Tackle makers started producing several versions of the same bait with the same color pattern but with a variety of colors. Fishermen picked the stores clean thinking they were the new miracle lure while only one color scheme probably was.
So, I'm thinking, ya, still bright in sunlight at shallow or clear water depths, and color for deeper water, but is it that sticking with greens and reds is the best way to go no matter what the depth? Red isn't that good at depth but it is the color that bass see. Yellow is visible at moderate depth but if bass can't see yellow, does it matter the lure is yellow? Maybe green would have been better.
Let me summarize with this example:
Yellow can be visible at shallow or pretty deep but bass see only light grey to dark grey depending on depth so it's often missed by the fish.
Green can be seen as color, shallow or pretty deep and bass see lighter to darker green depending on depth and are more often seen by the fish.
So, why not use green (and red even though it needs a lot of light to be seen, like near the surface)?
According to this, a green (perch like) bait should be better seen at any depth. A reddish bait should be better seen at shallow depths than other colors. All other colors will be grays and less visible no matter what depth. Not less 'strikable' if seen but just less visible to be noticed for a strike.
This would sure limit the number of colors I'd need to buy to paint my baits. Then again, even though the bass wouldn't give a care, they do look much better to me. Thus, are bait colors made mostly for people, and are we buying them for us and not realizing that our love of a pretty lure is causing fewer bites?
I dunno....
IME, colors play the smallest role in this whole deal, when it comes to presenting artificial baits.
IMO, the fact that whatever we cast, unless it's live bait,
will never appear or be considered by a bass to be 'the real thing'.
Inanimate presentations lack any 'life force'.
Just hunks of plastic, metal, rubber or some combination of them.
However, that has never mattered, ever.
Close enough has been good for years.
No need to know why.
Just go with it.
Fish what you like.
(btw - 139 Days to open water . . . . . . )
A-Jay
DanielG reply :
On 12/7/2019 at 3:45 AM, TnRiver46 said:I sure catch a lot of bass on white swimbaits. I also cut up a lot of fish with their bellies full of shad that are neither red nor green. I think they can see more
They're still getting eaten but have evolved those colors to be as inconspicuous to bass as possible.
Tennessee Boy reply :
Great post @DanielG. Just to be clear, just because the bass can’t see yellow doesn’t mean they can’t see a yellow lure. It just looks off white to them. Dogs can’t see any colors (that not 100% true but let’s pretend) but they can still see and they still eat. It’s just that everything they eat is some shade of grey.
I agree that colors are very effective at catching fishermen. Take a look on the Bill Lewis website. 185 colors of 1/2 oz Rattletraps. That’s crazy.
DanielG reply :
On 12/7/2019 at 9:58 AM, Tennessee Boy said:Great post @DanielG. Just to be clear, just because the bass can’t see yellow doesn’t mean they can’t see a yellow lure. It just looks off white to them. Dogs can’t see any colors (that not 100% true but let’s pretend) but they can still see and they still eat. It’s just that everything they eat is some shade of grey.
I agree that colors are very effective at catching fishermen. Take a look on the Bill Lewis website. 185 colors of 1/2 oz Rattletraps. That’s crazy.
That's right. As I said they can see them they're just more apt to notice the colors they can see more.
drew4779 reply :
If I'm reading your chart correctly, bass can still see a blue or black lure at depths a red, orange, yellow, or green lure wouldn't be as apparent. Now I've never personally caught a bass deeper than 25 feet, but if a black lure is still visible at 90 feet, wouldn't that stand out best on the bottom?
I've seen this research before. I'm no scientist, and have no reason to disagree with it. When fishing jigs, I fish black (any color added is from the trailer) 90% percent of the time. I only use other colors when tossing a jig shallow or in very clear water. It could be a confidence thing (probably is), but a black jig with a black, blue, or purple-ish trailer has preformed better for me than any other color in water 10 feet or deeper.
Hook2Jaw reply :
Shades of gray, you say? I imagine some of those shades of gray do an excellent job of triggering a feeding or reactionary response. I imagine dark colors are a very noticeable shade of gray, and light colors are a very noticeable shade of gray as well.
I try to keep my hard bait selection from 3-5 colors, but I think it often has to do with a combination of colors and that's something I don't think will ever be figured out.
FryDog62 reply :
I do think the “gray zone” has some variations that can make a difference in terms of noticeable contrast - on the light gray/white end of the spectrum - and on the dark gray/black end. My best plastic color for smallmouth is white, my best jig color for largemouth is black.
FryDog62 reply :
I also wonder if there is a significant difference between what a largemouth vs. smallmouth sees since smallies tend to be much more of a sight-feeder..
DanielG reply :
On 12/7/2019 at 1:10 PM, drew4779 said:If I'm reading your chart correctly, bass can still see a blue or black lure at depths a red, orange, yellow, or green lure wouldn't be as apparent. Now I've never personally caught a bass deeper than 25 feet, but if a black lure is still visible at 90 feet, wouldn't that stand out best on the bottom?
I've seen this research before. I'm no scientist, and have no reason to disagree with it. When fishing jigs, I fish black (any color added is from the trailer) 90% percent of the time. I only use other colors when tossing a jig shallow or in very clear water. It could be a confidence thing (probably is), but a black jig with a black, blue, or purple-ish trailer has preformed better for me than any other color in water 10 feet or deeper.
Actually the article says that bass can see a lure of any color or black or white. And Some colors are more visible at depths where the light doesn't reach much, but no matter what depth, Green and also red are noticed more by the fish because they are the only ones they see as color. Everything else is just shades of grey.
MickD reply :
If lures didn't catch fish, they wouldn't last long on the market. The Daredevil in Canada isn't still around because it appeals to fishermen. It's stull around because it appeals to fish. And that appeals to fishermen.
My theory on why fish bite is that in that tiny brain of theirs there exists a number of "instinct" influencers. These change from time to time explaining why certain things work in warm water, others in cold, some in the spring, etc. You get the idea. But some are more important, and more influential than others, and the main ones are motion and color, with appearance less important (think about the tube-what does it look like?). These have to be "triggered" before a fish will eat. Appearance becomes more important the clearer the water. But motion is the most important. Otherwise why would I be unable to catch a smallie on a live crayfish, but could catch them on a tube? Same day, same time, same water, same fish. Color just seems to be a big influencer. On Sag Bay and Lake St Clair some shade of green, + red, works more than any other color (on smallies). Black or Junebug for largemouths. I have met fishermen who fish only one color on St Clair, green. (watermelon). Consider the drop shot. The drop shot. Is it motion, color, appearance, or what? I submit it is the motion and color. At times the "influencers" are going for something really slow, and if the color and the motion are right, they will eat it. I've seen days when only one color would work on drop shot. It was usually green.
When fish are receptive to the "dying shad" jerkbait bite, it's first the motion , then the colors consistent with that motion, realistic minnow colors, make sense and are successful. Motion + color.
Then there is the Budweiser can lure. . .
DanielG reply :
On 12/8/2019 at 7:01 AM, MickD said:If lures didn't catch fish, they wouldn't last long on the market. The Daredevil in Canada isn't still around because it appeals to fishermen. It's stull around because it appeals to fish. And that appeals to fishermen.
My theory on why fish bite is that in that tiny brain of theirs there exists a number of "instinct" influencers. These change from time to time explaining why certain things work in warm water, others in cold, some in the spring, etc. You get the idea. But some are more important, and more influential than others, and the main ones are motion and color, with appearance less important (think about the tube-what does it look like?). These have to be "triggered" before a fish will eat. Appearance becomes more important the clearer the water. But motion is the most important. Otherwise why would I be unable to catch a smallie on a live crayfish, but could catch them on a tube? Same day, same time, same water, same fish. Color just seems to be a big influencer. On Sag Bay and Lake St Clair some shade of green, + red, works more than any other color (on smallies). Black or Junebug for largemouths. I have met fishermen who fish only one color on St Clair, green. (watermelon). Consider the drop shot. The drop shot. Is it motion, color, appearance, or what? I submit it is the motion and color. At times the "influencers" are going for something really slow, and if the color and the motion are right, they will eat it. I've seen days when only one color would work on drop shot. It was usually green.
When fish are receptive to the "dying shad" jerkbait bite, it's first the motion , then the colors consistent with that motion, realistic minnow colors, make sense and are successful. Motion + color.
Then there is the Budweiser can lure. . .
Right, or marling baits on youtube. He made a lure from a square piece of brown wood. He just took a piece of wood, about 4" x 1" x1" put hooks and an eyeloop on it with a weight in the belly and cast it out and caught a few fish with it... go figure huh?
WRB reply :
I was very interested in LMB color preferences and studied a lot of papers, articles and books over the past decades. Conclusion they all conflict each other and few support my actual time on the water experience.
I remember Dr Hills Color C Lector and had to have it. The Color C Lector suggested primary colors with secondary colors based on real time water clarity and light. I remember the unit indicating smoke with orange, I had a smoke with orange tail worm, put on and Bing Go started catching bass, I was exited. The next trip I tried the suggested color and couldn't get bit, back to reality.
We haven't been able to discuss what bass see with the fish so we don't know.
For example some birds with eye having rods and cones have acute color vision, in fact far greater spectrum then the human eye including ultra violet in a few species.
What fish see interpretation depends on how their brain functions and we don't know that factor.
It comes down to using colors we have confidence in using until someone proves the color they are using is working better. If you fish with a partner that experience will occur, you are using cinnamon brown blue neon and kicking your partners butt one day and the next he is using orange crusher and kicking your butt. If you don't change it's a long day.
MickD reply :
From my experience, for whatever reasons, the fish in many waters have specific color preferences. Different color preferences than they have in other waters. Why? I don't know. But if you want to catch fish on those waters, give them the colors they seem to prefer.
drew4779 reply :
On 12/8/2019 at 6:33 AM, DanielG said:Actually the article says that bass can see a lure of any color or black or white. And Some colors are more visible at depths where the light doesn't reach much, but no matter what depth, Green and also red are noticed more by the fish because they are the only ones they see as color. Everything else is just shades of grey.
Isn't grey a color?
DanielG reply :
On 12/8/2019 at 10:54 AM, drew4779 said:Isn't grey a color?
Actually.... when it comes to eyes no, grey isn't a color.
In our eyes red, blue, and green are picked up by structures called cones in the retina of the eye. We mix those colors to see other colors, like on a color wheel. Rods in the retina on the other hand pick up light which is perceived as white, or the lack of it would be greyer and greyer until the complete lack of light would show black.
The cones in the eye of a fish only register green and red. They attack those colors most of the time. Blue is attacked much less, and about the same rate as black. Blue is just another shade of black (grey) to them.
So, in the case of how the eye detects color, grey really isn't a color, just neurons detecting a lack of a lot of light being reflected by an object. That's why most animals can't detect color, they have no cones in the eye. They just have rods and see everything in black/white, or shades of grey.
Like with a black and white tv set, there is no color as there is no mechanism to make the RGB dots on the screen. Just black where there is no light, white were there is a lot of light, or grey where there is some light.
On 12/8/2019 at 9:14 AM, WRB said:I was very interested in LMB color preferences and studied a lot of papers, articles and books over the past decades. Conclusion they all conflict each other and few support my actual time on the water experience.
I remember Dr Hills Color C Lector and had to have it. The Color C Lector suggested primary colors with secondary colors based on real time water clarity and light. I remember the unit indicating smoke with orange, I had a smoke with orange tail worm, put on and Bing Go started catching bass, I was exited. The next trip I tried the suggested color and couldn't get bit, back to reality.
We haven't been able to discuss what bass see with the fish so we don't know.
For example some birds with eye having rods and cones have acute color vision, in fact far greater spectrum then the human eye including ultra violet in a few species.
What fish see interpretation depends on how their brain functions and we don't know that factor.
It comes down to using colors we have confidence in using until someone proves the color they are using is working better. If you fish with a partner that experience will occur, you are using cinnamon brown blue neon and kicking your partners butt one day and the next he is using orange crusher and kicking your butt. If you don't change it's a long day.
We might not know how their brains function or how they perceive the colors but we do know this.
Bass hit Green and red 75%-80% of the time under test conditions.
Bass hit blue, but also black about 40% of the time under test conditions
Bass hit chartreuse but also white about 30% of the time under test conditions.
WRB reply :
How often do they strike brown and purple?
I caught 90% of my bass on those colors inbetween 15' to 20' of water.
Tom
DanielG reply :
On 12/8/2019 at 2:25 PM, WRB said:How often do they strike brown and purple?
I caught 90% of my bass on those colors inbetween 15' to 20' of water.
Tom
I guess, from the research they did, that all colors, even the ones they see, get grayer the deeper you to. 30 ft is considered deep as far as light penetration goes. So most colors will would seem sort of grey at that depth.
WRB reply :
On 12/8/2019 at 7:36 PM, DanielG said:I guess, from the research they did, that all colors, even the ones they see, get grayer the deeper you to. 30 ft is considered deep as far as light penetration goes. So most colors will would seem sort of grey at that depth.
My point is the human eye and brain evolved to see colors above water with good lighting. Fish live in water and evolved to see colors in water with defused or poor lighting. There is a reason for fish and their prey to have coloration that live below the depth of light. Natural selection tends to weed out species that can't adapt to thier environment and evolve species that can. Bass have evolved to use eye sight, they have big eyes and react to a wide range of colors in low or poor lighting as we see it. All the other senses lateral line, hearing, odors or smell work together with sight.
Do you know that colors can make a big difference in total darkness when bass fishing at night? All colors look the same to us at night and we assume bass can only determine black and white because we see those the difference. Black is the most popular color at night but not neccesary the most productive on any given lake.
I use a 4" do nothing worm on a slip shot rig in 50'-60' of water, the only color that is consistant at that depth is translucent blue neon with gold flake. I have tried a wide range of other colors and no strikes, only the 1 nearly transparent worm that looks like a silverside minnow that live at that depth. The bass see it and eat it.
The issue I have with sceince based study is using juevnile or young adult size bass that are very aggressive by their youth and lack of wild environment skills. Adult size bass behave differently in captivity then in the wild and have poor survival rates compared to juveniles raised in a Aquarium. The study wants as few variables as possible to reduce anomalies, unfortunitly the wild is full of unpredictable influences.
Tom
ksboy reply :
Bass are predators and will eat anything they can catch.
Choporoz reply :
On 12/8/2019 at 9:14 AM, WRB said:We haven't been able to discuss what bass see with the fish so we don't know.
What fish see interpretation depends on how their brain functions and we don't know that factor.
Every time in depth discussion of color comes up here, I find this to be the most significant point.
Even if we can scientifically determine what colors bass eyes can differentiate, it will be interpreted as relates to human color perception. Once a bass' rods and cones and cornea (do bass have corneas?) have done their work, we still don't know what colors are interpreted in what ways.
So, it may be that the kind of experience that @WRBand others who have really made study of color experimentation while fishing....would be far more important than science of a fish's eyeball.
Maxximus Redneckus reply :
IMO..yes now days any how case in point.....a lure made 70 yrs ago out of wood was lets say 50 cents it was bought to catch fish cause 50 cents was a lot of money....now roll up to 2019 that same lure NIB would now be 100$ ..so ya
Baitmaker reply :
Fish bite much of the time on pure instinctive reaction in the same way a dog chases cars or bites the vacuum cleaner. The action and vibration of a lure is the most important factor IMO, while the color plays a secondary role in most cases.
J Francho reply :
On 12/9/2019 at 5:04 AM, Maxximus Redneckus said:IMO..yes now days any how case in point.....a lure made 70 yrs ago out of wood was lets say 50 cents it was bought to catch fish cause 50 cents was a lot of money....now roll up to 2019 that same lure NIB would now be 100$ ..so ya
Not quite. Something that costs $.50 in 1914, more than 100 years ago, would be $12.56 today. My $3.50 Rebel crank from 1985 would be $8.04 today. Inflation is a thing, but don't over inflate. 
TnRiver46 reply :
On 12/9/2019 at 9:28 PM, J Francho said:Not quite. Something that costs $.50 in 1914, more than 100 years ago, would be $12.56 today. My $3.50 Rebel crank from 1985 would be $8.04 today. Inflation is a thing, but don't over inflate.
Interesting fact, the Bic lighter has somehow avoided inflation, something around $1 or a little more in the 70s and around $2 today
On 12/9/2019 at 1:39 AM, ksboy said:Bass are predators and will eat anything they can catch.
They are also prey and will refuse to eat things they could easily catch. Ive seen them follow plastic worms all around a pond and stare at them for long periods without ever attacking or biting them . Even green/red worms......
detroit1 reply :
Bic lighters used to be nearly filled with butane, now maybe only 35%, add that to the equation..
spoonplugger1 reply :
Not taking in the rest of the equation is a waste of time and money. Water temp. the fish's lateral line, etc. is just as important as color, easier to evaluate and control, and don't cost nothing.
DanielG reply :
On 12/26/2019 at 6:25 AM, spoonplugger1 said:Not taking in the rest of the equation is a waste of time and money. Water temp. the fish's lateral line, etc. is just as important as color, easier to evaluate and control, and don't cost nothing.
Yes but lets say you take that into consideration, correct water temp etc. All things being equal, will they bite on one color or the other more if under the same conditions?
J Francho reply :
What does "correct water temp" even mean? It's just a parameter; an observation. You may be able to assume some things about activity, but really it just is.
Plottman1974 reply :
yes... Think about hollow bodied frogs for instance. You pay $10+ for one with perfectly painted eyes, perfect painted bodies...none of which fish can even see. the only thing they can see if the frogs plain belly...all that detail on the top of the frog is for fisherman and birds that are flying over.
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