Big time mistake..........stupid stupid stupid 2024
Davis reply :
Title says it all. Temps were back up in the high 70s here in Western NY. So I got home from work and starting sifting through my tackle to choose what I was going to take to my favorite spot. Decided to fish a GYCB Hula Double Tail Grub in a watermeleon red for the first time ever. Teamed it up with a 1/4 BPS XPS football weedless jighead. I was going to be targeting some rocky structure that was deep so I thought this would work well. But the eye is tucked into the jighead so I wasn't sure if I would be able to tie my Palomar knot in there. So I went with an improved clinch knot (never tied it before).
Moving ahead to the fishing spot.......third cast......bouncing it off the bottom in small spurts.....about 14 foot down.....something just nailed it. There are some big brown trout in there but I'm assuming that there not going to hit that bass setup (who knows though). Thing was just bending my ST. Croix Avid like crazy. Started to come to the top and I was prepared for a jump.......but instead I never saw him. Instead of jumping the sucker took a monster lunge back out towards the middle of the lake. The drag screamed for a bit and I made the mistake of horsing him in while the drag was screaming. Well the next thing I know........I felt nothing and reeled up nothing but line. The darn knot gave. Talk about doing something so totally stupid. Tying a knot that I have never tied before. Having almost crap for luck in this fishing spot I thought I may get some dinks. But instead I lost what definately would have been a personal best and he is swimming around with a jig in his mouth. No questions asked he was huge. Never felt a bass that big on my line before. Never saw him so I don't even want to guess on how big he is. Still beating myself up over it. The sad thing is I tried to tie a Palomar knot with a new football jighead after that lost fish and it worked just fine. Caught two more dinks all the while that monster fish that got away was still in my mind. All because I was lazy and stupid. >
:'(
The only positive is that I found that I got a nice fish on the first time using a football jighead. So confidence was built there on another bait. But confidence lost in my ability to tie a improved clinch.
But man.......a PB Largemouth lost because of me....not my setup.
So people!!!! Never go out fishing with a knot tied on that you have never tied before. Always go with what works.
Low_Budget_Hooker reply :
or practice the other knots before hand 
It's not a total failure though, at least you learned something from the experience.
Davis reply :
Quoteor practice the other knots before handIt's not a total failure though, at least you learned something from the experience.
I have such confidence in the Palomar though. First breakoff of the year. Never had trouble with breakoffs in my life. That's why I said it was just stupid and lazy because I never even tried to tie the Palomar on......until after I lost that fish.
;D That's all I can do is laugh. ;D THAT FISH WAS HUGE!!!! I'm going to be sick lol.
Hopefully I can get him to bite again.
32251 reply :
You know he is there. Wait a few and go back and try again.
slomoe reply :
sorry bout the loss Davis, I lost a PB this year too and it has been haunting me. The best cure I guess is to not give up and catch one of equal size. ;D
......then I'll be able to sleep......
Low_Budget_Hooker reply :
QuoteQuoteor practice the other knots before handIt's not a total failure though, at least you learned something from the experience.
I have such confidence in the Palomar though. First breakoff of the year. Never had trouble with breakoffs in my life. That's why I said it was just stupid and lazy because I never even tried to tie the Palomar on......until after I lost that fish.
;D That's all I can do is laugh. ;D THAT FISH WAS HUGE!!!! I'm going to be sick lol.
Hopefully I can get him to bite again.
I hear ya. Last year, if I didn't dump 8-10 fish over 5 lbs, I didn't dump one. It was just my year to be "that guy"
Reading where RW constantly tell folks to re-tie and to inspect your line ....all that stuff has been pounded in to me from reading it all the time. Knots were good, line had integrity, sometimes crap happens. Of course a few were my own fault, letting them run so I could get the camera rolling, etc, I deserve to lose those but at least 1/2 of them,....No excuse.
Davis reply :
QuoteYou know he is there. Wait a few and go back and try again.
Yeah but I doubt he is going to be hitting anything anytime soon with that setup in his jaw.
IMO unless I get lucky I doubt I will be able to find that sucker again.
Davis reply :
Quotesorry bout the loss Davis, I lost a PB this year too and it has been haunting me. The best cure I guess is to not give up and catch one of equal size. ;D......then I'll be able to sleep......
Been thinking about it all last night and all this morning. I even had a quick dream about it.
We don't get that many HUGE bass up here in NY. I know without a doubt this guy was a big 'un.
Not too many times I'm going to get a fish like that on.......and I screw it up.
Life goes on. At least my wife and kid still love me ha ha ha. ;D
Low_Budget_Hooker reply :
Keeps you hungry man...
roadwarrior reply :
Knots:
"If it ain't perfect, it ain't good enough"
surfer reply :
QuoteQuoteYou know he is there. Wait a few and go back and try again.Yeah but I doubt he is going to be hitting anything anytime soon with that setup in his jaw.
IMO unless I get lucky I doubt I will be able to find that sucker again.
Lets look at it another way. With the jig in his jaw he now has problems eating his regular lively forage and will start loosing weight. He will get hungrier than normal and have to eat what he is presented with. If this spot is his normal range where he hangs out he will make mistakes this time not you.
Maybe just a daydream, but I like it. 
jaystraw reply :
and the jig may just fall out.
I was fishing with senkos earlier in the summer and I had a nice smallmouth on. My knot gave and I was kicking myself the next 30 min even while catching fish.
Then, my buddy pulls up a smallmouth with my senko and hook still in his mouth even while going for my friends exact same setup.
So, it's possible!
Davis reply :
QuoteKnots:"If it ain't perfect, it ain't good enough"
Yep.....why the heck I decided to use a knot that I have never tied before?
Only the Good Lord knows..........
From now on I'm sticking with my Palomar Knot. Never had a breakoff with that knot yet.
Davis reply :
Question:
I want to learn from this experience as much as possible. Never have I had a fish pull drag like that before. Not even a smallie. Usually I can horse them in with no problem. But this guy had it screaming away from me. Did I make a mistake in reeling in while he was taking out drag away from me? Should I just let him run? The knot was going to break anyway I'm assuming but can I further the risk of breaking off (never have on my palomar tie) with horsing him in while he is taking drag?
Panamoka_Bassin reply :
QuoteQuestion:I want to learn from this experience as much as possible. Never have I had a fish pull drag like that before. Not even a smallie. Usually I can horse them in with no problem. But this guy had it screaming away from me. Did I make a mistake in reeling in while he was taking out drag away from me? Should I just let him run? The knot was going to break anyway I'm assuming but can I further the risk of breaking off (never have on my palomar tie) with horsing him in while he is taking drag?
Generally speaking, I never "horse" a fish that's taking line. Chances are you'll tear a larger hole in his mouth and its that much easier for the fish to spit the hook. Keep the rod tip up, tighten your drag, and wait for him to tire out a bit. Get's 'em in the boat every time...well, usually...
Del from philly reply :
QuoteQuestion:I want to learn from this experience as much as possible. Never have I had a fish pull drag like that before. Not even a smallie. Usually I can horse them in with no problem. But this guy had it screaming away from me. Did I make a mistake in reeling in while he was taking out drag away from me? Should I just let him run? The knot was going to break anyway I'm assuming but can I further the risk of breaking off (never have on my palomar tie) with horsing him in while he is taking drag?
i feel your pain......iv lost a smallie that felt over 3 or 4 lbs about 3 days this week!!! IT IS THE WORST!!
My problem is the big ones know how to hide under brush and get stuck on logs and rocks....i actually got a 2lber in 2 days ago while he was still tangled onto a big 4 ft log......i just got it all out of the water
to answer your question: (and you shouldnt listen to me because i miss more fish than anyone)
I never use drag unless im fighting a sailfish in salt water (never have).....
i have my drag very tight, but these smallies have been pulling it out anyway....i just keep reeling in as tough as i can....i think that will work nine times out of ten
i have a very light setup and some of these smallies are really pushing the boundries of my set up,......my rod goes into a circle when i hook one over 2 lbs,.....
as for knots, i use a double clench every time and it does fine, im curiouse aotu that knot you said, you think its better than a double clinch
rondef reply :
Sorry to hear about your bad luck, it happens to all of us at some point in time. So long as you learned something from the experience it was not a total loss.
roadwarrior reply :
Set your drag properly, initially WITH A SCALE. Check your drag occasionally and EVERYTIME when you start your day, but NEVER when fighting a fish.
When fighting a fish you should ALWAYS be moving the fish to you unless the fish is running. NEVER reel when your drag is releasing and NEVER adjust your drag! Maintain pressure at all times and if the fish is moving into timber or cover, apply more pressure by lifting your rod tip higher. Force the fish to fight the rod.
Reel when you can, let the fish run when it wants to. Don't get in a hurry, this is what you came for!
jwo1124 reply :
I always use a clinch knot, and have since the day I started fishing. I can;t remember ever losing a fish due to knot breakage except when I tried the junk they call Berkley Vanish Fluoro. I could have been a toothy critter that frayed the line. Or maybe rocks, timber, etc. Like you said it could have a been a large trout, who knows. Sorry that it happened though. Loosing a fish is a horrible feeling, but you'll catch plenty more.
Davis reply :
QuoteSet your drag properly, initially WITH A SCALE. Check your drag occasionally and EVERYTIME when you start your day, but NEVER when fighting a fish.When fighting a fish you should ALWAYS be moving the fish to you unless the fish is running. NEVER reel when your drag is releasing and NEVER adjust your drag! Maintain pressure at all times and if the fish is moving into timber or cover, apply more pressure by lifting your rod tip higher. Force the fish to fight the rod.
Reel when you can, let the fish run when it wants to. Don't get in a hurry, this is what you came for!
My drag is set properly and thankfully because the fish did pull it smoothly . Thanks for answering my question RW. That is what I wanted to know. Next time I will just let em take me for a ride. There was no brush so he could have gone where he wanted without getting me into trouble.
Sorry Johnny don't agree with a super tight drag. Mine is set just right.....I just never had a fish take it out SO FAST like this one did.
Yes I think the palomar is a better knot than the clinch but that is just in my experience obviously. I have never had a fish break off of my Palomar knot so I trust it and my tying it 100%.
Why I tried to tie a cilinch when the Palomar has been my bread and butter is beyond me. Fate I guess.
I'm not saying that the improved clinch knot is a bad knot......but me not having experience of tying one up cost me this time. Next time I will go back to my Palomar, even if it is hard to get it the loop through the eye. Not going to make the same mistake twice.
Del from philly reply :
QuoteQuoteSet your drag properly, initially WITH A SCALE. Check your drag occasionally and EVERYTIME when you start your day, but NEVER when fighting a fish.When fighting a fish you should ALWAYS be moving the fish to you unless the fish is running. NEVER reel when your drag is releasing and NEVER adjust your drag! Maintain pressure at all times and if the fish is moving into timber or cover, apply more pressure by lifting your rod tip higher. Force the fish to fight the rod.
Reel when you can, let the fish run when it wants to. Don't get in a hurry, this is what you came for!
My drag is set properly and thankfully because the fish did pull it smoothly . Thanks for answering my question RW. That is what I wanted to know. Next time I will just let em take me for a ride. There was no brush so he could have gone where he wanted without getting me into trouble.
Sorry Johnny don't agree with a super tight drag. Mine is set just right.....I just never had a fish take it out SO FAST like this one did.
Yes I think the palomar is a better knot than the clinch but that is just in my experience obviously. I have never had a fish break off of my Palomar knot so I trust it and my tying it 100%.
Why I tried to tie a cilinch when the Palomar has been my bread and butter is beyond me. Fate I guess.
I'm not saying that the improved clinch knot is a bad knot......but me not having experience of tying one up cost me this time. Next time I will go back to my Palomar, even if it is hard to get it the loop through the eye. Not going to make the same mistake twice.
i waas thikning about messing with my drag.......but i have a lot of obstacles that he could run into and mess everything up
is an improved clench the same as the double clench?
roadwarrior reply :
Regarding knots:
I tie a Palomar Knot about 99% of the time, but I enjoy tying knots and will use others occasionally. If you want to learn a new knot, use a small diameter cotton rope so you can see EXACTLY what you are doing. Once you "see it" being tied, you will find it much easier and probably will not forget how to properly tie it next time.
Suggestions: Uni Knot, Trilene Knot, Improved Clinch Knot and San Diego Jam.
http://www.animatedknots.com/knotlist.php?LogoImage=LogoGrog.jpg&Website=www.animatedknots.com
San Diego Jam Knot: http://www.proknot.com/Fishing_Knots/San_Diego_Jam_Knot/san_diego_jam_knot.html
tyrius. reply :
QuoteNext time I will go back to my Palomar, even if it is hard to get it the loop through the eye. Not going to make the same mistake twice.
Some really great advice that I read here regarding the palomar knot is to put the end of the line through the eye and then put it back through the eye to create your loop. This way you don't have to force the folded line through a small eye.
I never used the palomar before that because I hated trying to get the loop started. After reading that simple piece of advice the palomar is MUCH easier now.
Davis reply :
QuoteQuoteNext time I will go back to my Palomar, even if it is hard to get it the loop through the eye. Not going to make the same mistake twice.Some really great advice that I read here regarding the palomar knot is to put the end of the line through the eye and then put it back through the eye to create your loop. This way you don't have to force the folded line through a small eye.
I never used the palomar before that because I hated trying to get the loop started. After reading that simple piece of advice the palomar is MUCH easier now.
Lol after last night I'm hesitant on trying to try it any other way lol. I think you can understand why.
Usually I have no trouble starting the loop through. It just didn't look easy this time so I tried something different. The thing that ticks me off is that after I lost that fish, I tried to tie my palomar on another jighead and it went through just fine.
slomoe reply :
thats a really cool website. Thanks for the link RW.
SPEEDBEAD. reply :
QuoteQuoteNext time I will go back to my Palomar, even if it is hard to get it the loop through the eye. Not going to make the same mistake twice.Some really great advice that I read here regarding the palomar knot is to put the end of the line through the eye and then put it back through the eye to create your loop. This way you don't have to force the folded line through a small eye.
I never used the palomar before that because I hated trying to get the loop started. After reading that simple piece of advice the palomar is MUCH easier now.
Good call on the knot. That is the only way I can ever tie a palomar. I have never gotten the loop to go through.
Also, if you are using fluoro, pushing the loop through the eye could cause it to kink and weaken.
Wayne
Davis reply :
QuoteQuoteQuoteNext time I will go back to my Palomar, even if it is hard to get it the loop through the eye. Not going to make the same mistake twice.Some really great advice that I read here regarding the palomar knot is to put the end of the line through the eye and then put it back through the eye to create your loop. This way you don't have to force the folded line through a small eye.
I never used the palomar before that because I hated trying to get the loop started. After reading that simple piece of advice the palomar is MUCH easier now.
Good call on the knot. That is the only way I can ever tie a palomar. I have never gotten the loop to go through.
Also, if you are using fluoro, pushing the loop through the eye could cause it to kink and weaken.
Wayne
It could but it never has for me. Going to stick with what works. ;D
I always wet it down before putting the loop through. Seems to help.
roadwarrior reply :
There is no reason to put a loop through the eye of the lure. Thread the line through, create a loop and thread the line back through. Don't try to be so frugal, either. Using a little extra line saves time and allows you a more flexibility in tying the perfect knot. Wet the knot before tightening and pull with the tag line, not the main line.
Davis reply :
QuoteThere is no reason to put a loop through the eye of the lure. Thread the line through, create a loop and thread the line back through. Don't try to be so frugal, either. Using a little extra line saves time and allows you a more flexibility in tying the perfect knot. Wet the knot before tightening and pull with the tag line, not the main line.
I use a ton of extra line.
Been brought up tying my knots with the loop through the eye though RW. Never failed me so why change my style?
roadwarrior reply :
It's easier and you create EXACTLY the same result (loop).
Davis reply :
QuoteIt's easier and you create EXACTLY the same result (loop).
I'll try it out. I can usually get the loop in the first time I try.
I'm one of those people that have to have something in front of me to get the visual.
Kind of like a keyboard. I can type fast as all heck but you ask me where one of the letters is and I can't tell ya. 
Ask me to tell you how to tie a palomar and I can't do it. Have to have it in front of me.
Davis reply :
QuoteIt's easier and you create EXACTLY the same result (loop).
OMG I just got the mental on how to do it ha ha ha ha.
Yeah I think I will go your route.............Why I never thought of that before is unreal to me.
Yes I am an idiot. ;D
Wow.......
Tin reply :
Guess what ---- happens and there is nothing you can do about it sometimes. If you know or now know that you did something wrong, just learn from it and dont let it happen again. Thats all you can do, dont loose sleep over it or let it haunt you.
Unless it something that happened to Aaron Martens in Pittsburgh or Wylie or Lay.
tyrius. reply :
QuoteOMG I just got the mental on how to do it ha ha ha ha.Yeah I think I will go your route.............Why I never thought of that before is unreal to me.
Yes I am an idiot. ;D
Wow.......
That was my exact reaction! It's amazing how one can do things the hard way for so long and never realize that an easier method exists.
slomoe reply :
I think Im going to start using this knot. I've been using the improved clinch but I think I'm wrapping the line too hard and when I go to tighten it I notice all kinds of kinks above the knot.
Are there any knots you use that are specific for a certain lure or is one pretty much universal for all lures?
roadwarrior reply :
Yes, especcially for BIG lures: Uni Knot, Trilene Knot and San Diego Jam.
(If you analyze them closely, they are fundamentally the same knot!)
5bass reply :
Want a challenge tying a Palomar knot? Try doing it with only one hand. I saw one of the pros do it and it took me about 2 weeks to get the hang of it.
Fish Chris reply :
I tie "lots" of lousy knots, probably every 3rd or 4th one, but the key is, I never tie a bad knot, and not recognize it as such right away ! And those are the ones that never get wet ! Instead, I just tie another one... and another, if neccessary, until I get one that cinches down, clean, pretty, easily, and fully. And when they do come out like this, they just flat out won't ever break on a fish.
This goes for all of my knots. Improved clinches, palomars, and bloodknots make up 99% of them.
Peace,
Fish
guest reply :
lazy and stupid has lost more fish than all other reasons combined.
Not that I would know............
islandbass reply :
QuoteThere is no reason to put a loop through the eye of the lure. Thread the line through, create a loop and thread the line back through. Don't try to be so frugal, either. Using a little extra line saves time and allows you a more flexibility in tying the perfect knot. Wet the knot before tightening and pull with the tag line, not the main line.
Wohhh! I didn't know that some people thought of feeding a loop through the hook's eye to start the Palomar. 
Try that with a size 2 drop shot hook. ;D
Anyway, Davis, did you mention what line you were using. It has been my experience that when using the Improved Clinch knot, it can slip with braid.
I use the palomar and IC knot probably 99% of the time. I have never lost a fish due to knot failure. I am sure a little practice with the IC knot will solve that. I use the IC over the palomar when tying things like minnow baits and crankbaits. Making a loop with the palomar to accomodate (and waste) line isn't practical for me in those cases so I use the IC knot or the Trilene knot if I feel like it.
Good advice was given about when the fish pull the drag. Barring them heading for heavy cover, there should not be a need to horse a fish taking drag. Sorry about the loss but there is always next time.
dodgeguy reply :
Quotelazy and stupid has lost more fish than all other reasons combined.Not that I would know............
i would!!!ROFLMAO!!! ;D
Davis reply :
QuoteQuoteThere is no reason to put a loop through the eye of the lure. Thread the line through, create a loop and thread the line back through. Don't try to be so frugal, either. Using a little extra line saves time and allows you a more flexibility in tying the perfect knot. Wet the knot before tightening and pull with the tag line, not the main line.Wohhh! I didn't know that some people thought of feeding a loop through the hook's eye to start the Palomar.
Try that with a size 2 drop shot hook. ;D
Anyway, Davis, did you mention what line you were using. It has been my experience that when using the Improved Clinch knot, it can slip with braid.
I use the palomar and IC knot probably 99% of the time. I have never lost a fish due to knot failure. I am sure a little practice with the IC knot will solve that. I use the IC over the palomar when tying things like minnow baits and crankbaits. Making a loop with the palomar to accomodate (and waste) line isn't practical for me in those cases so I use the IC knot or the Trilene knot if I feel like it.
Good advice was given about when the fish pull the drag. Barring them heading for heavy cover, there should not be a need to horse a fish taking drag. Sorry about the loss but there is always next time.
Actually lol I'm able to get a loop through a #8 octopus hook. Pretty good at it lol but threading one line at a time in makes so much more sense. Thanks RW lol.
I have been using nothign but Fluoro and Mono. I don't use braid.
uncle joe reply :
I fish a large point on my home lake that I have seen several 5#+ fish cruising the shallow water near a sea wall, the water drops fast to 20 ft and is prime lunker teritory. Everytime I pass this spot I do my best to present what I think is a perfect presentation and sometimes I get hit and other times I don't. I have on several occassions hooked what feels like a very good fish only to loose it due to a dumb mistake. It either jumps and throws the bait or wraps me around a dock piling and breaks off. (easy since I fish almost totaly with UL and 4# test line. In the past 2 months I have taken great care in being careful to stay clear of dock pilings as best I can and try to keep the fish turned the way I want him and have boated several 5 and 6 lb. fish at this spot, even hooked the same fish 2X the same day. He broke my line while I was fishing a watermellon finnesse worm in the morning and I hooked and boated him 4 hours later on a 4" Senco and he still had the finnesse worm and hook in his mouth. Just keep trying and consider it the fishes challenge to you to catch him.
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