Interesting Facebook Post From A River Guide.... 2024
flyfisher reply :
So here is the post
"I got a part time evening job .So I am now guiding the river full-time, so I'm available all the time .We are booked till the last weekend in September . Unless you wanna pay $200 a day and bump an existing reservation."
Just curious on everyone's thoughts about this statement....i'll post up my thoughts after we get a few responses 
Smokinal reply :
I'm not scared...that's complete BS imo. I'd like to ask the guide one question, "Would you want your reservation, that you paid for and took vacation time from work for, bumped?"
I've run a very reputable auto center for 24 years. When I take an appointment, no matter how big or small the job, I do my absolute best to get that customer in and out on time. I can't tell you how many people come in, throwing their weight around and want to get in NOW because their situation is more important than everyone else's....sorry, you will get the same great treatment as I gave the guy before you...when it is your turn.
flyfisher reply :
that was my exact thought too....he then proceeded to say he had to raise prices and had a mortgage yadda yadda....two completely different things in my mind. If i make a guided trip reservation, take time off work and i get a call saying i was bumped i would be more than ticked. Honestly, he doesn't seem like much more than a dude who likes to fish and wants to get paid while doing it where most guides that are good that i have been around won't pick up a rod all day long....
K_Mac reply :
The guy might be a great fisherman. He may even be a great guide. If I had a date scheduled I would cancel and make sure he knew why. Smokinal explained clearly how a professional handles a full calendar. This guy has a lot to learn about how to treat people.
Catch and Grease reply :
What kind of business man makes an agreement with someone then trashes it because someone else pays more money.
A bad one.
Darren. reply :
Odd post, for sure. Either he's dull, or simply wasn't thinking straight (beer?) when posting. I suppose in some lines of work, the more money thrown around, the more bumps happen........
But fishing?
Jolly Green reply :
But you gotta hand it to him for being completely upfront about his D-baggery. I wonder if he's honest with his bumped reservations about the reason he's bailing on them or if he gives them some my-dog-ate-my-boat story.
flyfisher reply :
On 9/7/2014 at 9:37 AM, Jolly Green said:But you gotta hand it to him for being completely upfront about his D-baggery. I wonder if he's honest with his bumped reservations about the reason he's bailing on them or if he gives them some my-dog-ate-my-boat story.
i am thinking he isn't based on the additional comments defending his stand later one but who knows.....
buzzed bait reply :
Sounds shady all around
ClackerBuzz reply :
my only advice for him...don't quit ur 'part time evening job' 
Driftb reply :
That is a guide that doesn't want you to think that he doesn't have a full calendar. He is totally full of it. You don't get a full calender just because you decide to go full time. He isn't bumping anyone for $200/day. I wouldn't bump someone for $325 which is my daily rate. As a matter of fact, I wouldn't do it for 400 either. bad business. I have a lot of repeat bizz and I intend on keeping it that way. I certainly won't screw a regular or a new client that respects me enough to send me a deposit. I won't hold a date on my calender without a deposit, except for an outfitter. No deposit, you are taking chances. You will probably lose the date. That's the way it works in this business.
tomustang reply :
A doctor/dentist.On 9/7/2014 at 9:13 AM, Catch and Grease said:What kind of business man makes an agreement with someone then trashes it because someone else pays more money.
A bad one.
that possum reply :
If I get bumped, I better be getting my deposit back.
Then I'll book with his competition.
SirSnookalot reply :
Even $200 a day is too cheap for a guide, if the initial price was less than that I'd be dubious of his expertise in the first place. A contract is a contract written or verbal, make a deal and live up to it.
Smokinal reply :
On 9/7/2014 at 12:42 PM, Driftb said:That is a guide that doesn't want you to think that he doesn't have a full calendar. He is totally full of it. You don't get a full calender just because you decide to go full time. He isn't bumping anyone for $200/day. I wouldn't bump someone for $325 which is my daily rate. As a matter of fact, I wouldn't do it for 400 either. bad business. I have a lot of repeat bizz and I intend on keeping it that way. I certainly won't screw a regular or a new client that respects me enough to send me a deposit. I won't hold a date on my calender without a deposit, except for an outfitter. No deposit, you are taking chances. You will probably lose the date. That's the way it works in this business.
On 9/7/2014 at 4:02 PM, SirSnookalot said:Even $200 a day is too cheap for a guide, if the initial price was less than that I'd be dubious of his expertise in the first place. A contract is a contract written or verbal, make a deal and live up to it.
I was thinking the same thing. He'll bump someone for a $200 day? How much would it have been in the first place? When I went on my Falcon trip, our guide was $400 per day and I wasn't even impressed with his service...and he's a huge name down there.
Lund Explorer reply :
On 9/7/2014 at 7:42 AM, flyfisher said:So here is the post
"I got a part time evening job .So I am now guiding the river full-time, so I'm available all the time .We are booked till the last weekend in September . Unless you wanna pay $200 a day and bump an existing reservation."
Just curious on everyone's thoughts about this statement....i'll post up my thoughts after we get a few responses
I'm predicting a short career on the river during the day, and a much longer one at the drive thru window at night.
Perhaps his biggest mistake is failing to mention that he wants everyone to "Like" him on Facebook. It seems to be the key to success these days.
reb67 reply :
I run my own business and find it funny when customers try to get me to FIT THEM IN because they thing there job is more important or pays more. I couldn't even image running my business that way if that got out your appointment book would clear quickly.
If that's the way he wants to run his business may he should not have a set price and just open all his dates up for bid. He has to be that good to be able to give up his evening job.
Driftb reply :
IMHO- Choosing a guide has nothing to do with price. Yeah the busier guides will boost their prices, but there is a lot more to it than that. Assuming most of the guides know where to find the fish. Some of those "big name guides" guides don't seem to take an individual new client as seriously as the lower profile guys. As long as they get one picture for the website, they know they'll be home for the 6 o'clock news. Are they going to go the extra mile to make sure that your day on the river is a special one for you? You want someone who is dependable and hard working, first and foremost. Then it's personality. Is the guide someone you could see spending a day with on a boat? What are the guide's hours? Do you want to fish with a nine to fiver? Or would you rather fish with someone who will tell you when the fishing is going to be best, and maybe stay late if need be, or even if you just feel like it? I sometimes see guides who are great at marketing working more than guides who are spending all their energy on the river. Some guides see fishing as just a job, and other guides fish on their days off too. Who would you rather fish with?
Scott F reply :
The guide who says he would bump a client for a higher paying one is telling it like it is for a number of business'. I work for a Fortune 500 company. It is actually near the top 50 of all business' in the US. They have a philosophy called 80-20. 80% of your business comes from 20% of your customers. 80% of your sales come from 20% of your product line. Sam's Club is a good example. Their selection of merchandise is limited. They carry the 20% of the items a normal store carries that make up 80% of sales. These companies don't refuse business from the 80%, but they certainly cater to the 20 percenters who are their best customers. If 2 customers ask for a service to be done at the same time, the better customer, who provides a lot more business, will get preferential treatment every time. Those of us not in that 20% club don't like it, but that's the way things are done. The big difference here is that the guide, who may or not really be booked, actually said it out loud.
flyfisher reply :
Catering to which makes sense and bumping another paying client to me are completely different. Do you think that at Sam's Club if someone who is a big spender will jump the line? I don't, even though they may have special perks for customers who spend x amount of dollars per year. To me this is completely different in that anyone can just pay a $200 fee and bump someone else from their spot.
Scott F reply :
I just used Sam's Club as an example of the 80-20 principle. Trust me, people get bumped by business all the time. You just won't hear them tell you you got bumped for a better offer. Usually you hear "It's going to take a little longer to get you car fixed" Or, "Our guys are running a little behind, the service man will get there as soon as he can." Or, "Your table will be ready soon", Or "Your doctor is running late" while you sit in a waiting room an hour past your appointment time. You got bumped by a better customer and just didn't know it.
flyfisher reply :
i also think this is different because the offer is made to pay for that privilege. I guess i am not as cynical as you are in thinking that scheduling is only done based on your client ranking....i know none of the small businesses i worked for did this. And everyone knows doctors run late, it is part of their training. They also treat many patients based on need for care not whose name is on the insurance card.
Driftb reply :
Disney world does exactly that. Pay more and jump the lines. I am not Disneyworld though. Matter of fact, I have a trip booked for Monday with a couple of regulars. The trip has been on my calender for a year. I have had several inquiries for the day from other parties, but I won't try to move the other guys. They want that day and I won't monkey with it. The guys who come in on short notice will have to find other days. Am I supposed to ask two company CEO's that treat me like a friend, are as good as their word, and always tip 30% to change their schedules so that I can take a stranger fishing? Not likely. Conversly, though, if I book someone, I will never bump him, unless he doesn't send a deposit. I treat every one the same, newbie or regular client, once they send me a deposit. I might call and ask a client if he would mind fishing on an alternate date though. Occasionally that works out well for everyone.
gulfcaptain reply :
Hopefully he isn't using a boat, I highly doubt he's licensed and insured. Sounds pretty shady to me. No thanks, in his case you may have to pay him just to get you back home instead of taking you fishing. He should try that business model....take you fishing for $200, but if you want to come back its gonna cost you another $200 as well.
Sam reply :
On 9/7/2014 at 9:13 AM, Catch and Grease said:Catch and Grease, on 06 Sept 2014 - 21:13, said:What kind of business man makes an agreement with someone then trashes it because someone else pays more money.
A bad one.
Politicians.
gulfcaptain reply :
Democrats do it all the time...^^^^^
jeremyryanwebb reply :
I am in the process of getting my license to run inshore charters for the Outfitters I work for. Ive been taking mental notes on all the best guides I come in contact with and have had the pleasure of working under two of the top captains in the South Carolina lowcountry. One consistency I have found in all the best guides is that they are very honest, straight forward and humble people you will meet on or off the water. This guy will get weeded out by the real guides in his area.
C0lt reply :
No matter how much, or how little money is involved, a man is only as good as his word..
SirSnookalot reply :
Can't compare a large company to a guide service. A guide can go out just so much, whether it's 250 different customers per year or one customer going out 250 times, the gross dollars are pretty much the same. 250 outings a year sounds like the upside and probably not the norm. Companies add staff to service increasing clientele and add locations for expanation, not that a guide couldn't do that.
First rule of business, never hire anyone smarter than yourself, that's your next competition.
buzzed bait reply :
On 9/8/2014 at 3:01 PM, SirSnookalot said:Can't compare a large company to a guide service. A guide can go out just so much, whether it's 250 different customers per year or one customer going out 250 times, the gross dollars are pretty much the same. 250 outings a year sounds like the upside and probably not the norm. Companies add staff to service increasing clientele and add locations for expanation, not that a guide couldn't do that.
First rule of business, never hire anyone smarter than yourself, that's your next competition.
not to derail this much further than it has, but that's perhaps the least intelligent thing a business owner or executive would ever come up with..... I have roughly 400 people that tree up to me through my organization. You can bet that everytime i go to hire one i'm only hoping they are smarter than i am. That's how you eradicate competition is finding, growing and fostering the best talent you can find.
This particular guide will have no worries about hiring anyone, but should be looking for a job himself. Although, like someone said already, you have to applaud the guy for just coming right out and telling you how ignorant he was up front. Better now than booking with him and finding out for yourself on the water!!
Felix77 reply :
Wouldn't book with this guy ...
#1 - As mentioned I would hate to book and commit the hours just to get bumped last minute.
#2 - I think being fully booked sounds like BS, especially with the bump post. How do I know if he is already booked?! ... could be lying just to get more $$ on every request.
Delaware Valley Tackle reply :
Reminds me of Seinfeld at the car rental " So you can TAKE a reservation, you just can't KEEP a reservation......How is that a reservation?"
SirSnookalot reply :
On 9/8/2014 at 10:42 PM, buzzed bait said:not to derail this much further than it has, but that's perhaps the least intelligent thing a business owner or executive would ever come up with..... I have roughly 400 people that tree up to me through my organization. You can bet that everytime i go to hire one i'm only hoping they are smarter than i am. That's how you eradicate competition is finding, growing and fostering the best talent you can find.
This particular guide will have no worries about hiring anyone, but should be looking for a job himself. Although, like someone said already, you have to applaud the guy for just coming right out and telling you how ignorant he was up front. Better now than booking with him and finding out for yourself on the water!!
Served me well being in business. Owned a scrap metal co. for 35 years, had a stamping plant, slitting operation, new steel sales and built a 180 unit storage facility. Teach an employee too much and before you know he's taking your accounts. Exactly how I got into business, worked for guy and learned the business, 2 years I opened my own company, I didn't take his accounts but I took his education, he taught me too much, lol.
buzzed bait reply :
On 9/8/2014 at 11:04 PM, SirSnookalot said:Served me well being in business. Owned a scrap metal co. for 35 years, had a stamping plant, slitting operation, new steel sales and built a 180 unit storage facility. Teach an employee too much and before you know he's taking your accounts. Exactly how I got into business, worked for guy and learned the business, 2 years I opened my own company, I didn't take his accounts but I took his education, he taught me too much, lol.
ok, if you say so.... that's business practice is a bit underhanded much like the Facebook poster....
your first employer's mistake was not teaching you too much (that's a foolish statement in itself) but rather not having you sign a non-compete agreement
anyways, how do i get in touch with this guide?? i have tons of money to throw at him so that i can go first thing tomorrow morning.....
flyfisher reply :
I don't see that as underhanded. Everyone needs to gain experience yet not everyone has the desire or make up to be a business owner. Most no compete clauses also come with a big severance when you leave, at least in the businesses i have worked.
SirSnookalot reply :
Not underhanded at all, most people that start businesses learned the ins and outs working for another company first, how does one start a business with no prior experience. Don't recall ever seeing a no compete contract with an employee, with a partner yes. As I say for my own protection I hired people do only what I wanted them to do, nothing more and I didn't need a Rhodes scholar.
buzzed bait reply :
On 9/9/2014 at 12:33 AM, flyfisher said:I don't see that as underhanded. Everyone needs to gain experience yet not everyone has the desire or make up to be a business owner. Most no compete clauses also come with a big severance when you leave, at least in the businesses i have worked.
if you have a business that requires a highly skilled worker, you invest years of training and industry knowledge with that person. For them to up and leave one day and open up shop to be a competitor with your trade secrets doesn't seem underhanded? Perhaps not to some, just my opinion that it is. Having seen this happen to my dad twice in 29 years of Custom Cabinetry I know the emotional toll it takes on a business owner. Should you ever be in a position to own your own business I am sure you would grasp my concept.
As far as the non compete goes. That is generally between and employer and employee (not partners). It does not provide compensation in any means to an employee upon resignation nor termination. It simply protects the employer from having their marketing, trade secrets, client lists, etc. exploited when the employee leaves. A severance is something completely independent from a non compete clause.
Let me just frame it in fishing terms so that I can try to pull this back to the forums.... Say you start out co-angling in a team format with a guy that really takes you in and shows you the ropes. Shows you his lures, techniques, spots, etc. You fish together for a number of years, successfully. Now one day something happens and this co-angler now hooks up with a new boater. Said co-angler begins to show the boater all your spots, techniques, gears, etc. and that team is now successful.
Seem underhanded now?
Djf3864 reply :
Bad business practice, and a complete lack of respect for his customers.
That type of business model won't last long as far as I am concerned.
SPEEDBEAD. reply :
I know one thing. I'd still show up on my day that I booked. A conversation would take place on that day. How that conversation ended would be entirely related to whether or not the guide took me fishing as agreed and PAID for.
flyfisher reply :
On 9/9/2014 at 8:48 PM, buzzed bait said:if you have a business that requires a highly skilled worker, you invest years of training and industry knowledge with that person. For them to up and leave one day and open up shop to be a competitor with your trade secrets doesn't seem underhanded? Perhaps not to some, just my opinion that it is. Having seen this happen to my dad twice in 29 years of Custom Cabinetry I know the emotional toll it takes on a business owner. Should you ever be in a position to own your own business I am sure you would grasp my concept.
As far as the non compete goes. That is generally between and employer and employee (not partners). It does not provide compensation in any means to an employee upon resignation nor termination. It simply protects the employer from having their marketing, trade secrets, client lists, etc. exploited when the employee leaves. A severance is something completely independent from a non compete clause.
Let me just frame it in fishing terms so that I can try to pull this back to the forums.... Say you start out co-angling in a team format with a guy that really takes you in and shows you the ropes. Shows you his lures, techniques, spots, etc. You fish together for a number of years, successfully. Now one day something happens and this co-angler now hooks up with a new boater. Said co-angler begins to show the boater all your spots, techniques, gears, etc. and that team is now successful.
Seem underhanded now?
no, still doesn't seem underhanded. It is part of of owning a business and hiring good people that unfortunately you want the best people and the best people, at times, want their own business. Did your dad ever apprentice under anyone or learn from anyone else? I highly doubt he became a custom cabinet maker by reading books. I know my dad as an electrician for his entire life had many apprentices under him who later started their own businesses and he was as supportive then as he was when they were his employees. There were others who did not want the headache of owning their own business and those guys become the top guys in his shop.
s far as the co-angler thing goes, i would wonder why they split up as a team in the first place and it isn't like the boater doesn't have that same knowledge still about the same spots. his competition just got better and hopefully he can overcome and become a better angler. Does it suck, sure but it is the price of doing business.
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