Changing Baits 2024
.dsaavedra. reply :
hey, i was just wondering, how long does it take for you guys to decide to change baits when something else is not working.
i think i have a problem because i tend to stick to one bait for a very long time, even if it is not working. and when i do decide to change, i usually dont really know what would be the best thing to change to.
Wayne P. reply :
I really don't change baits per say. I carry 8-15 rods with different lures or different sizes or weights and depending on the location; I will try most presentations in a particular area until I determine the fish are not biting or are not there. I never assume that I know what the most productive presentation will be and let the fish tell me what they want. The array of presentations that I start with is based on seasonal patterns.
firefightn15 reply :
About the time I decide something isn't working, I'll change colors. THen after about 1/2 hr, if I'm still not getting anything I'll switch. What to switch to sometimes is a real head scratcher. ff15
SnowBass23 reply :
I also tend to carry rods with several different lures already tied on. I typically plan out from the beggining what I think might be working and have a selection preloaded. Then, when I get to the water, I have several options available. For example, I always use soft plastics. So one rig is loaded with whatever my 'standard' rig might be (some kind of t-rigged worm). Then I might have a spinnerbait loaded in a color I think will work, and a crank. But if I seem to not be making any progress with the worm, I might take another rod and rig a worm, but differently...a different color, style, maybe a heavier weight.
As far as when to decide to change? Well, I think you just go with the gut feeling and when ti feels time then it is time! If you are fishing as a hobby (or lifestyle, but not profession like myself) then do it when and how you want!
fishinfiend reply :
I am very bad about this. I usually fish the same thing for at least an hour or more before I change. When I do change, I usually wonder if I should have stuck with the original. >
Ballpark Frank reply :
Since my little boat isn't worthy of big water, I am using trolling the shallows, channels, and streams. I usually have 4-6 rods rigged in the boat; shallow crankbait(0'-2'), spinnerbait, hard jerkbait, medium crankbait(2'-6'), t-rig lizard or worm, and shakey head worm. I will usually work an area thoroughly with each bait before switching to the next in the order above. This can sometimes take an hour or my take only 10 minutes depending on the area I'm fishing. I usually have the colors worked out went I launch the boat, but may switch later and work the area again with a different color. If all of this fails, then I pull out the swimbaits and start playing.
.dsaavedra. reply :
ok thanks for the tips. what usually determines what you switch to?
Paul Roberts reply :
Many people approach lure choice by having some confidence baits, and then looking for situations to match them. I'm the other way around, I look at the fish and conditions, then choose lures to apply. I re-think, re-adjust, adapt, as I go.
We all know lots of things catch bass. But some work better than others depending on the circumstances. In my mind, those circumstances are fish behavior and activity, and sky and water conditions.
I first try to decide where the fish are generally by season and in terms of actual lake lay-out (called location). Then I decide where in that location or structure they are -how close to cover, how high in the water column, etc...(this is called position). Then I try to determine what they are doing, their activity level -How easy they will be to dupe, how willing to chase they are, etc.. Essentially, I'm usually looking for the easiest fish to catch). Together these dictate the very basic controls: depth, speed.
From there other more specific things enter in to the mix:
-Cover present (weed type, algae, wood, rock, ...)
-Visibility conditions: Water clarity, cloud cover, time of day, cover.
-Other anglers present?
-How spooky are they? (Often directly related to visibility and other anglers).
-Prey type the bass are likely feeding on, or used to seeing.
-Triggering. What manipulations you apply to turn non-biters into biters.
-other stuff...
-How comfortable (which boils down to how experienced) you are with the lures in your possession. If you have lures you don't know much about, read about where they shine and then go have a practice session with them, figuring out what they do. Better, pay attention to fishing conditions you encounter, then go read up on (or ask) what lures shine in those types of conditions. Then get one or two and do your practice sessions.
If I'm using something I'm sure should work, then it may mean I haven't really found the fish yet, or I need to adjust the triggering -which may mean a different retrieve, or a lure change. If I'm still not catching, then I blame the fish, the lake, and the sky (LOL), meaning, I re-think parts of the above prescription; I've missed something. Maybe the majority of fish aren't still shallow, maybe they've dropped deeper now, or maybe my fish are right under that wind-blown algae on shore? Maybe they are feeding on bottom-gleaning bluegills and I need to try deeper. Maybe more speed, more aggressive triggering, more subtle... . Maybe they are holding just deep enough that with the new water color coupled with those thin clouds, the bass aren't seeing my topwater I need to go noisier, or slower, or subsurface. Maybe... You get the idea.
I suppose the bottom line is: If you aren't hitting them, there is a reason, and it's all about asking the right questions. I'd work on understanding what questions to ask.
Hopefully, when I finally find a bite, I let the fish tell me what details I need to adjust, to maximize the bite. I also watch conditions like a hawk so I can turn that corner with them. This is where I want to be and hopefully can get there before the sun goes down on me.
Not uncommonly, I've deduced several things that will work, and I'll switch rods on nearly consecutive casts: (i.e. Buzzer, slower topwater, swimming jig, free-falling tube). This'll often pull more fish out of a given spot than if I'd fished just one before moving on.
Lures are truly are tools, or maybe better, keys. They are not magic; the magic is in your knowledge of them and then ability to apply them in the right places at the right times which means knowing fish, water, and your own pieces of it. This isn't a precise science either. You may be able to apply a lure in a different way than another angler and make a key that fits a certain set of circumstances. In fact, if you get good at this you may find that making your own lure concoctions is the most satisfying. It's a nice place to be. It means you've grabbed the bait monkey by the b@!!$.
senko_77 reply :
Quotehey, i was just wondering, how long does it take for you guys to decide to change baits when something else is not working.i think i have a problem because i tend to stick to one bait for a very long time, even if it is not working. and when i do decide to change, i usually dont really know what would be the best thing to change to.
Stick to your confidence baits. Obviously, a topwater in 30 degree winter or something along those lines wont work, but if there is a reasonable chance it should work, and you have confidence in it, throw it, because it will work. You just have to find fish that will work with you and that sometimes takes a little while.
Goodluck bud
.dsaavedra. reply :
thanks so much! you guys are a great help.
QuoteI first try to decide where the fish are generally by season and in terms of actual lake lay-out (called location). Then I decide where in that location or structure they are -how close to cover, how high in the water column, etc...(this is called position). Then I try to determine what they are doing, their activity level -How easy they will be to dupe, how willing to chase they are, etc.. Essentially, I'm usually looking for the easiest fish to catch). Together these dictate the very basic controls: depth, speed.
how do you determine all that stuff?
Paul Roberts reply :
Start by doing some reading. This'll get you asking some relevant questions when you hit the water.
There's good information in the articles section of this site.
I'd also highly suggest the In-Fisherman Largemouth Bass Handbook of Strategies. Understanding how lake types, calendar periods, and bass activity, come together to make a days fishing, is the starting blocks.
Sam reply :
Dave,
When specific baits do not produce strikes you can do a number of things as stated above.
Try to keep it simple. Slow down or pick up your retrieve speed. Fish deep or shallow. Let your topwaters just sit there for about 20 to 30 seconds before you pop them. Use a scent on all plastics.
Consider "dead sticking" where you let your plastic worm just sit on the bottom for 60 to 180 seconds. Yes, it will drive you crazy, but give it a try.
If all else fails, put a bobber on your line and put a Gulp! worm on a small hook and fish it like you would a cane pole with the bait about 12 to 18 inches from the bobber. Go deeper if the fish are deeper.
May I suggest that you consider the following:
1. Scale down your bait size. Even big bass will hit little lures.
2. Look for shade from trees and fish the shade.
3. Go to Watermealon for plastic worms. For some reason, they like Watermealon for four-inch (4-inch) Senkos or a six-inch (six-inch)Watermealon Zoom or *** straight tail finesse worms or a four-inch (4-inch) Watermealon or Mocassin Blue Dead Ringers on a straight shank 2/0 lightweight hook.
4. Try a drop shot or a split shot rig with a small hook and a skinny six-inch (6-inch) Zoom finesse (or ***) worm.
5. Go Wacky with your Zoom finesse worms, too.
6. Throw a white or a pink trick worm and fish it like a snake on top of the water and over any grass or pads. If none, then just throw it out and fish it parallel to the shore or back to the shore. Use a 2/0 or 3/0 straight shank hook.
7. Try a small, skinny worm that bounces all over the place, like some of the *** and other worm brands out there. The skinner and bouncier the better.
8. Fish in the early mornings or late evenings and throw a buzzbait and your favorite topwaters.
If all this fails, get some dynamite and ........... ;D
Just keep on chucking those lures and reeling them back!
Remember, half the fun of fishing is finding the fish and then seeing what they want to eat.
But usually not in 100* heat so fish in the early AM or late evening.
Big-O reply :
QuoteI really don't change baits per say. I carry 8-15 rods with different lures or different sizes or weights and depending on the location; I will try most presentations in a particular area until I determine the fish are not biting or are not there. I never assume that I know what the most productive presentation will be and let the fish tell me what they want. The array of presentations that I start with is based on seasonal patterns.
X2 and this method gives you a fast understanding of the variety of patterns that the fish are in as well as helps you to adjust as the day and conditions change.
Well said Mr. Wayne.
Big O
.dsaavedra. reply :
Sam those are great tips! i will definitley try those. dead sticking sounds interesting. lol! i have done it with trick sticks before and it is usually pretty productive.
Catt reply :
I find one of the biggest problem many anglers have is they spend entirely too much time trying to find THE bait when they should be trying to find where the bass are located. I probably have the small selection of tackle of any body on the site but I have enough to cover the entire water column.
Instead of changing baits I change locations
Tin reply :
Listen to that little voice within young Saavedra.
detroit1 reply :
Thank you Paul Roberts for taking the time to share with us, that was alot of typing, but a Great read. I think Paul has been fishing for awile....
fishfordollars reply :
I feel it is not the bait but the location. When I hit a spot I may throw 3-5 different lures quickly as I try to locate them and then move on to my next spot. The fish will tell you what you need to be throwing. When you get bit then slow down and see if you can find the sweet spot or depth on each area. If it happens to be a point I will work my way in and around it being sure to present the lure at different angles. Angles are critical, but that's another subject.
Paul Roberts reply :
Angles, yes. And there are LOTS of "other subjects" to this question. Fishing (or let's say catching consistently) is a VERY complex game. But there are key things at work that shift in priority as the Earth spins, and the wind blows (to be poetic). Knowing how fish behave, how conditions alter things, and what lures do, puts you into the ballpark. The rest is fishing. Someday I hope to be able to just walk right out onto the pitcher's mound every time. Then, being a red-blooded male (with control issues LOL), I want to stand there and throw only strikes. Oh well, I'm at least within the diamond most of the time now, and still working on my pitching.
Catt reply :
Simplicity is the key; bass live such a simple live that it goes straight over most anglers' heads.
Consistently catching bass is a process of elimination and duplication. Eliminate patterns and waters that are non-productive and duplicate patterns and waters that are productive.
Paul Roberts reply :
Catt,
KISS works, but only some of the time.
I have to ask:
Do you ever go out there and just don't know why a bite turned on, or shut down? Or do you just not ask why? Sure, you can go try to scrounge up another pattern. But wouldn't it be great to know a lot of those why's? If you knew why, you'd put yourself in position to predict it. A lot of natural events are (loosely) cyclical, and if you know the particulars that lead to an event, you'll recognize them again.
Yes, pattern fishing works, but in spite of itself.
I want to know the "Why's". It's the question that leads to deeper understanding, than "How" and "When".
firefightn15 reply :
PR, the why's are an age old question concerning bass. I have resigned myself to the fact that if half the world's biologists can't understand why the bass will just "shut down", I never will. When this happens, I just pretend that I am fishing for something else.
.dsaavedra. reply :
many of you have said "find the fish and the fish will tell you what they want".
i have a problem with this.
if do not hook any bass, you have no success to build off of, so you cant find what is working.
take this example.
you are in a small lake, you are throwing a crank. you spend 10 min in this one cove, nothing. so you move to the next cove, nothing. you continue this until you cover the entire lake with no bites at all. well the fish have to be in there somewhere, so it is inevitable that you have "found fish" you just dont know where. how will you know what the fish want if you have no feed back from them?
hope my little example wasnt too confusing. ;D
weknowhowtolive reply :
Ugh this is ALWAYS where I am. If you've found the fish you probably dont need to change baitsQuotemany of you have said "find the fish and the fish will tell you what they want".i have a problem with this.
if do not hook any bass, you have no success to build off of, so you cant find what is working.
take this example.
you are in a small lake, you are throwing a crank. you spend 10 min in this one cove, nothing. so you move to the next cove, nothing. you continue this until you cover the entire lake with no bites at all. well the fish have to be in there somewhere, so it is inevitable that you have "found fish" you just dont know where. how will you know what the fish want if you have no feed back from them?
hope my little example wasnt too confusing. ;D
.dsaavedra. reply :
QuoteUgh this is ALWAYS where I am. If you've found the fish you probably dont need to change baits
thats exactly what im sayin! its like, how do you know what the fish want if you cant get bit at all.
Sam reply :
Dave,
Fishing is hunting.
Yes, but not with a gun. With your mind and tackle.
You have to know the habits of fish under specific circumstances. That is why we have the various lure and technique variations during different seasons.
You are the hunter. You have to find your prey. That is Rule Number One.
You have to know your prey's habits and thinking and food preference.
You have to search for them based on a number of factors that you have to compute in your mind, use your logic and make some choices.
If you cannot find the bass shallow, then go deep.
If you cannot get a hit on a crankbait then go with a plastic.
If no plastic hits, try a jig and pig.
If no jig and pig bite, go with a Chatterbait and then a Rat-L-Trap and then a topwater and then a grub and then a tube, etc., etc. etc.
If you cannot get a hit on a specific color than change colors.
If you cannot get a hit with one presentation then change presentations.
It is your responsibility to locate the fish. The fish will be in different places each hour of the day. Some roam around the shoreline. Some have their "milk run" and move from favorite spot to favorite spot. Some just stay put in a specific area. Others follow their migration routes and go from deep to shallow to deep to shallow to deep, etc. Others follow the baitfish like bream, bluegills and minnows.
So you have to be a hunter. A smart hunter. A hunter who knows the bass' habits and favorite food and what time of day they are the most active and what is the structure in your pond and is there any cover that the bass can and will enjoy during the day and what is the weather and water clarity and where is the oxygen, etc.
Each day is a new adventure. You know that what worked last year, last month, last week or yesterday may not work today. So it is your task to do all you can to find the fish.
Once you find them, write it down when you get home. All the details you can so next year on the same day you can see what you did a year earlier. And add to your diary each year and you will have a volumn of wonderful data to use in the future on you favorite pond.
Now go out and do some hunting.
You know they are there and they know you are there so which one of you is going to win? The big human with a large brain and the option to use reason, logic and memory or the bass with a brain the size of a marble and the option of instinct?
Sorry, but I'll put my money on the bass!!! ;D
Have fun and always outfish your dad.
.dsaavedra. reply :
sam that is a great post. that helps a bunch.
i understand what you're saying about when a crank doesnt work go to a plastic, etc.
but what does it take to know that a simply will not produce?
that is my problem, i can be fishing a crank and think it will work but i could go all day still thinkin it will work but it doesnt work.
when is it time to call it quits on a bait and switch to another?
i am pretty good at outfishing my dad though . sometimes i feel kinda bad about it ;D.
Paul Roberts reply :
Quoteyou are in a small lake, you are throwing a crank. you spend 10 min in this one cove, nothing. so you move to the next cove, nothing. you continue this until you cover the entire lake with no bites at all. well the fish have to be in there somewhere, so it is inevitable that you have "found fish" you just dont know where. how will you know what the fish want if you have no feed back from them?
Often anglers slightly under-confident in what they are specifically doing will fail to hit fish on the first good point and then it's downhill from there.
This is a time to change. Not necessarily away from the crank though. I'm willing to bet (because I've done it too and see it often) that if you don't hit fish soon you begin doubting. Which leads to a lack of concentration. Which often results in your fishing too fast. It's easy to fish a crank too fast. It's the main reason people fail with crankbaits I think. "crankbait" just calls for speed right? Wrong -much of the time. Sometime speed is great, when you have active aggressive fish willing to chase. But this is probably accounts for about 20% of the time. The rest of the time fish it like a jig, interspersed with accelerations, deflections, and rips.
I'd suggest that you could continue with that crank around the lake making sure you are fishing it accurately (banging stuff, ripping walls) and slow crawling in between. If no go then I would assume the bass are not at the depth you are fishing and switch cranks to a medium to check higher in the water column.
I'd then try a shallow crank over the cover.
You can check a lot of water with a few cranks. But you really have to be deliberate.
A tell tale sign that you are either too fast, (absent-mindedly) or putting fish down (is it sunny with clear water?), is that you don't even catch any small fish.
If still no go then change locations entirely -go to real shallow overhead cover and check things out with...what the water calls for. Or try deep. In general, in most waters, fish are shalllow ot higher in th ewater column early in teh year and deeper later.
Lastly go back to your starting point and fish something entirely different from the crank.
If still no go, you are probably out of time and must simply suck it up. There's always tomorrow.
gravyfor3 reply :
i like to try several baits to find the best one so i change pretty frequently
fishfordollars reply :
Quotemany of you have said "find the fish and the fish will tell you what they want".i have a problem with this.
if do not hook any bass, you have no success to build off of, so you cant find what is working.
take this example.
you are in a small lake, you are throwing a crank. you spend 10 min in this one cove, nothing. so you move to the next cove, nothing. you continue this until you cover the entire lake with no bites at all. well the fish have to be in there somewhere, so it is inevitable that you have "found fish" you just dont know where. how will you know what the fish want if you have no feed back from them?
hope my little example wasnt too confusing. ;D
Maybe the fish are telling you that they are not in the coves. If you fish each cove all you have done is reinforced the theory that that is not where they are that day. Maybe you should have started fishing the points instead or move out on the creek or river channels. Keep moving and trying different locations to pinpoint the location. When you do get bit try to imagine all of the other locations just like that and duplicate them. It makes no sense to keep fishing each cove with a crankbait all day if you have not been bit there.
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