New graphs too good for tournaments? 2024
Kevinator1 reply :
Maybe most guys will disagree with me on this but does anyone else think that the new fishfinders / graphs are almost too good for bass tournaments? I think it kind of takes away the fun to a certain point in finding fish with lures. You see on tv guys just dropping a bait down to the fish and watching them come up and hit their lure like a video game. I know that just because you find them it doesn't mean you will always catch them but it's a huge advantage and almost takes the fun out of it to a point. (unless you win money!) Give me your opinions on it.
JediAmoeba reply :
I think they are too good, period.
It has really changed the face of ice fishing to a point it is almost ridiculous. In semi-shallow lakes a few guys can get a good scope of the water in very short order, set up on the fish and destroy them.
You take the modern 3d graphs with a few guys and electric augers and they can clean out small bodies of water ice fishing...
GreenPig reply :
Too good? What? I love my Solix 15 SI GPS Bluetooth and 360 imaging on my little jon boat. As far as I know nobody is forced to use them. You can grab a can pole a be a minimalist but it'll be slightly harder to get a check.
Tennessee Boy reply :
On Kentucky Lake (my home lake) it seems like every major pro tournament in recent memory has been won on the ledges by someone that relied heavily on electronics to find the fish. However, tournament fishing at the highest level is changing. It seems to me that most BPT tournament are won on the bank where electronics are less of a factor. Yes, there are plenty of exceptions. If I was fishing a tournament in May on Kentucky lake with a five fish limit I would be idling around offshore staring at my electronic to find fish. If I was fishing a BPT style tournament, I would be throwing a trickworm along the bank.
For me personally, electronics add to the fun but sometimes I feel like I'm cheating when I drive straight to a spot that I can remember spending half an hour looking for in the old days.
Johnbt reply :
Hmm. If you're getting paid for catching fish, shouldn't you be required to have a commercial fishing license? It's a business, right?
Craig P reply :
Tournaments, it’s just keeping up with the Jones’ so to speak but for the everyday angler, I think it takes the fun out of fishing.
I can see the allure the first couple of times using something like livescope but I could also see me getting bored with it quickly. I’ve seen a fair share of people selling their livescopes after just 6 months, I assume it is because the allure wore out.
12poundbass reply :
You still have to catch them. You still see pros almost every tournament blank, or not catch a limit. They’re just another tool like everything else.
WRB reply :
Sounds like a commit from the early '70's! "Fish Finders should be outlawed" was a common theme back in the early days of using sonar like flashers and paper graphs to locate bass.
Tom
Logan S reply :
The number of days where modern electronics make things 'too easy' is far less than the number days where they don't.
The success is still coming from the skill of the angler, not the gear. You don't need the latest and greatest in order to be effective...Even 'base model' electronics now have accurate mapping, side imaging, and down imaging available. No matter what electronics you have, if you put in the time to utilize them effectively you'll be far ahead of the vast majority of anglers out there - even those with nicer/newer units. You'd be surprised how few people actually take full advantage of all the technology they have.
I look at it as developing another technique...So I think limiting or banning them just punishes those anglers that are willing to work harder than others by becoming skilled with them.
MN Fisher reply :
On 11/6/2019 at 10:00 AM, Logan S said:Even 'base model' electronics now have accurate mapping, side imaging, and down imaging available.
Errr - where are those options on my Hook 2-4 (it's not even the X with GPS).
Logan S reply :
On 11/6/2019 at 10:08 AM, MN Fisher said:Errr - where are those options on my Hook 2-4 (it's not even the X with GPS).
What I mean is that the significant features of modern electronics don't have a huge cost barrier anymore...Obviously not every model comes with them and things like Livescope are still pretty expensive, but overall you can get into a setup that will map and scan pretty effectively for affordable prices.
MN Fisher reply :
On 11/6/2019 at 11:08 AM, Logan S said:but overall you can get into a setup that will map and scan pretty effectively for affordable prices.
Kidding - but I do follow contour maps too...just with the I-Boating app on my Android. Maps with GPS, I can set waypoints too. Record of my trip on 31 July where I caught the bass in my profile pic...black line shows my route that day.
Tablet sits in the mount shown here on the right side.
WRB reply :
Our bicentennial year 1976 I modified a tackle box to house my paper graph for a fishing trip to my inlaws in Minnesota for a vacation to Lake of the Woods, Ont Canada.
Minnesota had a pending regulation to outlaw sonar units and Ontario already limited sonar use, so I smuggled my unit into Cananda. My inlaws didn't know and wouldn't have approved thinking it was cheating. That was the mind set back in the 70's and I am surprised to see it resurface.
Tom
Dirtyeggroll reply :
Far less sophisticated 'tools' have been banned, for example - the A-rig.
MN Fisher reply :
On 11/7/2019 at 2:55 AM, Dirtyeggroll said:Far less sophisticated 'tools' have been banned, for example - the A-rig.
They're illegal to use in MN at any time unless only one (1) of the arms has a hook...the rest have to be hookless.
12poundbass reply :
On 11/7/2019 at 3:06 AM, MN Fisher said:They're illegal to use in MN at any time unless only one (1) of the arms has a hook...the rest have to be hookless.
Do you guys have smelt? I’m pretty sure you can use several hooks here in Michigan for smelt. Can you in Minnesota? If yes how would that be different than an A-rig?
MN Fisher reply :
On 11/7/2019 at 3:15 AM, 12poundbass said:Do you guys have smelt? I’m pretty sure you can use several hooks here in Michigan for smelt. Can you in Minnesota? If yes how would that be different than an A-rig?
I don't know about hook-n-line for smelt. Here in MN, there's no closed season, no limit, and most people use dip-nets. Seine nets are legal to use in certain places.
12poundbass reply :
On 11/7/2019 at 3:28 AM, MN Fisher said:I don't know about hook-n-line for smelt. Here in MN, there's no closed season, no limit, and most people use dip-nets. Seine nets are legal to use in certain places.
Most dip net them here too. I’m pretty sure they catch them through the ice too.
Catt reply :
Every tournament there are guys in $70,000 bass boats that can't put fish in the livewell.
Catt reply :
WALKER COUNTY LAKE CATFISH TOURNAMENT ANGLERS CRYING FOUL AFTER 70 YEAR OLD WOMAN WINS TOURNAMENT WITH A CANE POLE AND A ZIPLOCK BAG FULL OF GRAVY TRAIN
JASPER - Participants in the annual Walker County Lake Catfish Tournament are crying foul tonight after a 70 year old Jasper woman bested the next closest competitor by 12 lbs while using nothing but a cane pole, and Gravy Train dog food for bait.
One competitor with whom we spoke had this to say, "I have the very best catfishing equipment that money can buy, the best boat, the best rods, the best electronics. There ain't no way that old lady beat me with a stick and some dog food, no way. Something smells fishy here, and it ain't my stinkbait."
Others say that it is not unusual for "Ms. Minnie" as she is lovingly called by lake patrons to weigh in her limit at least five days a week.
"Ms. Minnie sure can catch 'em. She always leaves the lake with enough catfish, and shellcrackers to feed five people. Ms. Minnie wouldn't cheat, those men just ain't as good at fishing as they think they are."
Mobasser reply :
Bass fishing is always changing, and has been for a long time. I remember when graphite rods first came out. Some people thought they should not be allowed. Too light, fast, sensitive? There's always guys who catch fish, and those that dont. A hi tech graph might help some folks, but it won't make any difference to others
On 11/8/2019 at 6:26 AM, Catt said:WALKER COUNTY LAKE CATFISH TOURNAMENT ANGLERS CRYING FOUL AFTER 70 YEAR OLD WOMAN WINS TOURNAMENT WITH A CANE POLE AND A ZIPLOCK BAG FULL OF GRAVY TRAIN
JASPER - Participants in the annual Walker County Lake Catfish Tournament are crying foul tonight after a 70 year old Jasper woman bested the next closest competitor by 12 lbs while using nothing but a cane pole, and Gravy Train dog food for bait.
One competitor with whom we spoke had this to say, "I have the very best catfishing equipment that money can buy, the best boat, the best rods, the best electronics. There ain't no way that old lady beat me with a stick and some dog food, no way. Something smells fishy here, and it ain't my stinkbait."
Others say that it is not unusual for "Ms. Minnie" as she is lovingly called by lake patrons to weigh in her limit at least five days a week.
"Ms. Minnie sure can catch 'em. She always leaves the lake with enough catfish, and shellcrackers to feed five people. Ms. Minnie wouldn't cheat, those men just ain't as good at fishing as they think they are."
Catt, this is funny! That old lady has probably been fishing this way for Lord knows how long, and catching fish too. Some guys over think it.
JediAmoeba reply :
Everyone is throwing up some odd rare stories...sure, it CAN happen but overall the electronics are needed to consistently catch fish day in day out. Especially when you are talking big, deep water. I really have no problem with it on huge reservoirs and big lakes.
My entire problem with electronics, as I mentioned is more in regards to hard water or ice fishing on smaller bodies of water. In the winter with all the vegetation virtually gone and the water clear as can be, with these newer 3d models, you can literally find all the fish. It's very easy to pinpoint them, sit there and hammer them. The fish arent moving a great deal and they bunch up. This is my main concern with electronics. Especially when 90% of ice fisherman throw everything in the bucket. For this reason alone I would like to see the electronics you can use limited.
Catt reply :
On 11/8/2019 at 6:52 AM, JediAmoeba said:Everyone is throwing up some odd rare stories...sure, it CAN happen but overall the electronics are needed to consistently catch fish day in day out. Especially when you are talking big, deep water. I really have no problem with it on huge reservoirs and big lakes.
I fish Toledo Bend, 190,000 surface acres, my electronics is a Lowrance HOOK2-4x GPS Bullet, basic fish finder & GPS system, offering Wide-Angle Broadband sonar & a GPS plotter.
MN Fisher reply :
On 11/8/2019 at 9:48 AM, Catt said:
I fish Toledo Bend, 190,000 surface acres, my electronics is a Lowrance HOOK2-4x GPS Bullet, basic fish finder & GPS system, offering Wide-Angle Broadband sonar & a GPS plotter.
Other than the GPS, that's my unit. For the plotter - I-Boating app on the 8" tablet. 'Tonka is only 14,528 acres.
WRB reply :
On 11/8/2019 at 6:52 AM, JediAmoeba said:Everyone is throwing up some odd rare stories...sure, it CAN happen but overall the electronics are needed to consistently catch fish day in day out. Especially when you are talking big, deep water. I really have no problem with it on huge reservoirs and big lakes.
My entire problem with electronics, as I mentioned is more in regards to hard water or ice fishing on smaller bodies of water. In the winter with all the vegetation virtually gone and the water clear as can be, with these newer 3d models, you can literally find all the fish. It's very easy to pinpoint them, sit there and hammer them. The fish arent moving a great deal and they bunch up. This is my main concern with electronics. Especially when 90% of ice fisherman throw everything in the bucket. For this reason alone I would like to see the electronics you can use limited.
Tell Dee Thomas, he managed to change how bass anglers fish using a 12' flipping pole without a reel and fished from a 15' aluminum boat, no electronics.
Today Dee still fishes local tournaments in his 80's, he does have a more comfortable bass boat but rarely uses any electronics. Dee is usually cashing a check, wins a few and had big bass for his local circuit last year at 12+ lbs.
Bass Fishing Hall of Fame angler, the father of flipping.
Tom
SC53 reply :
Those electronics aren’t a lot of help in 5’ of water or less.
That’s where the majority of bass are caught...at least down here.
WRB reply :
If you mean sonar I would tend to agree but today's electronics include GPS with maps and way points are helpful. For example a fisherman who is on bass at the Big O could send me his way points and I could go there without ever have fished the lake before. I could find it in the fog with a good nav map.
Tom
MittenMouth reply :
On 11/6/2019 at 6:02 AM, Johnbt said:Hmm. If you're getting paid for catching fish, shouldn't you be required to have a commercial fishing license? It's a business, right?
A competition is different than commerce.
Johnbt reply :
I compete with my buddies every time we go fishing, but there are no prizes. Only bragging rights.
Otoh, there are folks who make their living fishing tournaments. It's not recreational fishing imo. That's all they do. Look at the stickers on their boats and clothes. They're participating in commerce of some sort. They're supposed to declare their income on their taxes.
Sort of like the difference between a person who rents a table at a gun show to sell his guns vs a guy who goes to every gun show and buys and sells to make his living and doesn't have an FFL. There's a gray line in there somewhere.
Hammer 4 reply :
On 11/14/2019 at 11:39 PM, Johnbt said:I compete with my buddies every time we go fishing, but there are no prizes. Only bragging rights.
Otoh, there are folks who make their living fishing tournaments. It's not recreational fishing imo. That's all they do. Look at the stickers on their boats and clothes. They're participating in commerce of some sort. They're supposed to declare their income on their taxes.
Sort of like the difference between a person who rents a table at a gun show to sell his guns vs a guy who goes to every gun show and buys and sells to make his living and doesn't have an FFL. There's a gray line in there somewhere.
But, the folks who fish in tournaments Don't keep what they catch, If they did, then I could see your point. Commercial fishermen Sell what they catch.
Bird reply :
Then there are those that are addicted to electronics spending a portion of the day simply playing. Lol
I run into a guy often on my local lake always zoned in on his MANY mounted electronics and seldom see him fishing.....really nice guy though.
I released my PB as he approached to chit chat and he spent hours scanning for it.
I kept telling him " he ain't gonna bite again ".
WRB reply :
You factor in the seasonal period you are fishing how much time to dedicate to searching for bait and or bass using your sonar.
If you know it's the spawn and bass are on beds your sonar search time is limited and visual search time extended.
During cold water periods your sonar search time is extended trying to locate bait and bass in deeper water takes more time because it's a wider search area then the warmer water periods of summer and early fall.
Without sonar only the spawn cycle you can visually find bass without fishing for them.
Tom
gimruis reply :
Most common anglers can’t afford to upgrade their electronics every year when a new feature comes out. I know I can’t.
MN Fisher reply :
On 11/18/2019 at 10:13 AM, gimruis said:Most common anglers can’t afford to upgrade their electronics every year when a new feature comes out. I know I can’t.
In a few years I might upgrade from where I am now - but it'll be a big decision that'd take most if not all of my yearly fishing budget.
WRB reply :
Online upgrades to your current unit is free and mine is 2009 vintage, the maps are up to date.
Tom
MN Fisher reply :
On 11/18/2019 at 10:31 AM, WRB said:Online upgrades to your current unit is free and mine is 2009 vintage, the maps are up to date.
Tom
Oh? They can upgrade and add maps to my Hook2-4? Neat. (sarcasm off)
WRB reply :
On 11/18/2019 at 10:37 AM, MN Fisher said:Oh? They can upgrade and add maps to my Hook2-4? Neat. (sarcasm off)
I do have a advantage as Don Iovino does all my updates for me.
Do you want to find out what is available for your units call Don.
Tom
MN Fisher reply :
On 11/18/2019 at 12:25 PM, WRB said:I do have a advantage as Don Iovino does all my updates for me.
Do you want to find out what is available for your units call Don.
Tom
Catch the sarcasm? It's a base Hook 2-4, not even GPS on it, less than a year old. The only 'updates' this unit could have is a replacement.
WRB reply :
On 11/18/2019 at 9:04 PM, MN Fisher said:Catch the sarcasm? It's a base Hook 2-4, not even GPS on it, less than a year old. The only 'updates' this unit could have is a replacement.
I don't have the time to read between the lines so tongue in cheek content or sarcasm gets overlooked.
Tom
Chief250 reply :
On 11/6/2019 at 5:02 AM, Kevinator1 said:Maybe most guys will disagree with me on this but does anyone else think that the new fishfinders / graphs are almost too good for bass tournaments? I think it kind of takes away the fun to a certain point in finding fish with lures. You see on tv guys just dropping a bait down to the fish and watching them come up and hit their lure like a video game. I know that just because you find them it doesn't mean you will always catch them but it's a huge advantage and almost takes the fun out of it to a point. (unless you win money!) Give me your opinions on it.
I'm guess you're not running these "too good" electronics
jaimeastin reply :
I have been using electronics since I started kayak fishing. I got a boat a couple years ago and put in nicer electronics... Then I upgraded all of them again to go with livescope. I put in a lot of time learning the units... I mainly did it so I could be completive in tournaments. last thing I need, maybe should have been first is a trolling motor with spotlock.
Thing is, I make it a HABIT to still fish sans electronics. Be it on the shore, my kayaks, float tubes, and my boat. I will fish without taking them or turning them on. You have to still have the skills to fish and know things based on season, nature, and experience. I will leave my graphs at home or just bring one of my smaller units. I never want to be in a position were I think I cannot fish because I do not have X. Like that woman in the picture... I grew up fishing like this and I know people that will whoop the pants off of some of us with a cane pole... My aunt and grandmother being one of them... never use electronics and always catch good fish, PERIOD.
I was talking with an older tournament fisherman a few months back. We discussed this very thing. Using the old methods still work today. mainly you need to know the depth and contours. Find the bait fish... Things like that. Now,
when I am on the boat, even if I do not want to use sonar for fishing, I use the GPS and maps. Man.. The water level is dropping and I fish at night a lot. A few months ago, I went over a spot that made me think the graph was incorrect. I thought, no way is this that shallow. I went back a month ago before sun down and I saw the exposed rocks. GPS is great for not only marking fish, but getting back the same way you came.
Oregon Native reply :
I love my nine's on my Vexus and will probably never upgrade...this is in the cards. Do I use them every time on the lake....no. Planning on fishing a couple bucket list lakes and will look forward to using them so i don't run over rocks. Like watching fishing shows.....just as much too as I like watching fishing shows on my nine's. Well...it's better... I can "sometimes" catch those fish I see on the nine's.
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