Lost integrity? Or just misplaced? 2024
bassin73 reply :
I am writing this letter knowing full well that it is going to create controversy among many. There are also those that are going to agree with me.
32+ years ago I started full time, a life long endeavor of supporting what I consider the greatest, healthiest, and most fun hobby in my life. When I graduated high school in 73, I lived on Toledo Bend, outside of Zwolle, La. I tended bar at the Sportsman Club. I was around a lot of tournaments, and the patriarchs of the beginning of B.A.S.S. But didn't get involved in the sport like I am today. Bass fishing is my earthly passion. There are only a few things in my life that are more important to me than bass fishing. I am the kind of guy that tries to stay in the middle of the road, so to speak. I am a realist, and know with good, along comes bad. There's no way to avoid it. I am going to shed some light on this subject that not everyone knows, or hasn't thought about, but is present non the less. Along the way I am going to mention names for example reason's only. In the 40+ years of being around, and involved with this grand sport, I have seen it morph from an organization created to promote responsible handling of the species, comradery among men, and along the way teach our young people responsibility with the resources we were born with. I understood B.A.S.S. to be for responsible behavior toward the resources, and species. It was a win, win deal. Those in the beginning that had a vision of something better, started the sport we now have. Great, well maybe. Along with notoriety comes corruption. I have watched small entry fees split in 3 ways, turn into million dollar winnings. Anytime there is that much money involved there is going to be fraud, cheating and corruption. We all have heard stories about incidents involving that. I have watched this sport grow from it's beginning (a really good thing) to full blown sponsorship, all about the money thing. Integrity sort of gets sidelined when big money, and mega million dollar sponsor's come into the picture. When Nascar dropped it's affiliation with Winston because of the dangers of tobacco and it's harm to folks health, most folks applauded it for obvious reasons. I think that B.A.S.S, and the bass fishing community should do the same thing. I, believe that by accepting big money to promote liquor, tobacco and such sponsorship, is sending the wrong message to the young ones we are trying to pass along our way of life. If we go along with this as adults, then the young fisher people will think that it's alright for them to move forward in that direction also. I recently dropped my subscription with Bassmaster the magazine for this reason. I know that if children, and young folks pick up these magazines, (and they do), and see these liquor, smokeless tobacco, and cigarette advertisements, they will think nothing about it's dangers. We as adults need to set the example, and not promote these habits, and products. We can still have fun teaching bass fishing, and passing on the fine art of this sport, without sending the wrong message. While I am on the subject of sending the wrong messages to our children, I would like to address the issue of correct behavior when fishing in front of children. There are those that have very little self control of there anger in public. I have witnessed heated arguments, near fights, and literally temper tantrums among our so called idols. One incident I recall, I remember one angler (pro) didn't even slow down his boat when passing another angler fishing in a nationally televised tournament. Really! What kind of message is that to be sending to young folks? They break rods, throw things down in the boat, and scream hateful things at others, even animals. This is supposed to be fun, and relaxing. If we don't learn self control when the cameras are on, I can only imagine what happens when they are off. One more thing, The specie that we love and seek religiously (bass), are being released back into the water wrong. I believe it's called catch and release, not unhook and throw. C'mon guy's, if you are in that much of a hurry to cast again, that you don't release it overboard the right way, especially in front of our children, and on camera, what kind of example, and message are we teaching the ones that follow. Well enough said. I have been wanting to speak up for years, I just didn't know how, or where to say it. Thank God for The Bass Resource Guide forum. I have a lot of respect and admiration for the following fishermen, they are a credit to the sport, and are what it really about. To start, my thanks to Ray Scott for creating, and the vision of B.A.S.S. Next the fine men I admire. Gary Kline, Mark Davis, Mark Rose, Shaw Grigsby, Andy Montgomery, Hank Parker, Bill Dance, and Gerry McGinnis. These men, along with others are some of the real ambassadors of bass fishing. My hats off to them. Whose going to fill there shoes when there gone?
Thanks, smallmouth55
A-Jay reply :
One doesn't lose integrity ~ it's given away.
Good Values should be taught, learned & reinforced at home, not a fishing tournament.
Disagreement is not disrespect. If & when my beliefs are not in line with a certain affiliation, separating myself from it seems appropriate.
A-Jay
WRB reply :
B.A.S.S. started out using blind draw to reduce cheating during tournaments because cheating was already a problem for cash prize derbies before Ray Scott started bass.
The 1st 5 years B.A.S.S. had 15 bass limit that were killed eaten after the events.
Ray Scott had to step down as B.A.S.S. president do to fraud handing the reigns over.
When ESPN purchased B.A.S.S. they changed the format and incorgaged high speed boat racing. Gerald Swindle, this years AOY was the angler who ran full speed through anglers who were stopped fishing during ESPN's era. Swindle changed seeing the error and has become a genuine good sportsmen the sport is proud of.
Abosultly correct in stating big cash purses leads to corruption in every sport, the bass tournament format today makes cheating nearly impossible during major events where big payouts are available.
As we get older we see things differently and I don't believe integrity has been lost or misplaced.
If you love the sport, give back to it.
Tom
Columbia Craw reply :
Your argument or view could be presented to address youth football, little league baseball, motocross and so on. In every sport including outdoor sports, where there is some form of competition, sponsors will seek to capitolize it to sell product. It's a reality you cannot escape.
Poor behavior, corrupt behavior, lack or integrity, the absence of common courtesy, lack of sportsmanship is found everywhere. I am accountable for my behavior, teaching my children and grandchildren proper values and modeling those behaviors consistently. "A good name is to be valued more than fine gold." I agree with you that there is plenty of room for improvement and sending a better message. WELCOME to BR !!!
Doug
Glenn reply :
Whelp, as with all sports, hobbies, and recreational activities, there's positive and negative things that happen. You can't control what others do, but it's your choice whether to focus on the positive or the negative.
I choose the positive.
the reel ess reply :
As for the sinful sponsorships, where do you draw the line? There are as many people killing themselves with fat foods and baked goods as there are with alcohol. As for the bad behavior, I think BASS has done a good job not tolerating it. I recall the fight between Ish and another angler and the time Ike kicked his American flag. The federation deals harshly when its anglers embarrass them all. When the reward is high people will find themselves morally flexible.
I do see guys who would run their mother over to fish a spot though. That's a gray area and has always been an issue, even before tourneys.
HoosierHawgs reply :
On 1/1/2017 at 6:58 AM, the reel ess said:As for the sinful sponsorships, where do you draw the line? There are as many people killing themselves with fat foods and baked goods as there are with alcohol. As for the bad behavior, I think BASS has done a good job not tolerating it. I recall the fight between Ish and another angler and the time Ike kicked his American flag. The federation deals harshly when its anglers embarrass them all. When the reward is high people will find themselves morally flexible.
I do see guys who would run their mother over to fish a spot though. That's a gray area and has always been an issue, even before tourneys.
I think that the sponsors may actually be a good way to deal with some of these things. When Ike "acted up" (which included a full tantrum trying to revive a dead fish, cursing at his boat and livewell system, and then kicking an American flag) he was "dropped" by multiple sponsors who did not what that behavior to be representative of their brand. It is the same way in other professional sports. If a sponsor does not agree with your behavior they will not hesitate to drop you. If you violate your code of conduct your team will suspend you or even fire you (think Duke and Grayson Allen, suspended indefinitely for poor court behavior). These reactions from sponsors show that bad behavior will not be tolerated and sends a strong message to all who are sponsored to watch their mouths and actions.
the reel ess reply :
On 1/1/2017 at 5:48 AM, WRB said:B.A.S.S. started out using blind draw to reduce cheating during tournaments because cheating was already a problem for cash prize derbies before Ray Scott started bass.
The 1st 5 years B.A.S.S. had 15 bass limit that were killed eaten after the events.
Ray Scott had to step down as B.A.S.S. president do to fraud handing the reigns over.
When ESPN purchased B.A.S.S. they changed the format and incorgaged high speed boat racing. Gerald Swindle, this years AOL was the angler who ran full speed through anglers who were stopped fishing during ESPN's era. Swindle changed seeing the error and has become a genuine good sportsmen the sport is proud of.
Abosultly correct in stating big cash purses leads to corruption in every sport, the bass tournament format today makes cheating nearly impossible during major events where big payouts are available.
As we get older we see things differently and I don't believe integrity has been lost or misplaced.
If you love the sport, give back to it.
Tom
Absolutely. I recall G-Man, Ike, Ish and Hackney all being reprimanded in some way (the pocketbook mostly) and they all seem to be doing alright. None of them agreed with the penalty at the time, but a person can take that punishment like a man or they can miss the point of it entirely.
I still like all these guys and value their advice. But I respect G-Man most. I think he has become a better person over the last few years. And he has had a few obstacles to overcome.
bassin73 reply :
Thanks for the feedback folks. I think that where there's a will, there is a way. People of low esteem, and lack of integrity will try anyway possible to gain an edge, even if that means hiring others to aid in winning big money. As in the instance of those two anglers who stuffed split shot down bass's throat for weight. Or have others fish off limit body's of water for them before tournaments. I believe Rick brought to light the fact that anglers that have big sponsorship backing have an unfair advantage over those who don't. I remember when homework, talent, and confidence won tournaments. With today's electronics, gadgets, and GPS locators, it's not really fair competition for those less fortunate that don't have big money backing. I fished tournaments where it took sweat, determination, and talent to win. But in those days when I won or lost, I felt good about it, and slept well. Now I fish for fun. It's better that way.
Lyman X reply :
I think someone has Swindle and Skeet mixed up. Not sure though. Could be both.
MassYak85 reply :
I'll just speak to the Bassmaster magazine aspect of this. Do I like the fact they have tobacco advertisements? No. But any literate human being should be able to look at the ad and see in the 32 size bolded font "MAY CAUSE CANCER" and come to a reasonable conclusion about the risks of using said product. If you think it warrants canceling the subscription to show you displeasure, that's fine, I don't blame you. BUT, canceling your subscription alone is not going to get that message across. Sure, you hit them where it hurts, there wallets...but all they see is a loss of subscriptions for some unknown reason. They aren't going to assume it's because of the ads, most likely they will assume they need to make a change in the contents of the magazine to attract more people. So if the reason you canceled is the ads you need to write or email them and tell them that, otherwise your canceled subscription does nothing to further the cause you are trying to support.
Chowderhead reply :
On 1/1/2017 at 9:28 AM, MassYak85 said:Sure, you hit them where it hurts, there wallets...but all they see is a loss of subscriptions for some unknown reason. They aren't going to assume it's because of the ads, most likely they will assume they need to make a change in the contents of the magazine to attract more people. So if the reason you canceled is the ads you need to write or email them and tell them that, otherwise your canceled subscription does nothing to further the cause you are trying to support.
Agreed -- explain what the problem is and then see if there is a change.
bassin73 reply :
I didn't cancel my subscription to get there attention, I cancelled it out of my own convictions. I wrote this letter on Bass Resource Guide for that reason. You will be surprised how much attention this site gets. Maybe, just maybe the message will find it's way to the right persons that can make the changes. I know the right things to do, our children do not. I realize good things take time. But, I would love it if this forum brings about any good changes, no matter how long it takes.
OCdockskipper reply :
I find that chastising companies for who sponsors or advertises with them to be a slippery slope. Do you choose to never watch ABC because they ran a Hillary or Trump ad? Companies are in business to make money, not be forced to be moral arbitrators of our society. If the product is legal, then who am I to discriminate against them having the right to advertise their products like other companies? I don't have to buy their products, that is punishment enough.
I do agree with you on releasing fish. I do understand that flipping a fish back into the water from a standing position may not hurt them, but it is awful optics. It makes the angler look as if he has total disdain for his prey, pitching it the same way you would a piece of trash into a garbage pail. BASS pro David Walker wrote an article defending the practice, but his actions show a hypocrisy. When David Walker is penalized for bringing a dead fish to a weigh-in, he goes above & beyond trying to keep those fish alive. He doesn't just toss them in the live well or weigh in bag. Only when there is no penalty for potential damage to a fish (when he releases them), does his attitude change as to their handling.
blckshirt98 reply :
Once something competitive becomes a viable profession, you'll always have that group of people that will abuse it. The alcohol/tobacco ads I can see the disdain for but until the sport grows to the point where other sponsors can pony up the same kind of money they're going to stick around.
Catt reply :
The pharmaceutical lobby refers to the representatives of large pharmaceutical and biomedicine companies who seek to influence governments, the media and other institutions in favour of the pharmaceutical industry and its products.
This is a bigger problem than tobacco & alcohol combined!
Where's all the hate?
One can not properly address the issues without talking politics & religion!
the reel ess reply :
I can't very well criticize the alcohol ads when I greatly enjoy a good beer or two.
Catt reply :
The loss or misplacement of integrity starts at home!
bassin73 reply :
Integrity is something one acquires over a period of time through moral behavior, and practice of values that is upstanding. It can be earned, or lost according to one's lifestyle. The letter I posted, basically was concerning the example that our young people are watching, and being taught that, the we behave is acceptable behavior. I think we as adults should live better examples. Monkey see, monkey do. So to speak. I heard one time that if one does something for 20 days, it becomes a habit. Forgive me if I offended anyone, or was out of line. This is just my observations. Happy new year all!
Fun4Me reply :
I spoke about this in another thread. Perception is reality for our youth. If we do things in a way that makes it seem normal to do, our youth will have no reason to assume any different.
You have a great point OP. Whether it's holding a 4 pound fish vertical by it's jaw only because it could never possibly hurt it, casually flipping a fish back like it's a game, or promoting the sport itself, we are all responsible for how it turns out for future generations IMO.
lonnie g reply :
On 1/1/2017 at 6:09 AM, Columbia Craw said:Your argument or view could be presented to address youth football, little league baseball, motocross and so on. In every sport including outdoor sports, where there is some form of competition, sponsors will seek to capitolize it to sell product. It's a reality you cannot escape.
Poor behavior, corrupt behavior, lack or integrity, the absence of common courtesy, lack of sportsmanship is found everywhere. I am accountable for my behavior, teaching my children and grandchildren proper values and modeling those behaviors consistently. "A good name is to be valued more than fine gold." I agree with you that there is plenty of room for improvement and sending a better message. WELCOME to BR !!!
Doug
my dad told me a man is only as good as his word . be respectful. appreciate others. always try to help others. my hero!! hang in there I see a lot of young kids loving the sport and admiring the help they receive. some times we are just teachers. be a good one. happy new year my friend tight lines lonnie
shimmy reply :
I like the passion you have against smoking and trying to make a stand. Nevertheless, to piggyback off of A-jay, focusing on parenting is more important than anything discussed here. I am no better than anyone else and am not trying to become too preachy here, but I have never smoked or had a drink of alcohol in my life. Didn't matter if commercials, advertisements, or peers tried to influence me since I learned what I needed from parents who taught me about keeping my body healthier and took an active interest in teaching me with their words AND example. Like Glenn pointed out, there are bad apples in every profession, but one of the reasons I love this sport is because of the amazing people I have fished with and the integrity they provided.
Scarborough817 reply :
Okay this may be a little harsh but just hear me out. At the end of the day your kids are going to see things, it is how you talk to them about it that matters, just sending them on their way is the issue or not caring at all. One of the main issues i see is there doesn't seem to be any actual parenting going on anymore, because it's easier to give the kid a phone or distract them or hide things instead of taking the time to actually parent them. Yes i understand that kids are going to see things you may not like and you may not be able to do anything about it, but why are you not actively talking to your kids, seeing if they have questions, paying attention to what they're doing, who they're hanging out with. Do you know why? because it's hard work being a parent and a lot of people have gotten lazy. where if you take the time to talk to your kids and take an active roll in their lives and then teaching them values based on your experience maybe they'll learn. But sometimes kids have to make mistakes too and honestly sheltering them from the world doesn't do that. I'm sick of people trying to hide everything that they deem "offensive" or "dangerous" the world doesn't conform to you, money is the biggest factor in anything if someone pays for an ad in a magazine or on tv then they have earned that right to have it there. kids need to learn about drinking and smoking regardless of how unhealthy it is and it's you're responsibility as a parent to talk to them about it. so don't blame B.A.S.S for allowing someone to have an ad, because they paid for it to be there the product is legal it exists in the world. Hiding it from them does nothing, heck maybe it makes them more curious about what it is and if they should try it. giving your kids knowledge is more important than anything else.
you also need to seriously look at who the target audience is. most people watching a tournament on tv or reading bassmaster magazine are of legal age. that means that the advertisers who place ads are going to think about what these people like, wouldn't you like a cold beer after fishing all day? i would and i'm an adult so i'll have one. i know this is a big rant, but seriously guys why does everything have to be censored? is it that big a deal? maybe my way of thinking is a little old school but this is how i was raised and i don't think it's unreasonable to actually parent.
frogflogger reply :
Decades ago Jason Lucas was upset about money influencing bass fishing and its coverage - man he would be in a spin these days. I think for the most part guys try to do the right thing but if you watch an angler on tv or on the lake or in your boat you soon learn what kind of a man or woman they are - When I see bass handled roughly - boats driven thoughtlessly - rude behavior - etc.
I don't want them in my boat. And as a man once said perhaps they should try another sport.
thirtysixit reply :
Tobacco and alcohol are apart of our culture and should not be made illicit anymore than they already have been. I for one enjoy my chew and my brew. I don't believe sheltering kids is the answer. The world is going to make contact with them one way or another. My kids are going to be ready for that. Not living in some fantasy world primed to have their lives wrecked by reality.
Snipe Hunter reply :
I grew up on the west coast going to the Camel GT road races, watching Winston Cup on TV and fishing the Redman tournaments. Nothing has really changed except BASS has more competition now. Everybody has more competition now. There's more advertisers, more tackle companies all trying to get top billing. BASS is a business, just like any other. If it weren't, it would have gone the way of the dodo a long time ago. I don't drink, I no longer smoke or dip and those were my choices. I hope I raised my kids to make the right choices. Sure, there's jerks, just like any other sport or group. There's jerks at church too. That's life. I'm ok with it.
Now, if if we could get pro football players to quit dancing every time the camera is on them and get Major League Baseball to either let Pete Rose in the hall of fame or stop advertising Fantasy Baseball Gambling sites throughout the whole game we might be on to something.
I think what BASS has done for the sport, particularly their roll in making catch and release as normal as breathing is a pretty significant accomplishment. Business is business. We just need to teach our kids to make sound decisions. Whether they do or not is up to them.
Mosster47 reply :
So I would assume you dont watch the NFL, NBA, MLB, NHL, NCAA sports, or anything sports related really?
The NFL commercial reel is beer, car, beer, pizza, erectile dysfunction, hard liquor, insurance, chips.
Like every business professor will tell you, if something is overly marketed you don't need it. So, you get alcohol, insurance, food that has zero nutrition, a more expensive vehicle, etc. Erectile dysfunction commercials kill me for two reasons; no man has ever had a performance problem sober with a model, and no one has a bathtub on their porch, let alone two.
If we drank in moderation, ate nutritious foods, strived to stay attractive for our significant other, and lived within our means we would be western Europe. This past election told us (sort of) that we want to go the opposite direction.
the reel ess reply :
On 1/1/2017 at 8:41 AM, bassin73 said:Thanks for the feedback folks. I think that where there's a will, there is a way. People of low esteem, and lack of integrity will try anyway possible to gain an edge, even if that means hiring others to aid in winning big money. As in the instance of those two anglers who stuffed split shot down bass's throat for weight. Or have others fish off limit body's of water for them before tournaments. I believe Rick brought to light the fact that anglers that have big sponsorship backing have an unfair advantage over those who don't. I remember when homework, talent, and confidence won tournaments. With today's electronics, gadgets, and GPS locators, it's not really fair competition for those less fortunate that don't have big money backing. I fished tournaments where it took sweat, determination, and talent to win. But in those days when I won or lost, I felt good about it, and slept well. Now I fish for fun. It's better that way.
I've never wanted to fish for any reason other than my own recreation.
On 1/5/2017 at 12:01 PM, Mosster47 said:The NFL commercial reel is beer, car, beer, pizza, erectile dysfunction, hard liquor, insurance, chips.
It's either ads for something to treat ED or ads for the things that cause ED. 
That's quite a racket.
bassinhole reply :
On 1/1/2017 at 5:24 AM, A-Jay said:One doesn't lose integrity ~ it's given away.
A-Jay
I'd say it's abandoned. It's an active choice to turn your back on integrity.
Choporoz reply :
Agreed. Now, get off of my lawn.....sorry..couldn't resist.....but I do think that with just a few small tweaks, the letter could be written by a 'seasoned' person about nearly any sport or activity enjoyed by younger generations...in any era.
Not to say the concerns aren't valid...or that I disagree...just that kids these days just don't get it
bassin73 reply :
O K, I started this session last week end, and have had many reply back with there thoughts, and 2 cents worth. This will be my last post concerning my first. I am 61 years old, have 2 grown children, and did indeed raise them according to the Christian ways the bible instructs us too, as parents should. They grew up knowing right from wrong, and have become responsible adults, thanks be to God. When I wrote the topic of this discussion it was about the image portrayed by professional bass fishermen representing in my opinion the greatest sport there is. Period. I said then and repeat again I am a realist, and know I cannot change anyone's ideals, nor would want to. I just care about the morality of our sport we love, and those that are following in our foot prints. I think we all could, and should, be more cognoscente about who's watching and listening to us. Thanks folks, have a great life.
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